Madden NFL 11

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Originally Posted by jaymo76

I'm still so dissapointed with ZERO franchise updates/changes. For offline only players who are loyal to a series, it's a real slap in the face. I will continue to play Madden 10 because "gameflow" just isn't worth $69.99 (Canadian price...).

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This is my exact line of thought. I don't play online at all on Madden, I only play it for the Franchise. So the fact that they have done nothing this year with franchise just killed my buying this game. I might be tempted to buy it next spring or something when it's cheap just to fulfill the achievement whore in me, but that'd be about it. Otherwise, I'm retired from Madden until at least Madden 12 as I already traded in Madden 10 a couple months ago towards another game.

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Originally Posted by jaymo76

I'm still so dissapointed with ZERO franchise updates/changes. For offline only players who are loyal to a series, it's a real slap in the face. I will continue to play Madden 10 because "gameflow" just isn't worth $69.99 (Canadian price...).

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Yeah ... sounds like we're getting changes next year, but that isn't this year.

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Originally Posted by JBHuskers

Yeah ... sounds like we're getting changes next year, but that isn't this year.

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I really hope that NCAA 12 doesn't flop after 11 being so good. Madden 10, I really enjoy and still play. I figured Madden 11 would have the madden/head coach hybrid BUT what a let down...

Having now played a few games from the demo, I have a few thoughts:

A. I absolutely love:
* the audibles~ you can actually see what they look like with the play art as you scroll them
* the lengthy pregame dialgogue
* the injury system (take notes NCAA 12)
* the new cut scene animations

B. I kinda like:
* the player models (though I think NCAA has better proportions)
* the ease of play calling if you don't want to look for a certain play
* setting up the gameflow for Offense and Defense~ but it needs work!!!

C. I really dislike:
* all of the advertising (enough is enough...)
* Gus.... hey Gus, not every play should result in an orgasm!!!
* Gus + Cris = zero chemistry
* STUPID GAMFLOW COORDINATOR CALLS!!!!! (4th and 1 and the cpu coordinator calls a deep out play???)
* no halftime show.... I have confirmation Extra Point at halftime is no longer in the game????? (subtraction by subtraction???)
* opening screen.... is this a Termintor movie or a football game??? it's just weird...
* D pad is a pain in the butt... though it's not as bad as some think
* kicking metre... why change what isn't broke???

Overall, gameflow is an interesting concept and I have mixed feelings on it. If I were buying the game (which I'm not) I would use it but 50% of the time I would audible as the cpu playcalling is bad. I would also turn OFF the coordinator voice. It's neat for about 3-5 plays then it's just insulting to my football intelligence. I think gameflow is very realistic to football BUT I also feel as though I am losing control of MY game experience. Now, if you play without GAMEFLOW ON, then my question is, why buy the game at all? Does the game offer anything to justify the expense? I personally will play and enjoy Madden 10 and cross my fingers that 12 is franchise overload.

Also, Madden 11 feels identical to NCAA 11 in the sense of gameplay. From the ease of running to DB's running in front of receivers on slant routes, the game feels pretty much the same. Heck, even 80% of the cut scenese are the same! I'm sure millions will buy and enjoy the game, but for me, I'm sticking with NCAA 11. Madden feels "old" even with gameflow. I want to get lost in the experience and I don't see that with Madden 11. Anyways, enough rambling, back to NCAA 11.

Jaymo, does the kicking meter feel easier or harder? I'm hoping we find some way in the next few years to make it accessible while actually making it difficult. Kicks are too easy now.

Gameflow is not for the hardcore player. It's intended for kids and dimwits who don't know a zone blitz from a strong safety. People that use the same 5 plays all game because they have no clue what to call and they feel safe with their small list of plays they've learned to use from repetition. The lazy player. I get that and it's likely a great concept for the average guy who plays a football game now and then.

Locomotion is a good add, but what else is there for the hardcore player?

I didn't buy Madden 10 because I haven't been able to get through more than 2 or 3 games of Franchise without being disgusted since last gen. I'll pass on 11 too.

For those with recent Franchise experience, is the sim engine fixed to give "NFL" style stats? Do backups get reps? Is the draft logic still absurd? Do teams still cut Franchise QBs because of Cap problems? Do teams still sit tens of millions under the Cap with loads of FAs who could help them still on the market? Can users still sign virtually any and every top FA? Do teams still allow their Franchise QBs to become FAs?

If any or all of the above still occur, I'm out.

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Originally Posted by JeffHCross

Jaymo, does the kicking meter feel easier or harder? I'm hoping we find some way in the next few years to make it accessible while actually making it difficult. Kicks are too easy now.

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I'd actually be in favor of having a "Coach Mode" option for kicking.

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Originally Posted by JeffHCross

Jaymo, does the kicking meter feel easier or harder? I'm hoping we find some way in the next few years to make it accessible while actually making it difficult. Kicks are too easy now.

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All you do is angle your kick with the left stick and then you press a button to start the momentum then when it gets to the end of the bar you push it again (for max power) and them when the bar comes back to the start you push the button again (for accuracy). In truth I find it easier than what we have in NCAA 11. If you have ever played Hot Shots golf on Play Station, it's the identical system. I would much rather keep the system we have now.

It's still entirely too easy to throw to the flats. I can not believe the biggest issue from last year has carried over. When the hell is EA going to figure out how to program zone/man defense correctly?

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Originally Posted by JeffHCross

Jaymo, does the kicking meter feel easier or harder? I'm hoping we find some way in the next few years to make it accessible while actually making it difficult. Kicks are too easy now.

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That is why they changed it, it was no problem lining up and kicking a 60-yarder with a 65-rated kicker. The new meter is supposed to be based on the kicker's attributes.

Sure the old kick meter was great but it wasn't hard at all.

I only got to play one game lastnight before I called it a night. So this is all I have so far.

- Graphics look good and fields seems bigger to me
- Love the way WR's actually slow up and go up for the ball, instead of just letting the DB take the pick
- Run blocking has been improved which is great.
- Locomotion of course

- Turn Gameflow off after the 1st quarter, probably wont use this feature as I don't have a problem going through my plays.
- User plays appear to be more difficult to make on the ball but since the camera seems further back but that may be because I'm use to NCAA now.
- The D-pad will take some getting use to especially since I will be switching back and fourth from NCAA.

All in all with only playing one game I like it.

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Originally Posted by JeffHCross

Jaymo, does the kicking meter feel easier or harder? I'm hoping we find some way in the next few years to make it accessible while actually making it difficult. Kicks are too easy now.

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Honestly, I got to thinking the other day. The best way to make kicking more difficult, put that first bar near the top of the power meter in NCAA to use. If you go past that, you'll have more power but the accuracy of your kicks will be DRASTICALLY reduced. Essentially instead of everyone kicking every kick with full power, you'd need to kick it with 90% power to have the best chance at accuracy. It'd be like overswinging in real golf... sure you may hit it farther, but that's only if you connect with it.

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Originally Posted by gschwendt

Honestly, I got to thinking the other day. The best way to make kicking more difficult, put that first bar near the top of the power meter in NCAA to use. If you go past that, you'll have more power but the accuracy of your kicks will be DRASTICALLY reduced. Essentially instead of everyone kicking every kick with full power, you'd need to kick it with 90% power to have the best chance at accuracy. It'd be like overswinging in real golf... sure you may hit it farther, but that's only if you connect with it.

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That would work.

It was just so easy in Madden and currently in NCAA to kick accurate full power bombs.

I've thought that as well, G. There's no real penalty for 'overkicking.' Though, IMO special teams in both games needs some love heading into the '12 titles. Your idea would be a great start, though.

Yeah that kick meter brings me back to the college Hot Shots Golf days. Don't like that either. It seems like Madden is trying to blatently be different from NCAA, but doing it in all the wrong places (Strategy Pad, Kick Meter, Play Call).

I’m getting the Madden itch. I struck out trying to get NCAA early; hopefully I can find Madden early. I feel like I’ll have a better chance of getting Madden early, maybe around this time next week.

I played one game of the demo last night and it felt like something I had played before. Maybe it's uh..OH YEAH...exactly like Madden 10. How in the world can you go an entire year long development cycle and not touch a SINGLE issue that plagued the game last year? Seriously, I know I said that it was a great foundation, and it was, but it most certainly was not THAT great. I could not believe that they did not address the issue with defending passes to the RB in the flats. That single handily destroyed online play last year. You could literally go up the field and score anytime you want just by running flare routes with the RB.

GameFlow is stupid and a complete waste of time. I'd say it's right up there with the Season Showdown EA came out with last year for NCAA as the dumbest feature I've seen so far. A lot of the animations look bad, and oddly enough, the exact same ones that looked bad last year still look bad this year.

I don't see a single thing they improved on. Even with Gus Johnson, the announcing is dry and boring and there's absolutely no chemistry between Gus and Chris. It's like they took Madden '10, added a few bells and whistles, didn't even touch the gameplay aspect of it, figured a way to shorten the game so people wouldn't notice the severe lack of changes elsewhere, slapped a Madden '11 label on it and called it a year. Severely disappointing would be the understatement of the year.

What did you think of Strategy Pad, I OU? I'm more disappointed with that versus GameFlow.

GameFlow has some odd plays inserted by default and is more enjoyable if you edit the plays. Though, I don't plan on using it and will somewhat give them a pass on it since you can shut it off. IMO, the Strategy Pad was something that was an OK idea at best, but not implemented very well.

While there was some hubbub over comments during a Madden chat that the players would be weighted more in terms of Locomotion compared to NCAA (and thus more 'sim'), I only really see it on punt returns as I can cut back against the grain and get some yardage on returns. The rest of the game, I can't tell if I have more control due to Locomotion or being able to think out and make decisions due to the slower game speed.

I don't know how to explain it, but some of the animations do look off like you said. Maybe I'm blind, but I don't feel like they are that way in NCAA 11, however.

I think the Game Speed is what you are seeing, Rudy. NCAA 11's default is 'Normal' while IIRC Madden 10's was 'Slow', so I am assuming 11 will be the same. The slower game speed is more to others' liking, but in videos I think it just looks odd.

Haven't downloaded the demo and probably won't for awhile. I want to spend my time on NCAA 11 rather than a game I simply won't be getting. I prefer college football and only have time for one football game. That said, I don't understand the hype around gameflow and gameplanning. It just seems like a customized Ask Madden. Quite frankly, I often use the suggested play selection that NCAA has on offense (never defense). I'll scroll through the plays as it helps keep the game fresh for me. It picks plays normally based on down and distance - what's so much better about Madden's system other than the user having to painfully pick out all the plays in the beginning?

And Madden didn't improve online franchise because so few people actually used it last year but that doesn't mean you don't fix things. And if they thought nobody used online franchise last year, wait until they see the numbers for OTP. It will be a monumental fail imo.

Also, Phil Frazier said that the percentage of cross ownership between Madden and NCAA was in the single digits percentage wise. I was shocked to read that less than 10% of the people out there own both games.

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Originally Posted by cdj

What did you think of Strategy Pad, I OU? I'm more disappointed with that versus GameFlow.

GameFlow has some odd plays inserted by default and is more enjoyable if you edit the plays. Though, I don't plan on using it and will somewhat give them a pass on it since you can shut it off. IMO, the Strategy Pad was something that was an OK idea at best, but not implemented very well.

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The strategy will take a little to get use to for me. I keep wanting to resort to using the old way but thats because I'm play NCAA. I am getting much faster with it though and thats playing against the fast hiking CPU and in only my 4th played game. I do think in the long run it will be easier to have all of the controls on one side. I make alot of adjustments pre-snap so anything that will make that easier would be nice.

Gameflow doesn't bother me really. I won't use the feature but I can see why it was implemented and it being a more appealing function then "Ask Madden". When the majority of the online players on average are only using 13 plays over the course of the game, maybe they thought it was too complex for a player to go through 300 plays,

A good portion of the "hardcore" players are the ones who play online ranked games anyway. It does add a bit of realism to it for the player who just wants to enjoy a football game and not learn over 200 plays. But also for the hardcore players that have been creating written down gameplans for every down and distance that they may encounter. Matter of fact the guys over at VG have been creating gameplan template sheets for quite some time if I'm not correct. I know guys in my leagues have been doing these for years atleast.

Anyway I take the demo for what it is, especially after playing the NCAA demo then playing the final product.

Things I am glad to see

- ability for the deep ball to be thrown

- If you are using a safety and are beat before you could make up the ground giving you a HUGE covering radius. Now if you are beat you won't be able to fly over and cover everything.

- Hitstick isn't as effective. Before you could suction hitstick having the most BS angle, glad that was taken out of NCAA as well.