Downloaded the demo... and completely forgot about it. Man how times change. I will have to try this out later tonight when I get a chance.
Downloaded the demo... and completely forgot about it. Man how times change. I will have to try this out later tonight when I get a chance.
Yep.Originally Posted by morsdraconis
Same here man. I don't give a damn about Online Franchise, I don't give a damn about plain Online, I don't give a damn about Superstar, all I care about is Franchise. Until single player Franchise is the best thing since sliced bread, I'm not going to give a damn about Madden.And until you guys rave about a franchise mode I will continue to pass on Madden.
Yeah, I found that out this morning. Playing on All Pro was a joke. Maybe I'll give the demo another try with All Madden, but it'll depend. I just can't get any interest in Madden. I didn't even finish my one demo game this morning, I quit out after I scored another touchdown to begin the third quarter.
All Madden has always been the answer. Especially playing against a user. Don't know how people play on anything else honestly.
I have to say, I'm loving what I've played so far. Zone defense is much better. Man defense is about the same, but it didn't need changed. There's no route mirroring like there is in NCAA '13. Game play is so smooth...it's right on level with Madden/NCAA during the PS2 days. User catching feels really nice. User defense is much better than in NCAA '13 and is more than playable. The pass rush seems to be a good bit better, too. I've been able to get fairly consistent pressure bringing just 3 or 4 which never happened on '12.
The smoothness is what jumps out at me. If it plays that way online, I'll be happy. The Redskins have a really nice offensive playbook.
Pretty impressed so far.
Nothing like putting the ball over a trailing defender down the middle. That's swatted down last year majority of the time.
Oh and I've been tripped or knocked off balance 3 times now when running into a lineman or running over one when they have fallen.
As I say that Bradshaw for the CPU took the handoff with his Center falling ahead, then trying to get back up...while Bradshaw was running it upended him like it would if you tried to run up someone's back while getting up.
Other things worth note as well but I'll wait until I'm on the computer
I can see what everyone was talking about at E3 and online about the Physics...my goodness
Very impressed
Ah shit these mfers snuck in the "guess a play" feature again
Damn it
New York just called a Pass play. I chose "run" on Defense and had about 6 people in the backfield for the easy sack...want blitzing either
Last edited by skipwondah33; 08-14-2012 at 08:49 PM.
Played 1 game on all-pro and wasn't impressed at all. I saw some "odd" issues with the physics engine that didn't look natural. I also called for a fair catch on a punt and they said I muffed it but the ball was never even bobbled and the CPU just stood there so that could easily be abused. I still feel that user controlling defenders isn't very fun/responsive.
The game looks very sharp graphically.
I'll give all-madden a try but nothing just jumped out to me saying you gotta drop $60 on this game.
I was only able to play two games tonight after my son's game and the 75 minute download and install. I have to admit I was a bit disappointed. The Infinity engine was not as big a difference as I thought. It's subtle. It will look like a bigger change compared to NCAA because I felt their tackling system is limited. Madden 12's tackling system is better than NCAA 13 imo.
Anyways, I played with the 49ers and then with the Giants. Lost the first game and won the second on All-Pro.
Graphics and Presentation are good. I like the colour of the grass as the old textures were too unbalanced in M12. The camera is a LOT better in M13 as its much closer on running plays. The commentary is excellent. Jim Nantz is a huge upgrade and Phil Simms is really good. The two recorded their audio together and it works great. Overall the presentation is really good EXCEPT for the awful, awful, awful replay system. On pretty much every passing play they have that stupid spline replay system where they show an angle for 1.5 seconds and then keep switching. It's nothing you see on TV and brings nothing to the table. What is the point? I'd rather them focus on the WR/CB battle the whole time. Switching all over the place is just useless and I hate it in NCAA Football too. This was done much better in M12. I wish they would go back. The game seems to look more cartoony than last year. Maybe the colours are too bright not sure. The game does play smooth. Much like last year Madden 12 seems to be done better on the PS3 than NCAA 12 which seems more like a port.
The running game was fine although I still think the juke is a little too weak. I love the juke move and after it was neutered last year I was hoping the special moves would be a little better. It's not bad but I still miss my old powerful juke. I wish we had a slider for special moves to tune it the way we want. The Infinity engine shows some nice broken tackles at times but I was expected to be wowed by this engine and I saw it as subtle. I guess I was expecting more.
The passing game with the new trajectories is good. I really like the way you can time your routes. Madden also features a slower ball speed in the air and tighter/heavier player movement that lets you feel you can actually make plays on pass defense.
I wish Ask Madden was like NCAA where you could cycle through a selection of plays and not just three. Still no special teams sliders separate for human and cpu. I don't get it. It was confusing when they moved the names of the plays to the bottom from the top. Not a big deal but it threw me off initially.
Overall I think M13 will be a nice improvement over M12 other than the stupid, stupid replay angles but I was underwhelmed. I guess I need to play it more but I was hoping to be blown away. My expectations were probably too high.
My only gripe at the moment is the "guess a play" right now. Hated in NCAA and didnt like in Madden in past versions few years back.
I will enjoy it more than NCAA but that was expected
Finally got in two games.
I. Seahawks (me) 0 Redskins 3 All Pro / slow
II. 49ers (me) 10 Giants 0 All Pro / slow
The Good:
1. The visuals are truly beautiful... the game looks spectacular
2. Commentators.... at this point I am surpirisingly impressed
3. The crowd noise on BIG PLAYS
4. Field textures/lighting... excellent
5. Stat overlays are really well done
The Bad:
1. running lanes/speed of the cpu LB's
2. dropped passes and receivers not looking at the ball
3. wrong commentary at the wrong time (I missed a FG and Simms said I tied up the game and it was clutch, etc.)
4. slip and slide physics... there are just a lot of weird, unnatural movements after the play ends
5. darkenss of the players on long passes... which team am I passing too???
6. cpu passing is lights out good while the RB struggles somewhat
Indifferent:
1. Infinity... overall impact is minimal
2. weight and size still don't impact movement
3. camera distance on pass plays... still not sure how I feel on it
4. game intro... neat now... will get repetitive quick
Overall, the game plays pretty much as I expected. It's Madden 12 gameplay with minimal physics for impacts on players. Now that isn't a bad thing as I actually liked Madden 12 gameplay much better than NCAA 12. Madden's gameplay has improved somewhat and it is the best gameplay of any CURRENT football game offering. It's a decent game of football but I 100% dissagree with the idea that infinity is revolutionary and game changing... it's not; at least not yet anyways. If all things were equal this would be a must buy but as I have posted several times, just too much has been removed from CCM. I will still wait for season pass to make my decision though.
Bring back:
1. custom playbooks
2. editing rosters/equipment/numbers
3. NCAA draft class imports
4. play any game on the schedule
5. change the cpu uniform during CCM
and you win me back as a loyal customer.
Last edited by jaymo76; 08-15-2012 at 12:04 AM.
Nice assessment, jaymo. I haven't played it yet, but I feel that what you've outlined is more than fair.
Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk 2
Totally agree with you Jaymo and especially about Infinity (bolded part). Infinity was a let down for me. This feels like a better Madden 12 but not the revolutionary jump that I was expecting.
I'm not taking my PS3 with me (leaving in about 10 minutes) so I will have to play more this weekend. The human running game disappointed me. I agree with you about a lack of lanes at times. It felt like I had very little outcome on running plays as things got blown up a little too much. This may be realistic in the NFL but it sucks the fun out of a video game if you don't feel you can impact an important part of the game. I need to play around with the special moves more. Still don't think the juke is good enough for guys with 95+ juke rating.
After playing quite a bit of games last night and capturing them to replay over here are my impressions.
First though
Madden is the dominant game I play every version the most of any of the games I own (which are exclusively sports games. I buy Tiger, Madden and typically NCAA..and COD). Still Madden dominates my game playing. I am involved with another community solely for my Madden play in (4) Leagues, numerous tourneys, PUG quarters (PUG tracking system), etc. Needless to say I've played over 700 games easily this past Madden 12 version...which we are currently finishing up 2 seasons before the next version releases.
Now from my background, on to my impressions. Played only on All-Madden difficulty.
Note: Some of these will differ/change once able to play Online. Certain aspects of the game change when playing Online.
Also when I refer to Madden 12, it was also played on strictly All-Madden against other Users Online from my Community, not the CPU or lobby games.
Positives
- Infinity Engine
I definitely notice the impact it has in the Gameplay. Currently in Madden 12 and all other released prior you could take your RB run into the back of your OL with your head down..and nothing would happen other than of course you just keep running into his back at a stand still. Or when you run through a hole with a OL or defender stretched out, you simply ran through them magically without slowing down. Once you found a hole it was simply speed burst through it.
Not anymore. You can't run recklessly through the hole and get through/past OL and Defenders. I can't tell you how many times I specifically tried to run the way you can in Madden 12, only to either get knocked back, fall completely, knocked off balanced or stumble. In each case this happened. It was a beautiful thing to see because the run game last version was entirely too easy since there was no negative result when someone simply ran into their OL. Another thing is that when OL are in the process of getting up and you run into them you will flip over or off of them. I loved seeing that.
When I ran with RB's like Frank Gore and Brandon Jacobs...two relatively Big RB's and they built up steam they almost always fell forward or got the better end of the run. If multiple Defenders hit them from all different angles that changed the outcome...speaking of which I didn't notice ANY animation tackling like in the past. From previous versions a RB could be running full speed only to get completely stopped in his tracks by a Defender in pursuit. Regardless of the runner, if this happens it will be forward progress as the end result.
On one particular run Ahmad Bradshaw carried the ball through the hole and was wrapped up a few yards down field from the side....he fell back onto a defender who was on the ground....never did any part of his body hit the ground, other players thought he was down but he rolled off of the defender planted his hand on the ground and took off for the TD. This was AMAZING to see I kid you not. It all looked natural and was not animation driven. Definitely unlike anything I've seen in previous Maddens.
It effects Defense even, in Madden 12 you could also fire through a Gap grazing OL or your DL without any negative result. Now you will get tripped or knocked off your path. Love that as well. The run game will be more rewarding and more difficult at the same time.
Note: I don't pay attention to the players after the play is over on how they react. On one play I did notice that the player that was tackled waited for the players to peel off of him before he tried to get up which was pretty cool.
- Throwing Trajectories
Another much needed feature that is very obvious and has an impact on Gameplay. I've been able to throw a number of passes that with just the right amount of trajectory found their targets over Defenders heads perfectly. Not every one of them were completed, if the Defender is in position and spots the ball he will make a play on it. Being able to throw every type of route now with different trajectory passes is great. You simply could not throw certain passes in Madden 12 or nearly all of the previous versions. People use to think it was due to super leaping LB's, but it was the trajectory of the ball that was low to begin with that enabled them to get a hand on the ball. You are able to throw to a RB or WR near the sideline and not put them OB giving them room to get up field or easily make the grab in bounds.
- Routes
Due to the throwing Trajectories being improved, nearly all routes are available which DEFINITELY was not the case in Madden 12..or really each of the past versions. Each route I tried was there if I threw the ball on time or depending on the coverage (what play they called or if they were able to spot the ball prior). They weren't always successful but I could see that if my timing was better, I had more time or against certain coverages that the route was available. This is huge honestly. Last version there was really only a couple routes that were available to use. The others you had to hope would work at times but chances are you knew it would be swatted or just flat out picked off. Having access to every route is definitely a great thing. Same as I mentioned above. Now routes towards the sideline can work due to the Trajectories, especially ones towards the sidelines.
Another thing regarding routes. RB's and TE's have different hot routes than WR's in some instances. The Slant Out route that seemed to always be golden against Man or Zone in the past several versions has been removed. You won't be able to hot route an RB to a fade route out of the backfield either.
With that said looks like you can't throw "blind quick passes" sort of speak. Like the snap and throw variety. The ball will likely find the dirt more times than it will a WR.
- Catch Animations
In Madden 12 I seen the same 2-3 animations on every catch. Didn't matter the type of route it was or if the WR was near the sideline, the same animations would be attempted. Thus far I've noticed ALOT of different ones, especially near the sideline. I was able to complete a long ball over the LB's head in with Vernon Davis caught the ball in stride beautifully. Last version you would get 99.9% of the time, the "long jump in the air" over the shoulder catch which would give time for the Defender to tackle you or knock the ball loose. Now the WR catches the ball while still on the ground over shoulder.
- Defense
Things I've noticed.
- Safety play is much improved. Safeties appear to be more cognizant of their responsibilities. In Madden 12, at times they would not cover their deep half completely allowing the WR to get deeper than they were. Or routes down the middle of the field they would play more towards the sideline in Man Under 2 plays. Once they locate the ball they will try to make a play on it. Antrell Rolle ate me alive when I kept trying to throw same route and ball his way.
- Man Coverage is enhanced. Not in a way making it over powered but subtle changes that may or may not happen automatically. For example if a CB knows that he has help over top and to the inside it appears that he will play the WR on his outside shoulder. That subtle change is great. I also did not notice any Psychic coverage from any of the Defenders like in previous versions.
- Shading appears to work as well correctly this version. When I shaded a specific WR my CB acted accordingly.
- Zone Coverage seems to be solid. Again Defenders will play the ball once they locate it. A single player cannot cover 10-20 yards of their area no longer it appears, but they will carry the WR further if necessary.
- Catch animations for Defenders have also improved. In the past you would also get the same animations from Defenders trying to swat or intercept the ball. Now they are aware of the sideline when trying intercept a pass.
- Defensive Ends seem to rush upfield like they should...especially the DE's of the New York Giants. As I noted again Offline against the CPU or in general always plays differently. But it was very promising to see their rush improved.
- Man Lock is FINALLY back in the game. In the past you simply motioned a WR and could tell what coverage the Defense was in. Man if the Defender followed, Zone if he didn't and took steps back. Now the LB or CB will either switch or follow the motioned WR to where he goes while having his assignment switched without tipping this to the Offense. They could be in Man or Zone. This by far is one of the better additions as well and much needed for those of us who remember when it was in the game in the PS2 days.
- * Alignment. This is one thing I will need to investigate when I get home later as I really didn't pay too close attention to it.
- Kicker Meter
Kicking has always been easy in Madden eventually once the meter is figured out and of course no lag. Going back to this meter is more natural. It will still be easy eventually but better than the button tap method. If it plays like it has Offline (which I doubt it will be that quick) it will make kicks more difficult. Hoping that the speed is based on accuracy or something
Negatives
- "Guess a Play"
This is by far my biggest complaint of the game, (I've never liked it in NCAA either) The "guess a play" feature is back in the game. May be this has been in the past few versions and me just not know it but I didn't think it was since the 07-08 versions. You can either guess Run Middle, Run Right, Run Left or Pass. I absolute hate this feature and what it does to your Defense. The Offense came out in a Singleback 3 WR set. I called 2-3-6, Man Under 2 on Defense. I controlled the SS and "guessed" Run Middle. The Offense was running a pass play, I had 6 players into the backfield in an instance with Eli running for his life avoiding the easy sack.
The difference is night and day how the Defense reacts. When you use it every one of the front 7 moves faster immediately after the snap, especially the LB's. Now I will say that it wasn't always a given but nothing ever is against the CPU especially on All-Madden. They were able to have success both throwing and passing when I kept calling Run Middle (which is all I ever kept calling). Still the fact that my Defense reacted so much faster after the snap is garbage. The react like a bunch of blind pirahnas looking for blood IMO. I really really do not like this feature at all, I mean at all.
- Broken Tackles
As I mentioned above some of these will change once able to play another User online. As always the case with the CPU they tend to do things that don't happen as often against Users. The CPU RB's break quite a bit of tackles. And they do it relatively quickly it seems. Some were ones they should have broke due to my angle, who it was and their momentum based on the Infinity Engine but there were quite a few that should have been one on one tackles. Bradshaw gouged me for nearly 200 yards rushing in one game as he was just unstoppable...a game in which I lost 42-14. He would break a good 1-2 tackles on most of his carries or was just tough to bring down in general. To be fair I'll say that I was just testing Defenses and wasn't really trying to play the run, but still.
Again this may change once Online. And I don't play the CPU anyway so it won't matter in that regard. But if it is something that I notice as well as others Online then it may need addressed. I guess people who play the CPU and adjust sliders will be able to limit or correct that.
- Blocking on Special Teams
Specifically Punt Returns. This also could be another thing that changes when Online as again the CPU is able to play differently. I didn't notice any better blocking as from last year. I rarely had any room to work after punts as my blockers didn't do much. This may have been due to the calls I was making as far as Middle, Return Left, Return Right.
I will say that Kick Return blocking is better as I returned a kick for a TD after I found the crease and shot through. Nice to see that will be a factor again. Punt return blocking did not seem the same.
- Playcall Screen
This is one of those subtle changes that I don't care for. I know I will get use to it but I don't care for it now with where the play name is.
- Score Bar
Don't care for it being blue. I would have liked this to remain black like it was.
I love the overlays, just not the score bar.
Overall
Again I am impressed with the improvements in this game just off the Demo. They are very noticable from the past several versions and have and all have an impact on the game. I love the Infinity Engine and what it brings to the game. This will only get better and make the game that much more better.
This was going to be a buy for me but my feeling towards the game has improved to be more exciting. As I still play Madden 12 the improvements from it alone stand out very clear. My view of the game wasn't lessoned or changed hearing the things that don't mean anything to me like being able to Edit players ratings/equipment, CCM, Offline play, import classes, etc. My feeling was that if Gameplay was improved with things like Trajectory, Coverages, Physics, catch animations, Man-lock etc..and they all actually worked and were implemented correctly then I'd be that much more happier.
Definitely a step in the right direction for improving the game.
Last edited by skipwondah33; 08-15-2012 at 09:07 AM.
I don't like the infinity engine very much if at all. Way too many times the tackles look stupid with flailing arms, heads, and legs doing the splits. I actually started laughing at how bad the tackles look pretty much sealed the deal for me on not getting Madden until next gen when maybe wrap up tackles and realistic break tackles re-appear. I'm passing on the 2 puppets with strings running into each other wildly tackling engine this gen. I have never seen Frank Gore run into his guard at practically little speed or momentum and suddenly fall to the ground on his knees as if he was praying lol ridiculous garbage.
This engine doesn't represent any football I've played and watched. I have played 3 more games on default All-Madden and still pass for 70%, and I can't break any tackles by trucking smaller DB's one on one using Lynch, Gore, and Jacobs. The new commentary was a welcome to my ears even with the occasional repeat about my offense being boring or the defense being tired leads to mistakes. I thought the crowd noise was ok just more responsive after a big play than during it despite it being the opening kickoff I returned. I played 2 close games on All Madden and the CPU playcalling at the end of the game was awful just plain crap AI. I won 20-17 using the Niners because NY decided to call draws, dump passes to RB's, and on the final Hail Mary type play from their own 40, Eli chooses to wait until all his WR's start running back towards the line before he throws it, lol garbage. The other was 14-7 win for NY and Alex Smith and the Niners decide to call a draw play from midfield with 3 seconds left on the clock lol idiotic playcalling.
I give the gameplay in the demo a 6 (passing too easy even on All-Madden, running is all or nothing depends on if the AI decides to block or not, Special Teams is same as M12 I got one punt return TD for Ginn and 2 Td's for Leon Washington, and 1 each for Banks and Jernigan. I also nailed a 58 yard FG easily with Hauschka but he has a powerful leg. Defense ehh only thing I liked was the slightly more responsive switching and swatting or picking off of the ball in the air compared to NCAA 13.)
Last edited by WolverineJay; 08-15-2012 at 01:08 PM.
WOW! cpu playcalling is pretty bad in this game IF the cpu has the lead. The Giants are up on me 20-14 with under two minutes to go. I have no time outs and on third down... with less than a minute to go they throw the ball (they are at MY 27 yard line. I pick it off and go for six. When the cpu gets the ball back they run a halfback draw as their first play??? On their last play they the cpu throws a 10 yard out and Simms tells me about how it was a good first down... okay but the game clock has hit zero. ???
+1 on the play calling screen. I hate it.
Yup, Naantz telling me how I changed my offense/defense is getting pretty annoying. If I'm playing the cpu why don't you tell me how the cpu is changing things up??? Also, I changed the pass interfence sliders to 100 and zero PASS INTERFERENCE CALLS THUS FAR. Once again, that feature does not exist and it really should if physics exist on player interaction. Maybe it's just not in the demo but progressive lighting is not working or not working properly IMO.
Forgot to add in my impression write up.
My view of the game is how i see it and how it will relate to playing another User.
Judging this game solely from playing the CPU is difficult given the things the CPU does or gets away with
Yep it is almost 2 entirely different games offline vs the CPU and Online vs another HUM. Sim User vs Sim User has been the best way to play the game for awhile.
Great write-up Skip! I didn't even realize guess a play was in Madden. Is that new this year? I won't use it but I hope the cpu won't use it much either.
I've read both yours and Wolverine Jay's complaints on the broken tackles and I think that's an All-Madden only issue. It's pretty good on default All-Pro (cpu could use a little boost imo). But I watched a video of Frank Gore running over defenders all day as the cpu on All-Madden. I think he rushed for 297 yards in a demo vid lol. I think the broken tackles on all-Madden is simply too high for the cpu and it's probably too low for the user. You might want to tweak that. Haven't tried all-Madden myself but from your comments and the video I watched it was pretty obvious this area needs tuning.
Jaymo, you had commented on the cpu LBs rushing the lanes awful quick at times. I wonder if that's them "guessing the play"? I wonder if we tone down the run reaction slider if this can be fixed. Of course I probably won't be able to play until Friday. Probably be home late Thursday. Long day today and not much accomplished unfortunately meaning another long one tomorrow and then a 2.5+ hour drive home.
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