Keeping the Game Fresh.

[xMrHitStickx904]

Today, I turned on my PS3 for the first time in awhile, played NCAA 13 & surprisingly - I really enjoyed it. It was a gratifying experience to hop in a random online match, choose Louisiana Tech (my opponent had Clemson), be down 12 at half time, then come back & pull away in the second half. In summation, I played 3 games online, all were competitive, and I chose random teams which made it even more of a challenge. So my question for the community is this - how do you keep NCAA 13 fresh, to the point where you possibly don't get tired of it?

[gschwendt]

A big part of it for me is in ODs, I'm constantly tweaking my offense & defense, finding new wrinkles, coming up with new ideas to implement, etc. I was getting bored with my offense from last season so at the end of last season, I practically revamped my focus and what I wanted to do. So far it's been a lot of fun with it.

[baseballplyrmvp]

there was a thread over on OS a while back about how lowering the ratings of every player by about 10-15 points across the board, really helps the game play great. i also share that train of though, however, the argument could be applied here as well.

lowering the ratings, across the board, would help those "elite" players stand out from the average players. you'd also get a greater sense of what special talents each individual player has. players are way overrated in most of their ratings, that it hurts the game, imo.

i agree, G. dynasty keeps the game fresh, especially once everyone starts getting better teams.

[JeffHCross]

I'll be blunt. If it wasn't for ODs, I'd be done with this game. Only ODs and Death Penalty (or similarly challenging) dynasties are able to keep my interest. And that's not a knock on EA or NCAA, it's just that there's so much else competing for my time and attention.

[Run of Four]

One thing I used to do on the PS2 was I would force myself to only play one formation for an entire game. What it did was force me to choose plays I normally don't and I would try to take more advantage of the complementary plays in the formations like Play Action passes out of power run formations and things like that. I would find myself doing a lot more draws out of shotgun, etc. It seemed to make the game more enjoyable because otherwise I had my typical "favorite plays" I always called. When I simply called plays out of instinct it sometimes felt like I would get into a "rut" and the games didn't feel as fun.

[baseballplyrmvp]

they should bring back the madden IQ from madden 08/09? and put it in the game. it was an adaptive ai that changed virtually every game and made play calls based on your playing strengths. this would replicate a cpu that was executing a gameplan against you, rather than calling random plays. it'd be different for every user and would make the game more challenging as you couldnt always rely on the same plays.

[Run of Four]

I never played Madden so I don't know what that feature was like. Did it work pretty well? That would make it exciting to see if the computer had learned to shut you down and if you would need to develop a new strategy.

[baseballplyrmvp]

I never played Madden so I don't know what that feature was like. Did it work pretty well? That would make it exciting to see if the computer had learned to shut you down and if you would need to develop a new strategy.

what it was, iirc, was basically 4 difficulty sliders, in which it would constantly (game by game basis) adjust the strength of its pass and run defense, as well as the pass and run offense. i dont remember the game very well, but i think it'd be a very good addition, especially compared to what we have now. i can go out and use the same gameplan for 85% of the season.....with the madden IQ, i couldnt do that.

[JeffHCross]

From what I recall, Madden IQ was more adaptive sliders than adaptive AI. So it worked ... okay. But it wouldn't be easily adaptable to Online Dynasty (which is one reason we're unlikely to see it on NCAA). It also took some major swings at the difficulty at first (as adaptive algorithms are going to do), so you could go from a game where you rushed for 300 yards to a game where you rushed for 50, despite not changing either team.

[xMrHitStickx904]

yeah, IMO adaptive AI was not properly implemented the way I thought it was going to be. For myself, just to make things a bit more difficult is to use a variety of playbooks & use plays I'm really comfortable with to give my opponent an advantage.

[jaymo76]

I'll be blunt. If it wasn't for ODs, I'd be done with this game. Only ODs and Death Penalty (or similarly challenging) dynasties are able to keep my interest. And that's not a knock on EA or NCAA, it's just that there's so much else competing for my time and attention.

I agree 100% Jeff. NCAA 13 is a really good game. The problem however is it's the same game we have all been playing for a LONG, LONG TIME. I have played 7 seasons thus far but the current season started back in early September and I still have four games to go. Playing my favourite series has become a challenge because there is just so much other stuff I could play (Port Royale 3, Tropico 4, PC titles, etc.). For me something as simple as having all the FCS teams back and hit stick composure buddles would change everything but sadly I just don't see that happening.

[JeffHCross]

The problem, jaymo, is that we're at the point where the big stick won't move the numbers significantly. You mention FCS teams and Composure, as you have before. Neither of those would be a blip on the radar for me. The big sales movers are going to be significant overhauls, and it's very unlikely we'll see that until the next consoles. At which point we'll probably be back in the "wait, that new feature was in the game three years ago" cycle again, just because of what has to be removed from new systems in order to build a stable game.

[baseballplyrmvp]

At which point we'll probably be back in the "wait, that new feature was in the game three years ago" cycle again, just because of what has to be removed from new systems in order to build a stable game.

aww dammit. not that shit again. :fp:

[baseballplyrmvp]

has anyone been following this thread (http://www.operationsports.com/forums/ncaa-football/591131-new-mindset-new-approach-new-battle-plan.html)over at OS? there's a lot of great stuff and new info about the game, regarding how to really change the gameplay by mass editting the players' ratings.

[morsdraconis]

Apparently someone figured out how to actually breakdown the roster file and inject it back into the game with the changes. Interesting. About god damn time someone tried to do something like that. It's certainly taken them long enough.

[JeffHCross]

Apparently someone figured out how to actually breakdown the roster file and inject it back into the game with the changes. Interesting. About god damn time someone tried to do something like that. It's certainly taken them long enough.We had it available on PS2 for at least a couple years before the PS3 came out. Not quite as nice as the one Xan's cooked up (apparently), but the concept was still there.

Not surprised it exists for 360 but not PS3. 360 has a ton more options with file editing and injection than the PS3 does. College Hoops 2k8 has (had?) an entire sub-culture (for lack of a better term) built around rosters that were edited with a hex editor. It was pretty cool, though the PS3 users were obviously left to their own devices.

[nykia31]

I like to branch out and play offensive and defensive styles that I dont ordinarily play...for a stretch.

That keeps the game fun and interesting for me.

I'll then go back to playing what's more to my personality....but spicing things up with a little variety, keeps things fun.

[Run of Four]

The problem, jaymo, is that we're at the point where the big stick won't move the numbers significantly. You mention FCS teams and Composure, as you have before. Neither of those would be a blip on the radar for me. The big sales movers are going to be significant overhauls, and it's very unlikely we'll see that until the next consoles. At which point we'll probably be back in the "wait, that new feature was in the game three years ago" cycle again, just because of what has to be removed from new systems in order to build a stable game.

I would be so happy if EA would release a downloadable game of the PS2 version that you could play online against friends, etc. That would hold me over until the PS3 or PS4 finally had it right.

[JeffHCross]

In the unlikely event that the PS2 games were ever released as PSN titles, I'd be very surprised to see them include any form of online play. That would require a significant overhaul.

I agree it'd be nice though.

[jaymo76]

I am also up for some major change (but not a loss of features). However, I truly don't want to see anything that resembles Madden's CCM nor do I want to ever see ANALOG passing. Those two things would send me running from this game.

[baseballplyrmvp]

there's a lack of innovation too. it may not be the most popular choice but an over the top play creator would bring a ton of replayability to the game. with all of the new formations and wrinkles we see in all of the spread option offenses, it's time we get some ability to replicate it as best as we can. we've been playing with the same defenses now, since the beginning of time. lol. it'd be awesome to be able to edit the blitz angles of some players, change the default assignments on some players, etc....even create new defenses altogether.

[JeffHCross]

The reason it's not "the most popular choice", MVP, is the fear of exploits. If they could limit the potential for exploits, I'd be all for a play creator. That's why I've been a fan of the "simple" play creator that just allows you to use existing routes / hot routes with existing formations. The one thing I'd want to avoid is something like the NFL Head Coach 09 play creator. Within a week of launch their servers had seemingly nothing but exploit plays uploaded. Guys making formations that, if they were even legal, would never be used. Blitz plays that involved bringing all 11. Stuff like that.

[Oneback]

We've been playing with the same defenses now, since the beginning of time. lol. it'd be awesome to be able to edit the blitz angles of some players, change the default assignments on some players, etc....even create new defenses altogether.

This has been my #1 complaint. Defenses in this game are highly simplistic and we've seen the same defense, with a few additions, since what 2003. I can't imagine how many games I've played since that time. For those of us that have been playing the game since then are able to call the defense before the snap with a high degree of accuracy, we're all veteran quarterbacks that have seen it all. The only thing that really stops the offense is the lack of execution by the digital players.



The reason it's not "the most popular choice", MVP, is the fear of exploits. If they could limit the potential for exploits, I'd be all for a play creator. That's why I've been a fan of the "simple" play creator that just allows you to use existing routes / hot routes with existing formations. The one thing I'd want to avoid is something like the NFL Head Coach 09 play creator. Within a week of launch their servers had seemingly nothing but exploit plays uploaded. Guys making formations that, if they were even legal, would never be used. Blitz plays that involved bringing all 11. Stuff like that.

To add-on, there are a many number of things that much be fixed/implemented before a full blown play editor could be implemented. There isn't one defense in the game, other than blitzes, that are designed to stop the zone read and those are glitched. I could go on for quite awhile pointing out the issues with the defenses, but there's a reason why people hate playing others that hot route all game, just imagine what it would be like if there was a play editor. The sad thing is you don't even need to make plays that are designed to beat the AI to break the defenses.

Maybe one day.

[baseballplyrmvp]

there have always been exploits jeff, even in the game we have now. i'm sure IOU could come up with a list miles long of online exploits that people use now, so what difference does it make if more exploits are added?

if we're talking exploits in online lobbies only, a new room could be created that would not allow custom playbooks. i dont know what all is involved, but i'm sure there's something ea could come up with to make it so that people could have the option to ONLY play against people using a stock playbook or an option to allow any kind of custom playbook made. people should know by now that there are enough goontards out there, that they should play in the lobbies at their own risk. the amount of bullshit that goes on in some of those games was enough for me to quit the lobbies altogether in 08. i think i've only tried 3 or 4 online lobby games since 08 was released.

same kind of thing for online dynasties....the commish could have an option to allow to disallow created plays. at the very least, there should be a house rule for every user/user game to not allow created plays if people are concerned.

whatever people do offline, is their own thing. if they want to come up with an 11 man blitz, thats fine.

[JeffHCross]

there have always been exploits jeff, even in the game we have now. i'm sure IOU could come up with a list miles long of online exploits that people use now, so what difference does it make if more exploits are added? The difference is that a lot of those exploits A) Take a while to setup, on offense, or B) Are impossible to setup on defense against a quick snap. As Oneback alluded to, both he and I have played against a guy that "knows" every exploit in the game, and will endlessly hot route to setup some play he knows. A simple play editor would be dangerous enough for him, because then he could set up all of his ridiculous plays ahead of time.

Now imagine a full blown editor that allows you to move players around, call different route combinations, etc. There'd be a load of bullshit going on. And that's assuming the editor was intelligent enough to recognize illegal plays. And with the game already having exploits, as you mentioned, would we really want a system that introduces new ones?

[morsdraconis]

A full blown online usage play editor is NEVER a good idea. The only way it could possible work correctly is if they only allowed them in ODs, because, then, at least, the commish could regulate them (all created plays would have to be revealed and OK'd beforehand) and, even that sounds like a LOT of bullshit to go through just to keep the game fresh when it otherwise is the same stale template.

[baseballplyrmvp]

The difference is that a lot of those exploits A) Take a while to setup, on offense, or B) Are impossible to setup on defense against a quick snap. As Oneback alluded to, both he and I have played against a guy that "knows" every exploit in the game, and will endlessly hot route to setup some play he knows. A simple play editor would be dangerous enough for him, because then he could set up all of his ridiculous plays ahead of time.

ok...but thats one player. is it fair to let one player who knows every cheat in the books to destroy it for everyone?


Now imagine a full blown editor that allows you to move players around, call different route combinations, etc. There'd be a load of bullshit going on. And that's assuming the editor was intelligent enough to recognize illegal plays. And with the game already having exploits, as you mentioned, would we really want a system that introduces new ones?

i'm a dynasty guy only. i'll never play the online lobbies again, because its not fun for me to try and play bullshit/goon-tard football. fortunately, i've really only had one big problem with the several od's i've been in the past couple of years, and that guy was a big online lobby player.

my answer to your last point/question, yes, i'd still want a play creator/editor. in my mind, the advantages of what it brings and how much fun it'd be to truly create a playbook outweigh the disadvantages of playing glitch-football against dumbasses. however, even that isnt guaranteed, as the only time i'd come across those type of dumbasses would be in od's. i cant speak for everyone though, but thats my line of thinking.

[JeffHCross]

But, back to your original point, the reason why it isn't the most popular item on the wishlist is that for every guy who is OD only (like you and me), there one or two that are Lobby only (like I OU). So :dunno: