You Gotta Hear This (Music Thread)

**JBHuskers** · 06-21-2010, 02:12 PM

Yeah my first listen to the new Drake album was on a Wedesday the day after release and I was tired as hell at work, so the slower jams at the beginning weren't doing a good job of keeping me awake....have given it a good three or four listens to since.....amazing. Can't wait to hear the new Eminem album....been impressed with Rihanna lately too, and if it wasn't for my DJ'ing gig, I probably wouldn't have ever heard some of the tracks on her new album.

**Kingpin32** · 06-21-2010, 02:15 PM

Originally Posted by JBHuskers

Yeah my first listen to the new Drake album was on a Wedesday the day after release and I was tired as hell at work, so the slower jams at the beginning weren't doing a good job of keeping me awake....have given it a good three or four listens to since.....amazing. Can't wait to hear the new Eminem album....been impressed with Rihanna lately too, and if it wasn't for my DJ'ing gig, I probably wouldn't have ever heard some of the tracks on her new album.

I didn't know you were a DJ, but the Eminem album will definitely impress you, I'm planning on buying that and Drake's CD this weekend, hopefully its still 9.99 lol.

**JBHuskers** · 06-21-2010, 03:20 PM

Originally Posted by Kingpin32

I didn't know you were a DJ, but the Eminem album will definitely impress you, I'm planning on buying that and Drake's CD this weekend, hopefully its still 9.99 lol.

Well a DJ by title...

it's in a strip club

**Deuce** · 06-21-2010, 05:39 PM

I know Mors has been losing sleep over this but here is the science behind why vinyl sounds better than cd.

Why does it sound better?

Some people have a bit of an obsession with vinyl. Maybe it's just because they think it is vintage and therefore cool. Maybe they are just old school and not want to move on. Maybe they are complete audiophiles and love their music that much.

Most people understand that vinyl sounds better then CD's and other modern digital equivalents such as DVD, mp3 and other software based recordings. However, the actual reasons why it sounds better are not so widely known. At first glance it might seem a bit complicated but it is in fact quite simple.

It basically comes down to the difference between analog and digital signals. Analog, by definition, is a continuously variable signal. This means that changes in frequency are represented by a smooth wave. Basically, this means that a change in frequency between two values will occur by moving through the complete range in between them. The result accurately sounds out every tiny change.

Digital Encoding

In order to encode a similar signal onto digital media such as a CD or DVD, a conversion from analog to digital is required. No matter how good the conversion is, there will always be losses which occur through the transition. Technology may get better and better, reducing these losses but it is effectively impossible (at least in modern times), to reproduce an analog signal exactly with digital data. Imagine if you were told to sing from as low as you can up to as high you can using only three different tones. You would sing low, a medium note and then high. This is a very extreme example, but shows what we mean by discrete steps. Improved technology would allow you to change frequencies more often in the same period, say 5 times. Now you have a closer reproduction of the original smooth variant, but it still isn't great.

Given that the human ear works at a higher resolution than our current technology, a trained ear can easily hear the difference between an analog and even a high resolution digital signal. This is exactly the reason why so many people prefer vinyl records to their digital equivalents.. We haven't even got to the point of software level encoding. MP3's and other files incur yet another layer of losses which further reduces the quality in audio. Try listening to a vinyl record after an equivalent mp3 and if you can't tell the difference, there might be something wrong with you! Just kidding, but there is a very clear difference. There are certain audio formats such as FLAC, which are higher resolution digital encodings, but this is when compared with a CD track. In other words, it is still digital, and still does not replicate the sound in the same way as a live performance or a vinyl record.

Now you know why a vinyl record is that much better then any digital equivalent from a scientific front. I didn't even mention their inherited greatness just for being a vintage item!

**morsdraconis** · 06-21-2010, 06:58 PM

Yes, but you forgot to mention that anything past 20,000 hertz is beyond the human ability to notice ANY difference at all in sound quality.

This statment is complete bullshit:

Given that the human ear works at a higher resolution than our current technology, a trained ear can easily hear the difference between an analog and even a high resolution digital signal.

You may THINK there is a difference, but it is simply your mind playing tricks on you. The only difference in the mastering of the medium. There are shitty sounding masters of vinyls just like there are shitty sounding masters of CDs. The output of CDs and vinyls both go beyond the 20khz of human hearing so unless you are superhuman, you probably can't even hear anything above 17 or 18 khz.

Sure, it's great that you have the nostalgia interest in them and all, but beyond that, it's really no different than getting the 320 kbps mp3 or even the FLAC format (which is ridiculous in and of itself) of a well mastered CD.

**Deuce** · 06-21-2010, 07:07 PM

Originally Posted by morsdraconis

Yes, but you forgot to mention that anything past 20,000 hertz is beyond the human ability to notice ANY difference at all in sound quality.

This statment is complete bullshit:

You may THINK there is a difference, but it is simply your mind playing tricks on you. The only difference in the mastering of the medium. There are shitty sounding masters of vinyls just like there are shitty sounding masters of CDs. The output of CDs and vinyls both go beyond the 20khz of human hearing so unless you are superhuman, you probably can't even hear anything above 17 or 18 khz.

Sure, it's great that you have the nostalgia interest in them and all, but beyond that, it's really no different than getting the 320 kbps mp3 or even the FLAC format (which is ridiculous in and of itself) of a well mastered CD.

You crack me up...you'll argue with a rock. Its simple science. Any digital recording comes from an analog source. Therefore analog is better than digital. Its a fact. This isn't preference.

**morsdraconis** · 06-21-2010, 07:10 PM

Originally Posted by Deuce

You crack me up...you'll argue with a rock. Its simple science. Any digital recording comes from an analog source. Therefore analog is better than digital. Its a fact. This isn't preference.

But the difference is IMPOSSIBLE TO HEAR WITH THE HUMAN EAR. IT'S SIMPLE SCIENCE.

You CAN'T POSSIBLY hear past 20mhz of which BOTH mediums surpass in sound quality and projection.

**Deuce** · 06-21-2010, 07:13 PM

Originally Posted by morsdraconis

But the difference is IMPOSSIBLE TO HEAR WITH THE HUMAN EAR. IT'S SIMPLE SCIENCE.

You CAN'T POSSIBLY hear past 20mhz of which BOTH mediums surpass in sound quality and projection.

Ok dude. ...but you're still wrong.

**morsdraconis** · 06-21-2010, 07:16 PM

Originally Posted by Deuce

Ok dude.

Dude, like I said. It's great you have the nostalgia for vinyl, but to claim that it's better than digital media just isn't correct. Not to mention all the things you have to go through to make sure that the vinyl records don't wear out because of repeated use.

**Deuce** · 06-21-2010, 07:20 PM

Originally Posted by morsdraconis

Dude, like I said. It's great you have the nostalgia for vinyl, but to claim that it's better than digital media just isn't correct. Not to mention all the things you have to go through to make sure that the vinyl records don't wear out because of repeated use.

Maybe you should do some more reading on the subject. You're completely ignorant on this particular subject. Find an article that states digital is equal to analog. When you do I'll admit I was wrong.

**morsdraconis** · 06-21-2010, 08:00 PM

Originally Posted by Deuce

Maybe you should do some more reading on the subject. You're completely ignorant on this particular subject. Find an article that states digital is equal to analog. When you do I'll admit I was wrong.

I don't care about you admitting that you are wrong or not. I started by simply stating that in my opinion, vinyl is a substandard medium to listen to music on. Then you had to get all high and mighty about proving me wrong (showing something that has no scientific merit as there is no source quoted for your above information) which you still haven't done because you refuse to acknowledge the fact that the human ear drum cannot process any form of sound beyond 20mhz thus making your argument moot. The 22.5 mhz (digital) and 24 mhz (analog) produced by the various mediums cannot possibly be determined in a wide enough breath of tests that there is not any scientific study showing in favor in one way or another that it's even possible to tell the difference between the two formats, much less enough to know that one is better than the other.

Analog vs Digital Recording

But, whatever man. You like vinyl and think it's superior. Good for you.

**Deuce** · 06-21-2010, 08:14 PM

Ok guy, you butt into a conversation and make the below statement. I would say most people who read the below statement would agree that it sounds like your being confrontational. ...and then you end the statement with "Jesus Christ"

Originally Posted by morsdraconis

There's no freakin' way I'd pay $150 to play substandard forms of music. Jesus christ...

And then you call me high and mighty b/c you say vinyl is substandard and I prove you wrong? Dude, if you can't take someone proving you wrong maybe you should mind your own business.

Originally Posted by morsdraconis

I don't care about you admitting that you are wrong or not. I started by simply stating that in my opinion, vinyl is a substandard medium to listen to music on. Then you had to get all high and mighty about proving me wrong (showing something that has no scientific merit as there is no source quoted for your above information) which you still haven't done because you refuse to acknowledge the fact that the human ear drum cannot process any form of sound beyond 20mhz thus making your argument moot. The 22.5 mhz (digital) and 24 mhz (analog) produced by the various mediums cannot possibly be determined in a wide enough breath of tests that there is not any scientific study showing in favor in one way or another that it's even possible to tell the difference between the two formats, much less enough to know that one is better than the other.

Analog vs Digital Recording

But, whatever man. You like vinyl and think it's superior. Good for you.

Enough...moving on. You think vinyl is substandard I disagree.

**morsdraconis** · 06-21-2010, 09:04 PM

Originally Posted by Deuce

Ok guy, you butt into a conversation and make the below statement. I would say most people who read the below statement would agree that it sounds like your being confrontational. ...and then you end the statement with "Jesus Christ"

Actually, I wasn't butting into any conversation. The jesus christ was about paying $150 for a record player, which is nuts btw, when you can get a perfectly good old one at most any garage sale/yard sale or find a fairly decent one on ebay for $20 or 30 dollars (plus retarded high shipping of course).

But I agree. Carry on. Neither of us shall be swayed (just like most all internet debates

).

I will say, I'd love to hear some old jazz/blues music on a good record player. That would most definitely fit the style of music and would probably be quite an experience.

**Deuce** · 06-21-2010, 09:18 PM

Originally Posted by morsdraconis

I will say, I'd love to hear some old jazz/blues music on a good record player. That would most definitely fit the style of music and would probably be quite an experience.

This is something we do agree on...that's the only way I like the blues/jazz. One of the first albums I bought was Miles Davis "Sketches of Spain". Gorgeous.

**oweb26** · 06-21-2010, 09:44 PM

Originally Posted by morsdraconis

I don't care about you admitting that you are wrong or not. I started by simply stating that in my opinion, vinyl is a substandard medium to listen to music on. Then you had to get all high and mighty about proving me wrong (showing something that has no scientific merit as there is no source quoted for your above information) which you still haven't done because you refuse to acknowledge the fact that the human ear drum cannot process any form of sound beyond 20mhz thus making your argument moot. The 22.5 mhz (digital) and 24 mhz (analog) produced by the various mediums cannot possibly be determined in a wide enough breath of tests that there is not any scientific study showing in favor in one way or another that it's even possible to tell the difference between the two formats, much less enough to know that one is better than the other.

Analog vs Digital Recording

But, whatever man. You like vinyl and think it's superior. Good for you.

I cant quote wikipedia for my masters degree dammit so you cant quote it here......not a valid enough source, care to try again. LOL