Originally Posted by steelerfan
And they fired a 61-year employee over the goddamned telephone.But they continue to pay for lawyer fees for the 2 people that it is known did know something and lied about it, but crucify 2 people who they admit they don't know what they knew
I could have lived with them suspending him until they knew more than they do. That, to me, would have been justified.
And Mike McQueary, the man who was most "morally responsible" as he claims to have witnessed the assault, has had "no change" in his status with the program is even more insane.
Obviously, the university is only concerned with "protecting their brand". Well, if this Gestapo technique of dealing punishments without all of the facts or without due process is how this school wants to handle itself, I'm not interested in their motherfucking brand.
Fuck them all.
And, let me be clear, if Paterno is later found to have had full knowledge of what was accused, and he willfully participated in a coverup, I well agree that the firing was (eventually) justified. However, the BOT has stated that they don't particularly know anymore than we do. In my opinion, that is grounds for a suspension (at most) until more details come out.
I'm not going to pretend Coach Paterno is completely, and undeniably, innocent. I don't know. However, at this point, it can't be said that he isn't. That is where my problem is. Firing him without "all the facts" is unacceptable.
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Go Irish!
Someone please help steelerfan back away from the ledge.
http://sports.yahoo.com/top/news?slug=ycn-10404639
An article asking just that, why does Mike McQueary have a job.
I agree with you in regards to Mike McQueary, you fire Paterno, you fire McQueary. He was a big boy when this happened, although that can be questioned as he had to go to daddy to find out what to do. Worried about his job more than the child he witnessed being (insert whatever you want here.)
Had he done what I consider most people in the same situation would have done, call the police, then we would not...
A) been having this issue today
B) a good chance a bunch of young males would not have had to deal with sexual advances from Sandusky
That said this has been a really strange case and years before this could have all been avoided. This is some Dateline stuff with the DA who refused to charge Sandusky going missing, presumed dead but still no body.
Unfortunately there were plenty of balls dropped and I really can't call this a witch hunt. People in a position of power refused to accept it, just because is the old ball coach does not recuse him from any responsibility. I think Mike will end up leaving Penn State because the fans will never let him live this down.
Now to throw the topic back to Sandusky, as mentioned yesterday, things are only going to get worse in regards to what he did and how second mile is involved.
Mike Madden actually wrote a piece on Sandusky back in April in regards to everything coming out right now.
He comments today: Don’t believe this can get worse? Give it 72 hrs. People really digging into Second Mile. Even more shocking revelation is ahead.
I too find it strange that they fired Joe, and their explanation is "they don't know more than we do". I'm wondering if that is some cover-up and they legally can't say more. I'm thinking they would have to have more facts to be able to come to a unanimous verdict. It sounds like they meet at 10pm and with-in a few mins had a 100% verdict. This usually wouldn't happen if they didn't have more information to base their decision.
I also find it strange that they make a big deal out of Coach Paterno yet the guy that could have "really" done something at that time still has a job. Coach reportedly didn't know about the event until the next day. The problem had already occurred.
As far as all the people/fans inside of Penn St wanting Joe back, I can understand their point of view but I think it's lost b/c the crimes reportedly committed are MUCH greater than football.
I attended and graduated Texas A&M University. When I was a Jr., Aggie Bonfire collapsed killing 12 students. When it happened there were students outraged that we weren't going to have Bonfire. They could not wrap their head around the REAL problem that 12 people had been killed. I will admit I was one of them. I thought we should have still had it. The University thought of the bigger picture, which now 13 years removed I can 100% agree with. Bonfire is cool and all but not if it means people get hurt OR die.
Joe Paterno will always be mentioned in terms of a great coach that coached for a LONG time but that isn't the big picture here. The university is trying to get this scandal cleaned up and move on. The stuff that is being reported to happen to these KIDS is SICK. If Joe Paterno could have done something to help prevent them from continuing to happen HE SHOULD HAVE. From the sounds of it he was above the law, like a super icon, therefore he should have done more than the lowly grad student. He should have cared, he should have reported it to authorities, so should have the other people involved.
I have kids, I can't imagine what I would want to do to someone if they did or attempted that stuff to one of my kids. I would be outraged if someone like Joe didn't step in to help it from happening again. Then to hear people are upset b/c he can't coach a game? Think about how it has and will affect these kids for the rest of their life? Joe Paterno's Coaching legacy will not be hindered once the storm blows over.
http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/ind...medium=twitter
"thanks Eric for link"
Last edited by psusnoop; 11-10-2011 at 08:45 AM.
There is a ton of circumstantial evidence that hints that this runs way deeper than anyone wants to even think about - that this was known, tolerated, and even abetted for over a decade. Reports that Sandusky admitted his act to a victims' mother but still got off once before; the fact that the witness/potential whistleblower shut up and then got promoted; the fact that Sandusky retired out of the blue despite media belief that he was JoePa's heir apparent at the time; that he had to agree not to bring kids around campus, but was allowed to anyway; the fact that the DA investigating the case disappeared under mysterious circumstances. The longer light is shed on this issue, the more it looks like there is a lot more waiting to come out.
Joe Paterno ran that town. Even last night he had so much support that there were riots in Happy Valley. I truly hope that Occam's razor doesn't apply here and this is just an unfortunate set of coincidences. But it seems like this pedophile's sick practice was known and covered up for a sickeningly long time because JoePa/Penn State thought it could.
Last edited by Oneback; 11-10-2011 at 09:04 AM.
its all bull, Admins always take the easy way out and just fire people.
You guys can stop the whole Penn State got rid of the DA thing. He went missing in 2005, 7 years after he dropped the charges on Sandusky. I know Penn State football is big around here but he did prosecute a lot of other big time criminals including a number of large drug busts and dealers. And yes I've lived in this town long enough to follow his case and my cousin was his long time girlfriend.
This is a pretty good article. Kind of contradicts a little bit of what everyone is praising Herbsteit for saying last night. He stated that this isn't about Football and isn't the time to celebrate Joe's career. But who made it about football, the media. All stories are about Joe, the media is lined up at his house. Why aren't they camping out at Sandusky's house since he's the one that actually committed the crime.
Quick. Don't think. Who is prime suspect number one in the scandal involving Penn State right now? If you were to read 95% of the stories put out by the national media since Sunday or gone on Twitter or (from stories I've heard) spoken with any of the national talking heads trudging through State College right now, they would tell you that the villain in this horrible, horrible incident is Joe Paterno.
Tell me, when was the last time you heard Jerry Sandusky's name? When was the last time you heard about the charges brought against athletic director Tim Curley and former VP of Business and Finance Gary Schultz? I'm fairly certain that these three men have been the ones charged with crimes in this on-going investigation.
Some of you may know me as the former sports editor at Onward State. I started writing my junior year and became fascinated with journalism. I found it exciting to go fact-finding. To be able to relate a story to the masses was an exhilarating feeling. But over the past five days, my love for the craft has dwindled. I realized a whole lot about the business of journalism after reading the stories of the New York Times, Washington Post and some of the most respected news blogs in the nation. And yes, I said BUSINESS of journalism. Because journalism has now gone past its roots. It is no longer about telling a story. It is making up the story that will sell the most papers, get the most pageviews, accrue the most Twitter followers and make the most money in the end. What will sell a story? Will a story about a no-name like Gary Schultz sell papers? Will a story about Tim Curley get an author noticed? Even a story on Graham Spanier, who has a bit more national prominence, won't bring in readership. Like I said, when was the last big story on the perpetrator, Jerry Sandusky, written?
You know what will sell, though? The downfall of an American icon. A man who has spent 60 years building the reputation of a football program, a university, a whole town doing the "legal minimum" but not his "moral duty" being pummeled both in writing and by cameras and microphones everywhere he goes. I can guarantee you, if Penn State was coached by some no-name, the stories churned out would be about the victims and the men who perpetrated these crimes.
I'm not here to defend what Joe Paterno did or did not do. That has been talked about in many other posts and in many other comment boards. But I hope to convey some of the things the media has lost sight of over the past week by dissecting different allegations they have brought up. Please follow along below.
1. "JOE PATERNO NEVER FOLLOWED UP ON THESE CHARGES" or "JOE PATERNO SENT THIS UP THE CHAIN OF COMMAND AND WASHED HIS HANDS OF THE SITUATION"
This was the first of many "facts" that was made up by the national media. If you've read the Grand Jury testimony, I commend you. Now go read it again. Pick out the part where it says Joe never went back to Tim Curley or Gary Schultz to see what was happening in the process. It never says he did, but it sure as hell doesn't say he didn't either.
2. "JOE PATERNO KNEW ABOUT (OR HAD TO HAVE KNOWN ABOUT) THE '98 ALLEGATIONS AND STILL LET A CHILD RAPIST AROUND HIS TEAM"
Once again, go back to the testimony. Nowhere does it say that Joe knew about any allegations before 2002. In fact, one person I know sat in a class on Tuesday and listened to Patriot-News reporter Sara Garim, who has been the point person for all of the investigative stories dealing with this case, say that Joe testified he did not know about the 1998 allegations, going as far to say: "I think it's fair to say, as far as you could possibly say, that Joe Paterno didn't know about [the 1998 investigation]." If some real investigating had been done by the national media, they'd probably know that too.
3. "JOE PATERNO ENABLED A CHILD RAPIST"
Use your words better. I understand your need for emphasis to sell, but using the word enable makes it seem like Joe hand-picked the boys for Sandusky.
4. "JOE PATERNO IS TIM CURLEY'S/GRAHAM SPANIER'S BOSS" or "JOE PATERNO RUNS PENN STATE UNIVERSITY"
Many columnists have brought this point up in regards to Joe pushing Mike McQueary's information up the chain of command. Since Joe runs everything there, he is to blame. He is the head honcho. Find other columns these men and women have written. Look at their Twitter feeds over the past year. Look at them from the past week! They'll tell you that he doesn't even run his own football team anymore and hasn't for 15 years. For an 84-year old man to not be able to look over 85 players and a coaching staff, but yet control 44,000 students on the University Park campus, plus the administrators, plus the faculty, plus the staff and handle day-to-day operations of a university seems unimaginable to me. But you know, whatever argument works at the time, guys.
When Joe Paterno released his retirement statement Wednesday morning, he said that he would finish out the year coaching. A large majority of the people I follow on Twitter and TV commentators said it wasn't enough and were adamant about it. He needed to resign now or be fired by the Board of Trustees. A huge, HUGE backlash for a man who just wants to coach four or five more football games. Later on in the afternoon, Ben Jones of Black Shoes Diaries and StateCollege.com tweeted that he was told Jerry Sandusky was spotted working out in a gym with his wife this morning. The reaction? "Wow." "Geez." "Welp."
This story has become so twisted that negative emotion about a man coaching a football game exceeds that of an accused chlid molester walking the streets of the town where he committed his crimes by what it seems to be millions of percent. By focusing on the tear-down of the most notable figure involved in the case, people have become numb to the man who did the most damage and those who have been accused to covering up that damage.
Sensationalizing a story led to Joe Paterno being the first man to lose his job in this fiasco. And while I have no qualms about saying Joe had to step down after this mess blew up, when looking back at the facts, is he really the first man who should have gotten the axe?
Now, since the media has completed Objective One: Bring Down JoePa, I hope they do what I always believed journalists did: find the facts, dig through the sources and tell the people the real stories happening in State College.
Really? Rioting? Really?
P.S. that dude that took the street sign really biffed it
Link, Eric?
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Call it what you will, rioting may not be the right term, but the storm troopers were called out to regulate the scene.Really? Rioting? Really?
P.S. that dude that took the street sign really biffed it
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/blackb...tml?id=1085201
Shit was set on fire, vehicles were tipped over...that's pretty much rioting.
Thanks.
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I'm all for it. Burn the campus. Starting with the administration building.
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I'm confused. Maybe we all see things differently.
Children were molested. A 10 year old boy was raped.
All under Joe's watch. All he did was report it to his boss.
How are the admin's taking the easy way out?
I'm watching the news and people are comparing this to a lot of different things (Catholic church, boy scout leaders, etc...) ....my wife is a teacher here in Bryan with the public schools. Bryans ISD. IF she sees what she even remotely thinks could be abuse she is to contact her boss AND CPS, which also involves the police.
IF she fails to do this and then later is fired, how would the admins being taking the easy way out?
Maybe it's a mistake for engaging you in conversation, but I just fail to see your point of view.
If you think they did the easy thing? What sir would be the better course of action?
The problem here is that just like with all the NCAA violations, the coach always knows or at the very least heard something. I'm a just a middle manager in my company and word gets back to me when one of my employees takes a piss on another company's floor. This issue is a little larger in scale and I refuse to believe Joe Pa had zero knowledge of any incidents involving one of his trusted coaches. I imagine being pretty deeply ingrained in the culture of Penn State and the face of the program results in everyone going to him when there are any issues. I highly doubt the story waited four years to get to Joe Pa when there was an ongoing investigation in the late 90's. I assure you the first person any investigator went to was Joe Pa, or at the very least school officials which undoubtedly that news would filter to Joe Pa.
I'm not accusing Joe Pa of anything other than having some sort of knowledge after the fact once the incident was brought to the schools attention and being that this incident looks to be the leading cause of Sandusky's "retirement" in 1999 I imagine the school/Joe Pa knew before 2002.
As to why the media is at Joe Pa's doorstep and not Sandusky's, the Jerry Sandusky story has already been written there's not much more to say there, the larger story now is the fact that Penn State covered it up for so long. As they say the consequences of a failed cover-up are always greater than the consequences of the original crime.
Last edited by Oneback; 11-10-2011 at 10:34 AM.
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