Jim Tressel Has Resigned

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Originally Posted by AustinWolv

{rolling eyes}

'everyone is doing it' is played out and a cop out by the guilty. Plenty of athletes at major schools refute that.

Remember there is a distinction between complicit programs that foster the atmosphere and cheat versus the rogue player who breaks rules on his own. There is much more of the latter than the former.

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plenty of athletes at major schools refute it ? yeah, thats called lying to cover your ass. or they just werent the kind of recruit the school felt the need to kiss up to to get.

the cheating programs are always in the top 40. they may be the minority but they will always be the schools with more wins.

if everyone doesnt do it then why are so many winning schools getting busted in the news ? Again, 5 schools with big busts in the last 3 years means that 25 to 50 schools are doing the same thing. It is the major college culture to cheat in order to win.
no one cares about the 60 or 70 schools who do things right because they are the losing teams who get the lesser recruits.

the only schools that get a pass are Army, Navy Air Force and BYU...and even BYU cheats because they red shirt and then send their guys on missions so they come back older and a little bigger so they can remotely compete in major college ball haha

we arent talking about a 12 year old kid who got busted and makes an excuse that everyone does it to save face.
This was a highly recruited player who, no doubt was wanted by everyone in the ACC and SEC aside from many other schools.
I doubt the ones that were really pushing to get him only promised basic, legal, fair things.

If a Ohio State is doing it who is always in the top 10 and a North carolina is doing it who hardly ever makes top 10. That means everyone in between is doing it as well.

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Originally Posted by ram29jackson

the only schools that get a pass are Army, Navy Air Force and BYU...and even BYU cheats because they red shirt and then send their guys on missions so they come back older and a little bigger so they can remotely compete in major college ball haha

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In their defense, most Mormons end up going on Missions right after High School or early into their College life.

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Originally Posted by DariusLock

In their defense, most Mormons end up going on Missions right after High School or early into their College life.

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that doesnt lessen the fact that the football team tries to use that as a small advantage in weight and maturity of players. If they didnt do that, they would always be in the bottom 30 and never in the middle 50 of rankings.

Your mind is made up based on subjective opinion and bias. No use discussing further.

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Originally Posted by AustinWolv

Your mind is made up based on subjective opinion and bias. No use discussing further.

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I have to agree with AustinWolv. Right now, everything you are saying is based squarely on your opinion and your idea of percentages of stuff, even if you claim it is fact. To me, it is nothing but pure opinion, speculation, and, as Austin said, bias, unless you produce actual, hard facts from various sources.

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Originally Posted by SmoothPancakes

I have to agree with AustinWolv. Right now, everything you are saying is based squarely on your opinion and your idea of percentages of stuff, even if you claim it is fact. To me, it is nothing but pure opinion, speculation, and, as Austin said, bias, unless you produce actual, hard facts from various sources.

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when 5 schools are caught doing something in a 3 year span, it means more than just those schools are doing the same thing.
Thats all it can mean.they cant just be isolated incidents.

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Originally Posted by ram29jackson

when 5 schools are caught doing something in a 3 year span, it means more than just those schools are doing the same thing.

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Are other schools doing it? Sure. Is everybody doing 'something'? Probably. 'Something' is a rather wide range. In my opinion, it's disingenuous to even lump the schools that have gotten into trouble together. Auburn's situation is not Ohio State's is not USC's is not Tennessee's is not North Carolina's.

And that sure as hell doesn't mean everybody's doing it.

And BYU doesn't cheat by having players that go on Missions. Period.

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Originally Posted by JeffHCross

Are other schools doing it? Sure. Is everybody doing 'something'? Probably. 'Something' is a rather wide range. In my opinion, it's disingenuous to even lump the schools that have gotten into trouble together. Auburn's situation is not Ohio State's is not USC's is not Tennessee's is not North Carolina's.

And that sure as hell doesn't mean everybody's doing it.

And BYU doesn't cheat by having players that go on Missions. Period.

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when I say everybody, I of course mean major programs who are in the top 20 to 40.
its disingenuous to lump them together ? a violation is a violation.
Of course i'm making a joke with BYU but it stands to reason that no other school uses such an idea to their advantage and its true that if BYU didnt do that they would be ranked next to all the sun belt schools year after year haha.

college ball is about getting superior meat on the field and getting wins.
do you think Randy Moss or Jamarcus Russell ever went to a class? I doubt it, but those schools did everything possible to get those physical freaks back on a field. That story happens every year over and over along with little white envelopes of money.
the schools that get busted are the ones who let it get out of control, which of course always happens eventually due to greed etc.

Apparently THE Ohio State University wants to get rid of any other evidence of wrong doing by "scrub everything". NCAA better get in there quick before all of the evidence winds up in the shredder. :nod: :D

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=6631784

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Originally Posted by CLW

before all of the evidence winds up in the shredder. :nod: :D

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I agree with the sentiment of tearing down the whole department and starting from scratch ... but good grief, word choice.

And more about OSU

http://www.dispatch.com/live/content...s.html?sid=101

http://twitter.com/#!/PDBuckeyes/sta...15497098862592

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Originally Posted by @PDBuckeyes

BREAKING NEWS: Terrelle Pryor has decided to end his football career at Ohio State, per his lawyer

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Originally Posted by gschwendt

http://twitter.com/#!/PDBuckeyes/sta...15497098862592

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Yep called this one. I now think he NEVER plays a down of remotely competitive football again. I.e. he NEVER plays a down in the NFL

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Originally Posted by gschwendt

http://twitter.com/#!/PDBuckeyes/sta...15497098862592

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His high-powered lawyer that is a bigshot in OH, is highly likely working the case for free, and so happens to be highly associated with O$U..........how convenient that Pryor isn't obligated to talk to the NCAA now that he isn't a college athlete.

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Originally Posted by AustinWolv

His high-powered lawyer that is a bigshot in OH, is highly likely working the case for free, and so happens to be highly associated with O$U..........how convenient that Pryor isn't obligated to talk to the NCAA now that he isn't a college athlete.

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CFL - say hello to your next big draw !!!!

Pryor made $40K signing garbage and selling it.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=6637444

THE Ohio State should just lay a ban hammer on themselves right now and PRAY the NCAA doesn't give them THE Death Penalty. This story is NOT going away and it is ONLY going to keep getting worse the more the media and NCAA digs into this.

THUGS runnin' wild with Sweater Vest at the helm.

Yeah the NFL CBA needs to have a supplemental draft for him to play this year. He basically has to TEAR it up at the UFL or CFL levels.

For once, someone high profile has to REALLY work for a payday.

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Originally Posted by CLW

Pryor made $40K signing garbage and selling it.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=6637444

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Yep, we're done.

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Originally Posted by CLW

PRAY the NCAA doesn't give them THE Death Penalty.

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Never gonna get the Death Penalty though. Go watch 30 for 30 ... the two situations really don't compare.

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Originally Posted by CLW

Pryor made $40K signing garbage and selling it.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=6637444

THE Ohio State should just lay a ban hammer on themselves right now and PRAY the NCAA doesn't give them THE Death Penalty. This story is NOT going away and it is ONLY going to keep getting worse the more the media and NCAA digs into this.

THUGS runnin' wild with Sweater Vest at the helm.

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40k?

It took me 5 years, post grad school, to pull in a 40k year.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by souljahbill

40k?

It took me 5 years, post grad school, to pull in a 40k year.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

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Originally Posted by CLW

Pryor made $40K signing garbage and selling it.

http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/news/story?id=6637444

THE Ohio State should just lay a ban hammer on themselves right now and PRAY the NCAA doesn't give them THE Death Penalty. This story is NOT going away and it is ONLY going to keep getting worse the more the media and NCAA digs into this.

THUGS runnin' wild with Sweater Vest at the helm.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZHCVyllnck

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Originally Posted by JeffHCross

Yep, we're done.
Never gonna get the Death Penalty though. Go watch 30 for 30 ... the two situations really don't compare.

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While it has yet to be proven just assume arguendo that the NCAA/media uncovers that the multiple car purchases were NOT legit and that some/many of them were free. Moreover, assume that someone in the Athletic Department knew or heard rumors of that was going on and funneled football players to that dealer for that purpose. Finally, assume it is discovered/learned that this has been going on since Sweater Vest arrived on campus and he simply took his thug ways from Youngstown to Columbus.

You now have players making $40,000 a year (which by the way is well over the Average Ohioian - if that is the proper word - yearly salary) in violation of NCAA rules.

You now have players getting free cars and tatoos.

AND (most importantly)

You now have the Athletic Dept knowing about this and funneling players to it in blatant violation of NCAA rules for a number of years.

They may not give THE Ohio St. the death penalty but IMHO this is going to be the biggest/hardest penalty since that death penalty case. You are probably looking at the possibilit of: (1) no bowl games; (2) massive reduction in scholarships; (3) no tv time; (4) giving up all $ awarded to the school for the bowl games under Sweater Vest for MANY (say probably 5 years). While it may not technically end the program it will certainly end Ohio State's chances for competing for championships for most likely a decade if not longer.

Apparently Maurice Clarett is on the Dan Patrick show talking about the OSU situation. Not real sure that's who the Buckeyes need representing them right now. :smh:

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Originally Posted by psuexv

Apparently Maurice Clarett is on the Dan Patrick show talking about the OSU situation. Not real sure that's who the Buckeyes need representing them right now. :smh:

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Yeah... I watched it. Nothing really new came out of it, just basically that "it's not the coaches, it's not the administration setting these deals up, it's the players going through their own contacts that stuff like this happens".

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Originally Posted by gschwendt

Yeah... I watched it. Nothing really new came out of it, just basically that "it's not the coaches, it's not the administration setting these deals up, it's the players going through their own contacts that stuff like this happens".

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More spin by tO$U trying to make people think that it's just the players. It's crystal clear that everyone knew what was happening, yet continued to allow it to happen, and they need to pay for allowing it.

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Originally Posted by morsdraconis

More spin by tO$U trying to make people think that it's just the players. It's crystal clear that everyone knew what was happening, yet continued to allow it to happen, and they need to pay for allowing it.

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I won't go quite so far as to say that everyone KNEW what was happening. However, as we often say in the law, they SHOULD HAVE KNOWN (i.e. willfully turned a blind eye) what was going on. Either way, THE Ohio St. must be punished SEVERELY for what has gone on in their program for the past X number of years.

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Originally Posted by CLW

While it has yet to be proven just assume arguendo that the NCAA/media uncovers that the multiple car purchases were NOT legit and that some/many of them were free. Moreover, assume that someone in the Athletic Department knew or heard rumors of that was going on and funneled football players to that dealer for that purpose. Finally, assume it is discovered/learned that this has been going on since Sweater Vest arrived on campus and he simply took his thug ways from Youngstown to Columbus.

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That's a hell of a lot of assumptions though. I agree with you, that in that scenario the Death Penalty would be warranted (though I still think it wouldn't happen).

But there's so far nothing to suggest that anyone more than Pryor was responsible for the worst of the offenses you listed. The four remaining players implicated in the tattoos have already been punished. The other 9 who were listed in the SI article are, thus far, proving to not have any truth to the allegation.

And, in particular, the idea that someone in the Athletic Department knew it was going down is quite a large leap, based on the information at hand right now.

Again, if everything you suggested came true, I'd agree with you. But right now, it's a hell of a leap.

SMU got the Death Penalty because they blatantly violated NCAA rules, did it in the public eye, and metaphorically sent a big "Fuck You" to the NCAA.

I think Pryor is going to be the death of Ohio State, absolutely. I think he's going to be the equivalent for us of Reggie Bush. And there may be more going down with him, especially with the compliance department being clearly not up to par in dealing with any of this. But that's very different from what you believe will be found.

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Originally Posted by CLW

They may not give THE Ohio St. the death penalty but IMHO this is going to be the biggest/hardest penalty since that death penalty case.

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Quite honestly, I don't think anyone is going to get the Death Penalty ever again. I don't think the NCAA had any concept of how much that would kill SMU's program. And they wouldn't wish that on anyone. I wouldn't even wish that on Michigan.

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Originally Posted by morsdraconis

More spin by tO$U trying to make people think that it's just the players.

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If you honestly believe that Maurice Clarett is in charge of spin control for Ohio State, I have some lakefront property for you.

If he's defending anyone, it's Tressel, whom Maurice was close to, not the university.

haha the OSU Will never get the death penalty it would kill revenue that tv and the NCAA love too much

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Originally Posted by ram29jackson

haha the OSU Will never get the death penalty it would kill revenue that tv and the NCAA love too much

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While I agree that no Death Penalty is coming, it has nothing to do with TV revenue. If OSU falls into the abyss, another program will take their place. Recent struggles by UM and ND (where recent is 15 years, lol) and last year by UT haven't affected the NCAA coffers at all. Instead, the success of teams like Stanford, Oregon, and Boise have filled their wallets. Every time someone loses, someone else wins. The successful programs will always bring TV $ no matter who they are.

What? While I agree they will not get the death penalty, Standford, Oregon, and Boise bring no where near the TV revenue that OSU brings in. I dont think they will be hurting for anything but you I think this will go one or two way, they will get punished similar to USC (even though I fell like there crime is much worse), or they will not get punished as harsh because its OSU, I guess they could always go harsher than USC to make an example. IMO opinion they should get SEVERE punishments but in that same sentence I bet they look over the collegiate sports landscape now that one of there prize school has apparently been one of the worst breakers of the rules and some rules will change.

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Originally Posted by oweb26

What? While I agree they will not get the death penalty, Standford, Oregon, and Boise bring no where near the TV revenue that OSU brings in.

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You're assuming the networks pay based on who is playing.

First, I'm certain the networks don't pay any more or less to air, for example, the Sugar Bowl based on who is in the game. Those contracts are worked out years in advance. Yes, if the MNC had 4 or 5 crappy match ups (which drew low ratings) in a row, it would affect the next TV deal but not significantly. Second, as I said, UM and ND have been average/bad for a few years and UT was 5-7 last year. That didn't cause the NCAA any sleepless nights though. The money keeps being printed at the same rate.

Ultimately, the way it works is that a network commits to pay $X million to air the BCS games (for example) several years before the games take place. When gameday actually arrives, the network is on the hook for that money regardless of whether it's OSU vs UT or it's Nevada vs WVU. The NCAA has made their money (just hasn't received it) years before the match up is set. The ones who sweat about having a huge match up are the network guys. They gave to be able to sell advertising time for enough $ to make a profit over what they paid to air the game. And, for them, offering Coca Cola a 30-second ad with a huge price tag is easier with OSU/UT than it is with Nevada/WVU.

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I won't go quite so far as to say that everyone KNEW what was happening.

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They knew. And while they thought they could cover it up with just Tress getting let go, they've been caught in other lies now, so the higher-ups are now said to be hoping to only get what USC got whereas previously they were maneuvering to avoid that type of sanction. There are 3 specifically that have major power and Gee and Smith are not untouchable at this point.

Jeff, what have you heard about a 503,c being funded by O$U interests, that ends up paying certain pipeline high school coaches handsomely for their services at week-long summer camps?

I agree with Jeff. No death penalty. But it won't be a cakewalk penalty either. Two opposing trails that need to meet at the same singular path: NCAA cannot be too harsh because it will piss off O$U and start a movement to end affiliation with the NCAA which is basically voluntary as it is and there are a number of large schools that aren't thrilled with the NCAA, enough to likely form their own mega-conference. NCAA cannot be too soft as it won't deter other schools from willingly cheating.

Yes, O$U has been willingly cheating. Make no mistake.

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Originally Posted by steelerfan

You're assuming the networks pay based on who is playing.

First, I'm certain the networks don't pay any more or less to air, for example, the Sugar Bowl based on who is in the game. Those contracts are worked out years in advance. Yes, if the MNC had 4 or 5 crappy match ups (which drew low ratings) in a row, it would affect the next TV deal but not significantly. Second, as I said, UM and ND have been average/bad for a few years and UT was 5-7 last year. That didn't cause the NCAA any sleepless nights though. The money keeps being printed at the same rate.

Ultimately, the way it works is that a network commits to pay $X million to air the BCS games (for example) several years before the games take place. When gameday actually arrives, the network is on the hook for that money regardless of whether it's OSU vs UT or it's Nevada vs WVU. The NCAA has made their money (just hasn't received it) years before the match up is set. The ones who sweat about having a huge match up are the network guys. They gave to be able to sell advertising time for enough $ to make a profit over what they paid to air the game. And, for them, offering Coca Cola a 30-second ad with a huge price tag is easier with OSU/UT than it is with Nevada/WVU.

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While what you are saying is correct conceptually and even literally especially when you are talking about bowl games, schools like OSU, UT or any other traditional powerhouse will get a premium on there TV deals than say Boise, or Stanford. I guess we really cant say Oregon because they are getting there pretty fast.

I am speaking regular season TV deals I am almost certain that traditional powers get more money because as you said Coke will pay more advertising dollars to be shown on a OSU game than they will on a boise state game, which means money money for the NCAA if OSU is a good school than say if OSU is terrible and small, or even good and small.

As I stated Bowl game are entirely different and are gambles by the TV networks, but you can beat that they try really hard to not have Boise State in significant games, recently Boise has been to good to deny them the opportunity.

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Originally Posted by oweb26

While what you are saying is correct conceptually and even literally especially when you are talking about bowl games, schools like OSU, UT or any other traditional powerhouse will get a premium on there TV deals than say Boise, or Stanford. I guess we really cant say Oregon because they are getting there pretty fast.

I am speaking regular season TV deals I am almost certain that traditional powers get more money because as you said Coke will pay more advertising dollars to be shown on a OSU game than they will on a boise state game, which means money money for the NCAA if OSU is a good school than say if OSU is terrible and small, or even good and small.

As I stated Bowl game are entirely different and are gambles by the TV networks, but you can beat that they try really hard to not have Boise State in significant games, recently Boise has been to good to deny them the opportunity.

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Well, it's still the same thing. ABC/ESPN pays $X per year to broadcast regular season games, then decides which games they will show based on projected viewership. The games they don't choose trickle down to the lesser networks who pay less knowing they will get lesser games.

None of that would change if OSU went away. Look at Miami. Their decline hasn't cost the NCAA a nickel. No program is bigger than the public's need to see games. The $ will be there with or without OSU.

Oh man, I hate think of the riots that will happen regarding the OSU-Michigan game if the NCAA were to go hardcore and tag on a TV ban for a couple years onto Ohio State's punishment.

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Originally Posted by steelerfan

Well, it's still the same thing. ABC/ESPN pays $X per year to broadcast regular season games, then decides which games they will show based on projected viewership. The games they don't choose trickle down to the lesser networks who pay less knowing they will get lesser games.

None of that would change if OSU went away. Look at Miami. Their decline hasn't cost the NCAA a nickel. No program is bigger than the public's need to see games. The $ will be there with or without OSU.

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Let me clarify what I am trying to say a little bit, it WILL hurt the NCAA in the long run because if networks know you are down one of your biggest school then you cant believe that they will pay as much for a TV deal, now thats not saying the NCAA will still not get there "cut". Using Miami is not a good example, miami has been down during years when in fair honestly college football itself was down. The last 3-5 years of college football has grown exponentially. The NCAA gets cuts from schools doing there own TV networks though the "cut" is sustainability smaller and they can even choose to not give them any.

If we are just discussing the NCAA still getting paid they are absolutely, and even the 5 million or so they might lose as a premium is by no means substantial. Those deals they work out have stipulations in them that say hey we get XYZ number of primetime games, and in those primetime games we must have "traditional powers playing" There is more at work on these deals than you would believe.

I agree with what you are saying I just dont think we can disregard the impact of OSU, thats all Im saying.

This is funny regarding the license plate: http://www.10tv.com/live/content/ten...t.html?sid=102

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Originally Posted by steelerfan

You're assuming the networks pay based on who is playing.

First, I'm certain the networks don't pay any more or less to air, for example, the Sugar Bowl based on who is in the game. Those contracts are worked out years in advance. Yes, if the MNC had 4 or 5 crappy match ups (which drew low ratings) in a row, it would affect the next TV deal but not significantly. Second, as I said, UM and ND have been average/bad for a few years and UT was 5-7 last year. That didn't cause the NCAA any sleepless nights though. The money keeps being printed at the same rate.

Ultimately, the way it works is that a network commits to pay $X million to air the BCS games (for example) several years before the games take place. When gameday actually arrives, the network is on the hook for that money regardless of whether it's OSU vs UT or it's Nevada vs WVU. The NCAA has made their money (just hasn't received it) years before the match up is set. The ones who sweat about having a huge match up are the network guys. They gave to be able to sell advertising time for enough $ to make a profit over what they paid to air the game. And, for them, offering Coca Cola a 30-second ad with a huge price tag is easier with OSU/UT than it is with Nevada/WVU.

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:(

Why use WVU as part of the "bad" team discussion? Because of our fanbase and we travel to bowl games and such, bowl games want WVU there. We bring the money.

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Originally Posted by morsdraconis

:(

Why use WVU as part of the "bad" team discussion? Because of our fanbase and we travel to bowl games and such, bowl games want WVU there. We bring the money.

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Lol. That wasn't a "Rice/WMU" example. It was simply an example of two schools who have legitimate chances to get to a BCS game but who network execs don't want to see there because they don't have huge national appeal.

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Originally Posted by steelerfan

While I agree that no Death Penalty is coming, it has nothing to do with TV revenue. If OSU falls into the abyss, another program will take their place. Recent struggles by UM and ND (where recent is 15 years, lol) and last year by UT haven't affected the NCAA coffers at all. Instead, the success of teams like Stanford, Oregon, and Boise have filled their wallets. Every time someone loses, someone else wins. The successful programs will always bring TV $ no matter who they are.

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I disagree, as was Stated in the SMU documentary, the death penalty for one school can kill revenue for an entire conference...and while National tv may not be affected as much by one team, local tv is affected.

I am generalizing but the fact is lots of different money makers can be affected when a school gets a death penalty and no one wants that to happen now

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Originally Posted by ram29jackson

I disagree, as was Stated in the SMU documentary, the death penalty for one school can kill revenue for an entire conference...and while National tv may not be affected as much by one team, local tv is affected.

I am generalizing but the fact is lots of different money makers can be affected when a school gets a death penalty and no one wants that to happen now

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For instance, our radio station that broadcasts Ohio State football games. We routinely sell anywhere from 40-60 sponsor spots per game. We lose the Ohio State games, and in turn, lose those sponsors who have spots air solely during OSU games, that's thousands of dollars every week that we're losing. As we are a small market, something as little as having a thousand dollars lost can have a huge impact on whether or not we turn a profit for the year or lose money, which directly affects our budget for the next year.