Gamespot's "On The Spot" with NCAA Football 12 - Video & Recap

If people want the Cover 2 zone to automatically be able to stop the skinny post and verticals, what type of offensive plays do you expect to actually be successful? You want the defense to flood the short zones and take away everything short and then still be able to stop all the deep stuff with only two safeties? I'll never gain a yard passing if the Cover 2 could do all that. My biggest problem with the Cover 2 was not being able to hit a quick go route about 20 yards downfield. If you throw it right you should be able to squeeze a pass in between the CB and Safety down the sideline but the super jump/swat always prevented that.

I think what most people would like to see is more variety in the defensive outcomes. We need some random blown coverages and some good and bad defensive plays with the same play calls. The skinny post should be available some times and not others just because a player may make a smart play once and a not so smart play the next time depending on his abilities.

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Originally Posted by Rudy

If people want the Cover 2 zone to automatically be able to stop the skinny post and verticals, what type of offensive plays do you expect to actually be successful? You want the defense to flood the short zones and take away everything short and then still be able to stop all the deep stuff with only two safeties? I'll never gain a yard passing if the Cover 2 could do all that. My biggest problem with the Cover 2 was not being able to hit a quick go route about 20 yards downfield. If you throw it right you should be able to squeeze a pass in between the CB and Safety down the sideline but the super jump/swat always prevented that.

I think what most people would like to see is more variety in the defensive outcomes. We need some random blown coverages and some good and bad defensive plays with the same play calls. The skinny post should be available some times and not others just because a player may make a smart play once and a not so smart play the next time depending on his abilities.

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Cover 2 is actually weak against short passes to the middle, but should not be weak to deeper passes. The Mike linebacker has responsibility to get depth against those routes, and the slot defenders (OLBs, nicklebacks) have responsibilities to wall off any skinny post and force it to bubble to the outside and deep.

There is some variety in cover 2 defenses, but it's safe to say that no zone defense is designed to leave a player wide open over the middle in the 15-25 yard area. That's one of the easiest throws for the QB to make and he will complete it for a big gain every time.

Rudy,

I am not arguing your first point about right play, right time, I get that man. I know zone isn't supposed to shut down everything, but WATCH THAT DRIVE dude, it is seriously swiss cheese defense

I think think its strange that right off the bat we see 7 play drive that includes:

Shotgun run stuffed
Scramble up the middle
Two straight post routes
Vertical for TD
Scramble again for two point

Just being honest man....I LOVE THIS GAME, I can't wait for 12, but doesn't what I just describe sound like a familiar song?

It sounds like for zone to truly be effective they need to UP the pass rush in this game.

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Originally Posted by Jayrah

:D

You gotta think that was on Varsity Default settings. That was some crappy defense by the #1 squad in the land. Community guys have already said it's not that easy. I don't think there's anything to take out of the video.

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I didn't think about that, but you MUST be right....the all-american D in the IGN vids looked WAY better than the defense in the GS vid.....

I can't wait for this to take off. I wonder what was the thinking behind not adding short dreadlocks? I also really want them to get into some video where they show us the custom playbook and how to set it up. Not just the pics they have posted.

You can't just add short dreads. Gotta do short dreads, long tied dreads, long straight AJ Hawk hair, strait hair pony tails, Polynesian pony tails. I hear there was an issue with just getting dreads in the game without screwing up the player model. Maybe it took too long. Maybe they wanted to leave something in that area for next year. Either way, I'm satisfied for now. It gives at least some character to players outside of equipment.

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Originally Posted by Jayrah

You can't just add short dreads. Gotta do short dreads, long tied dreads, long straight AJ Hawk hair, strait hair pony tails, Polynesian pony tails. I hear there was an issue with just getting dreads in the game without screwing up the player model. Maybe it took too long. Maybe they wanted to leave something in that area for next year. Either way, I'm satisfied for now. It gives at least some character to players outside of equipment.

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from what I can tell, the dreads are not even part of the player model, they are just "attached" on, similar to the hand towel.

I still don't think the player models even have an actual head(just a helmet with a face in it), which is why you never see the players with their helmets off and why there is no option for any kind of hair.

best thing from this video for me...

Attachment 174

i have been teaching stick concept this way for a while now... and it may be actually useful to have it in the game with the upgrades to zone... up until now i have just ran flood from a 3x set and hot route the deep out to a stop, and possibly smart route it if needed... this will be dandy to have in the game... glad they are finally catching on to some upgrades of these concepts...

"E"

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Originally Posted by rhombic21

One thing that also sticks out to me is that the computer does a HORRIBLE job with alignment issues. Virtually every play in the video they align with the strong side of the defense to the wrong side.

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Originally Posted by Rudy

This has always been a minor beef for me as a user as well. When I call nickel zone against a 3 WR set, I expect my nickel CB to line up against the slot WR. I shouldn't have to flip the formation every time to make this happen and it completely gives up the fact I'm playing zone.

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Thinking out loud ... what's the solution to this? Have the game automatically flip your play for you? That's not always going to be what you want either. I agree with both of you that it's problematic that it gives away zone coverage, but I'm also not sure of an answer. When I call man coverage, I expect my defense to line up a certain way, and I expect the nickelback to move as appropriate. Because zone coverage (and alignment in general) is dependent on a strength call that is dynamic with the offensive formation, I'm not sure I want the game automatically deciding strength for me -- whether it's for Nickel, Under, Over, or any other adjustments along those lines.

I could see it being setup so that it's an option -- like Auto Pass and the others in the Profile -- but nothing more than that. Thoughts?

i would like to see a selection to turn it on or off for user, but would like to see it auto for CPU

"E"

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Originally Posted by JeffHCross

Thinking out loud ... what's the solution to this? Have the game automatically flip your play for you?

I could see it being setup so that it's an option -- like Auto Pass and the others in the Profile -- but nothing more than that. Thoughts?

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Barring an option to turn it on or off I would like it to automatically flip for us. I do it 95% of the time. It's not a big deal playing against the cpu for me as I just flip it without any penalty. But it just doesn't seem right. I think most people would want the nickel CB on the side of the field that has the two WRs so this would be a good thing for most people. You know me though, I love options and sliders! And if you could send me a PM to let me know they added in game saves I will go freaking bananas!!

EA may be coming along with their passing game (tweaked trajectories, new zone AI, etc.), but they've got a long way to go with their OL/DL play. All day to throw, no push up front, static blocking, huge scrambling lanes up the middle, etc. Hopefully, a low difficulty setting (which this had to be played on) was the main problem. But in any case, the interactions still don't look very dynamic.

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Originally Posted by JeffHCross

Thinking out loud ... what's the solution to this? Have the game automatically flip your play for you? That's not always going to be what you want either. I agree with both of you that it's problematic that it gives away zone coverage, but I'm also not sure of an answer. When I call man coverage, I expect my defense to line up a certain way, and I expect the nickelback to move as appropriate. Because zone coverage (and alignment in general) is dependent on a strength call that is dynamic with the offensive formation, I'm not sure I want the game automatically deciding strength for me -- whether it's for Nickel, Under, Over, or any other adjustments along those lines.

I could see it being setup so that it's an option -- like Auto Pass and the others in the Profile -- but nothing more than that. Thoughts?

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I would think adding a strongside/weakside Nickel formation. Auto flip for whichever side the slot goes. The weakside gives you the option of putting that 3rd cb on the TE or RB.

the solution would be the man lock feature imo.

In real life teams align their defense based on the strength of the formation. If I were EA, I'd be starting there and thinking of ways to replicate the decision keys that real players use when determining where they should line up.

ok, I know we are all talking zones here but I have to comment on the show itself haha.
From all their live streams or going on other shows...the other shows have that laid back slacker approach to them haha.

but this looked more like some conservative religious/ 8th grade private school type approach haha. Buttoned down, shirt collar, subdued conversation...minus the one beer comment haha

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Originally Posted by rhombic21

In real life teams align their defense based on the strength of the formation. If I were EA, I'd be starting there and thinking of ways to replicate the decision keys that real players use when determining where they should line up.

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This is why I think the weakside/strongside approach would work. You don't even have to make a formation for it, just make it an option in the package menu so that your 3rd cb lines up where you want him on any specific play.

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Originally Posted by rhombic21

In real life teams align their defense based on the strength of the formation. If I were EA, I'd be starting there and thinking of ways to replicate the decision keys that real players use when determining where they should line up.

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Yes, but that strength doesn't always mean the two target side, or the slot receiver side. Some teams (and coaches) call strength to the wide side of the field, for example. Other teams declare formations "balanced" in different ways.

Anyway, my primary point is that there's no 100% right answer. There are times you would want it to automatically flip. There are others you wouldn't. Hence my question.

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Originally Posted by xMrHitStickx904

the solution would be the man lock feature imo.

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Man Lock is automatically on, but it only applies to zone. I assume you're meaning that it should automatically apply to zone and autoflip, then?

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Originally Posted by Jayrah

This is why I think the weakside/strongside approach would work. You don't even have to make a formation for it, just make it an option in the package menu so that your 3rd cb lines up where you want him on any specific play.

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This might work. Or have it be on the "Gameplan" screen.

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Originally Posted by JeffHCross

Yes, but that strength doesn't always mean the two target side, or the slot receiver side. Some teams (and coaches) call strength to the wide side of the field, for example. Other teams declare formations "balanced" in different ways.

Anyway, my primary point is that there's no 100% right answer. There are times you would want it to automatically flip. There are others you wouldn't. Hence my question.

Man Lock is automatically on, but it only applies to zone. I assume you're meaning that it should automatically apply to zone and autoflip, then?

This might work. Or have it be on the "Gameplan" screen.

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What I mean is that having the option to turn it off. On PS2 Madden (hate to keep referencing that) , the Man Lock feature could be turned on and off, so alignment in the nickle would be perfect when turned off, this also meant that nobody on defense moved when players were motioned, and flipping the defensive play would not be noticed. It took away all quick passes, and made offense v defense a chess match cause you couldn't tell if your opponent played man or not.

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Originally Posted by xMrHitStickx904

What I mean is that having the option to turn it off. On PS2 Madden (hate to keep referencing that) , the Man Lock feature could be turned on and off, so alignment in the nickle would be perfect when turned off, this also meant that nobody on defense moved when players were motioned, and flipping the defensive play would not be noticed. It took away all quick passes, and made offense v defense a chess match cause you couldn't tell if your opponent played man or not.

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On a per play basis... you can actually turn it on/off. There's not a global setting to apply every time but as your team comes out of the huddle, you hit Triangle and then right stick right (I think) and it will turn it off. Not certain how it works when you're in Nickel and they're in a Slot or Y-Trips as to whether they come across the formation, etc.