NCAA Football 13: Gameplay Webcast - Recap

[cdj]

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5236/7085039395_67dd32c59f_z.jpg

Tuesday afternoon, EA SPORTS held their NCAA Football 13 Gameplay Webcast (http://www.livestream.com/easports?&rsvptoeventid=432293) in which they announced gameplay features and improvements coming to the game.

Among the areas of focus to gameplay in NCAA Football 13 are a new Total Control Passing Mechanic (including new pass trajectories), a new catching system (including 430+ new catch animations), Read & React Defensive AI, improved punt coverage and return formations, as well as option, playcalling, and custom playbook improvements, among other changes.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K03HzvQliY0

Gameplay Improvements:
- All-new Pump Fake
- All-new Shovel Pass
- New Dropbacks (20+ new animations)
- New Play-Action Abort Fake
- New Play-Action Pick Up Blitz
- Throw on the Run Animations
- Multiple Pass Trajectories (20+ new; new zones/ball speeds)
- Receiver Route Awareness
- 430+ New Catch Animations
- Enhanced Option Pitch
- Improved Punt Coverage
- Read & React Defenders

Media Articles & Video:
ESPN Video Games - 'NCAA Football 13 ends psychic defense (http://espn.go.com/blog/playbook/tech/post/_/id/167/)' by Jon Robinson
IGN - 'Tweaking the Gameplay of NCAA Football 13 (http://ps3.ign.com/articles/122/1223154p1.html)' by Greg Miller
Kotaku - 'A Backup Quarterback Pushes You to be Better in NCAA Football 13 (http://kotaku.com/5902407/a-backup-quarterback-pushes-you-to-be-better-in-ncaa-football-13)' by Owen Good
Game Informer - 'NCAA Football 13 Strengthens Its Aerial Attack (http://www.gameinformer.com/games/ncaa_football_13/b/ps3/archive/2012/04/17/ncaa-football-13-strengthens-its-aerial-attack.aspx)' by Matthew Kato
G4TV - NCAA Football 13 Gameplay Preview (http://www.g4tv.com/videos/58207/ncaa-football-13-gameplay-preview/) (Video)

Official EA SPORTS Blog:
'NCAA Football 13 - Gameplay (http://www.ea.com/ncaa-football/blog/ncaa-football-13-gameplay)' by Larry Richart
'NCAA Football 13 - Community Gameplay (http://www.ea.com/ncaa-football/blog/ncaa-football-13-community-gameplay)' by Chris Jacobs


Click HERE to view the LiveStream event right here at TGT (http://www.thegamingtailgate.com/forums/content.php?558-NCAA-Football-13-Gameplay-Webcast-on-April-17).

***

You can view the page at http://www.thegamingtailgate.com/forums/content.php?558-NCAA-Football-13-Gameplay-Webcast-on-April-17

[JBHuskers]

As always, if you can't watch it live, you'll be able to catch a replay at anytime (at the same link I believe).

[JerzeyReign]

As a football coach (youth) I just have one pet peeve besides it being a little brother photo -- why in the hell do they are in their gameday jersey during contact days? Don't know why it bugs me but it does...

[baseballplyrmvp]

2 MORE HOURS!!!!!!!! http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-happy093.gif

[cdj]

Discussion of player equipment & gear has been moved to the more appropriate Sights & Sounds thread (http://www.thegamingtailgate.com/forums/showthread.php?4839-NCAA-Football-13-Playbook-1-Sights-and-Sounds-Revealed).

[Jcoop9]

Do or die with this one.....:))

[baseballplyrmvp]

9 MORE MINUTES!!!!!!!! http://www.freesmileys.org/smileys/smiley-happy093.gif

[CLW]

300 viewers with 2 minutes to go.

[CLW]

Wow right on time and everything. Impressive!

[xMrHitStickx904]

Well, time to see what this is all about.

[baseballplyrmvp]

nickell robey is #21 for the trojans....not 37.
robert woods is #2 not 13

:fp: if they need a roster for :USC:, there's one in the random college football thread. i'll add #'s for em if they need it.

edit: nvm. ben just said something. lol

[xMrHitStickx904]

rosters don't get done until May sir.


new screen dropbacks look very nice.

[xMrHitStickx904]

pump fake dropbacks, shovel passes in.

[psuexv]

Hopefully they take that hand off of the changing of players to the defense side as well. It's all fine and great for user catching but I hate it when I try to switch to the rusher and it switches me to a DB

[psuexv]

Really really hope that awareness plays into account with this new catching. Like with the blitzing CB and the WR looks right away. Obviously that comes with awareness, hopefully Fr Wrs aren't doing this right away

[Kwizzy]

Really really hope that awareness plays into account with this new catching. Like with the blitzing CB and the WR looks right away. Obviously that comes with awareness, hopefully Fr Wrs aren't doing this right away

Im working to get confirmation on whetheror not that is the case. I'll let you know what I hear.

[CLW]

Thoughts so far:

#1 - Cool that an actual college QB is in charge of gameplay

#2 - Good resources/staff on gameplay has been doubled

#3 - How the hell do we know where to pre-order from w/o knowing anything about the new Heisman Mode?

#4 - Annoyed that everyone uses Twitter now to hand pick the questions they want with the farce of pretending to care what "real people" think

#5 - Wasn't leading passes with L stick already in the game?

#6 - Trajectory - how is it different from what we have now? Sounds like the exact same system where you can throw Moon Balls or Bullets but it looks allot better.

#7 - Dropbacks - looked good - in the past there has always been theories that if you manually dropped back your pass protection was worse than if you auto dropped back. Any truth to this?

#8 - Auto Pump fake - not sure how I feel about that. Visions of trying to push the pass button to avoid a sack right during an auto pump fake

#9 - Throw on Run - sounds good is there a throw on run rating to seperate the QBs who are bad/good at it?

#10 - Shovel - wishes there were shovel pass plays

#11 - Pump Fakes - couldn't we already pump to a specific receiver?

#12 - Glad they slowed down the QB movement while standing in the pocket

#13 - Play Action - abort play action hopefully will save me some sacks

#14 - Catching - 100% Catch Coverage - are they saying that an even higher % of passes are going to be caught? Go lord it has to be already 75% + either caught or INT. Do NOT like making user catching being EASIER than it already is!

#15 - Timing - Interesting that receiver will only catch the ball if you user catch it when it is dimmed out - LOL only the CPU calls Engage 8 - Due to #14 above I don't think Timing is going to be that big of a deal b/c apparently anyone can just user catch now

[I OU a Beatn]

Slowed down user catches...that's a nice little way to try to remove the rocket catches. I guess time will tell as to whether it'll work or not.

[baseballplyrmvp]

pretty offensive heavy gameplay changes. anything gonna change for defense besides the read/react ai?

[xMrHitStickx904]

Passing might be easier than it's ever been. My goodness. Like the additions.

[ram29jackson]

they allowed an end zone pose...?

[CLW]

Slowed down user catches...that's a nice little way to try to remove the rocket catches. I guess time will tell as to whether it'll work or not.

I heard that as they are making it easier to user/rocket catch but perhaps I'm wrong.

[baseballplyrmvp]

holy shit! different zone depths!

[gschwendt]

I don't want to take complete credit for getting correct/realistic alignment/assignment in but yeah...

[psuexv]

I don't want to take complete credit for getting correct/realistic alignment/assignment in but yeah...

:D :D :D :D :D

[baseballplyrmvp]

I don't want to take complete credit for getting correct/realistic alignment/assignment in but yeah...lol

[xMrHitStickx904]

EA messed around and added Madden PS2 pre-snap adjustments. Yup, I like it.

[baseballplyrmvp]

"alright, i'll send this guy in motion.....alright, man coverage.....hut.....oh shit, oh shit, oh shit, its zone!"

[psuexv]

"alright, i'll send this guy in motion.....alright, man coverage.....hut.....oh shit, oh shit, oh shit, its zone!"

:up:

[baseballplyrmvp]

alright.....who was it that hugged larry? cdj?

[I OU a Beatn]

I heard that as they are making it easier to user/rocket catch but perhaps I'm wrong.

In order to rocket catch, you have to be able to jerk the receiver in a quick motion to get him turned around. If they're slowing that down, it's going to make rocket catch a lot harder if not impossible. Definitely a good thing if it works.

Love all the new features. I love the different pass trajectory, I love the defenders have to react to the receiver's cut before making a cut themselves, I love the ability to disquise defenses, I love the new punt returns, options, etc...

It all sounds amazing, but it always sounds amazing. Hopefully it plays just as well. One thing I'm going to point out is just how bad the pass rush still is. The QB still has 5 or 6 seconds to throw against a 4 man rush which is simply unacceptable. Hopefully edge blitzing works a lot better this year to kind of offset that.

[xMrHitStickx904]

man ... I said I wasn't gonna get excited, but I'd be fool to say that I'm not. Love the improvements on paper. Still not a fan of the "handicap" for those with no user skills, but it is what it is. The PS2 version of Man Align & Man Lock is a huge addition.

[ram29jackson]

I don't want to take complete credit for getting correct/realistic alignment/assignment in but yeah...

i'm sure you and oneback both could take a little credit

[CLW]

Thoughts 2.0:

#16 Read/React - Wait/See approach on if they eliminate psychic DBs by CPU. ?: if I user control the defender must my player be able to see the ball to swat?

#17 Defensive Allignment - Thank God this has allegedly been improved/fixed! Way EASIER to hide coverages!!!
#18 - Glad Punts Coverage/Returns got redone.

#19 - Option - Animations look better but not sure it will affect the game play any. I don't like the term boost when referring to something.

#20 - Love the new hot routes for RBs/FBs

#21 - Wait/See on alleged improvements to CPU AI on play calling/clock management

#22 - Custom Playbooks - sounds like they improved most of the "screw ups" from last year

Overall, generally/largely unimpressed as most of these changes seem "minor" (although mostly good changes) and the rest I have just been "burned" with these same alleged improvements for years so I just don't believe them when they say CPU playcalling clock management is better. Also concerned that an already WIDE OPEN gameplay was just made even more offense friendly. If this is it in terms of gameplay 13 is really 12.5 as nothing really seemed to be a "game changer" in terms of these improvements.

Liked that they pointed out the bug they were aware of but seriously stop saying "this isn't final". It's like an odd excuse that divides the community about whether to ask questions/complain about what they see.

[cdj]

alright.....who was it that hugged larry? cdj?

Ha! No....While I like the improvement, I didn't hug Larry.

[gschwendt]

So real quick... no overhauls for Line Play, WR/DB Interactions, nor Special teams but each has been touched and tuned.

I gotta travel tonight so I can't really stick around to answer many questions but I'll try to hit on a few before I leave. As well, post in the Q&A thread (http://www.thegamingtailgate.com/forums/showthread.php?4902-NCAA-Football-13-Q-amp-A-Sights-Sounds-amp-Gameplay) and I'll do my best to get as detailed as I can since I'll be hands on with the game this week.

[WolverineJay]

I absolutely love the changes and new additions to the game. I feel like the gameplay should finally be more sim and way less arcade. Only things I didn't see addressed are Line play and penalties. What goes on in the trenches so to speak is probably the most important factor on how successful you are on gameday. I would appreciate it if the CD guys would chime in on those two legacy issues.

Ok I see G has addressed some areas that weren't overhauled, but what about penalties? Any tuning or changes to them?

[baseballplyrmvp]

they didnt talk about weight/momentum.....was anything changed regarding that?

i keep coming back to this extreme example but its a good indicator of how flawed some aspects of the game are.

you can edit a d-tackle to be 7'0" tall, 400 lbs, but only a 50 ovr rating, and have him line up over an offensive guard who's 5'5" tall, 160 lbs, but a 99 ovr; and the guard will hold the d-tackle back all game long. a sumo wrestler vs a 6th grader in a shoving match....and the 6th grader wins?

[xMrHitStickx904]

they didnt talk about weight/momentum.....was anything changed regarding that?

i keep coming back to this extreme example but its a good indicator of how flawed some aspects of the game are.

you can edit a d-tackle to be 7'0" tall, 400 lbs, but only a 50 ovr rating, and have him line up over an offensive guard who's 5'5" tall, 160 lbs, but a 99 ovr; and the guard will hold the d-tackle back all game long. a sumo wrestler vs a 6th grader in a shoving match....and the 6th grader wins?

Honestly, I don't this engine allows for all of that. At least to the degree that we want it to be.

[I OU a Beatn]

So real quick... no overhauls for Line Play, WR/DB Interactions, nor Special teams but each has been touched and tuned.

I gotta travel tonight so I can't really stick around to answer many questions but I'll try to hit on a few before I leave. As well, post in the Q&A thread (http://www.thegamingtailgate.com/forums/showthread.php?4902-NCAA-Football-13-Q-amp-A-Sights-Sounds-amp-Gameplay) and I'll do my best to get as detailed as I can since I'll be hands on with the game this week.

Did you feel as though the pass rush was able to get there quicker than last year consistently? Last year it was basically an instant sack or 8 seconds to throw the ball.

[illwill10]

So real quick... no overhauls for Line Play, WR/DB Interactions, nor Special teams but each has been touched and tuned.

I gotta travel tonight so I can't really stick around to answer many questions but I'll try to hit on a few before I leave. As well, post in the Q&A thread (http://www.thegamingtailgate.com/forums/showthread.php?4902-NCAA-Football-13-Q-amp-A-Sights-Sounds-amp-Gameplay) and I'll do my best to get as detailed as I can since I'll be hands on with the game this week.
I will try to find that thread. I have 2 questions to ask about Gamplay.

[baseballplyrmvp]

they didnt talk about weight/momentum.....was anything changed regarding that?

i keep coming back to this extreme example but its a good indicator of how flawed some aspects of the game are.

you can edit a d-tackle to be 7'0" tall, 400 lbs, but only a 50 ovr rating, and have him line up over an offensive guard who's 5'5" tall, 160 lbs, but a 99 ovr; and the guard will hold the d-tackle back all game long. a sumo wrestler vs a 6th grader in a shoving match....and the 6th grader wins?


Honestly, I don't this engine allows for all of that. At least to the degree that we want it to be.oh, i know it can be done. i was playing madden 11 last night, and i had a 260 lb center who was driven 6 yards back into my quarterback by terrance cody in a 1 on 1 engagement. madden 11 had this!

i'm not talking about an all out physics type of engine. i just want to see the line play move. i want to see a road-grading (330 lbs+) right guard and tackle be able to drive defenders 10 yards downfield. i wanna see a 350 lb d-tackle drive an o-lineman back into the qb just because of how much bigger he is than the o-lineman. i want to see these kinds of things.

[baseballplyrmvp]

dp

[WolverineJay]

Any changes or tuning to the non-option running game? Can the user tell the difference between a power back(I was one and I haven't felt the game replicates this accurately since NCAA 06) and a finesse back(Jukes, running to daylight, avoiding contact)?

[psuexv]

Definitely will be interested to hear more about the WR catching. As was stated in one of the other threads, it will be interesting for example if I read a blitz and my WR doesn't, but I throw the ball with a little more lob to get it there slower will he be able to turn and see the ball to make a catch.

[Gotmadskillzson]

1. No mention of WR/DB jostling.

2. No mention of improving OL/DL interaction.

3. No mention of fixing the pass rush for DEs.

4. No mention of CPU ball carriers actually using their special moves: Spin, Juke, Stiff arm

5. No mention of fixing the elusive animation for it don't look like the damn truck animation.

6. No mention of punt blocks or FG blocks.

7. No mention of CPU punters doing coffin corner kicks in the right situation instead of just kicking it into the end zone.

8. No mention of pass interference.

9. No mention of fixing the bull rush animation.

10. No mention of expanded ratings, new ratings, DPP, improvements to locomotion.

11. No mention of fixing the QB from sliding when he only has 1 defender in front of him.

[Avross]

I was thinking to myself about how bad madden is compared to NCAA which is the real bread winner for EA it's strange we haven't heard any news from madden 13. Besides Nike uniforms. I actually like playing madden 12 online. I think they got alot of things to talk about in order to be talked bout with NCAA series. NCAA have done some major improving in the last 3yrs. It's funny they push NCAA to the limits everytime just imagine what's gone happen with the new gen consoles. They will have so much more space to add more plays animations teams specific traditions. Maybe spring games it's endless. Im Sure they are working on it now

[Kwizzy]

Long story short here fellas, Line play was NOT the focus this year. I know it's disappointing for many of us who have it ranked as the top gameplay item, but it it what it is. The decision was made to focus on the passing game aspects discussed in the playbook. Now, as someone who typically focusses on the run game (especially from the shotgun & pistol) I was pretty dsappointed when the gameplay enhancements were announced but only because they are not in MY most important areas. 2 of my top 3-4 wishlist items were OL/DL play & momentum in interactions. This is not to say that things haven't been tuned because, as G said, they have done some with it. The overhaul many hoped for was not in the plans this year. Disappointing for many I know, but once you deal with that fact, read on.

(Please note that I have only been able to attend the January event this year so many of my opinions are based on presentations given and conversations with the devs about the features they were working on. CDJ, JB, and G have had more recent time with the game so they'd be better judges of implementation.)

That all being said, the areas that they DID focus on are very impressive and spot on. The things they have set out to address will greatly impact the passing game. None of these improvements are fluff IMO. They are details, no matter how minor, that will greatly reduce some of the frustrating BS that has happened in the passing game in recent years. I will try to post a more detailed list of my thoughts later but just to sum up my general thoughts I'd say: Not the direction I'd personally hoped for but still a very stong & needed Gameplay feature set.

[gschwendt]

#3 - How the hell do we know where to pre-order from w/o knowing anything about the new Heisman Mode?
#5 - Wasn't leading passes with L stick already in the game?
#6 - Trajectory - how is it different from what we have now? Sounds like the exact same system where you can throw Moon Balls or Bullets but it looks allot better.
#16 Read/React - Wait/See approach on if they eliminate psychic DBs by CPU. ?: if I user control the defender must my player be able to see the ball to swat?

3-Wait until the Heisman Mode playbook :)
5-It was, but this is definitely to a much larger degree. It's similar to the past but far from the same
6-As I understand it, there are different lobs so if you're throwing a 10 yard lob, it won't go to as high an extreme versus a 40 yard lob.
16-I'm not 100% certain but I'm fairly sure that you'll still have user control over those things. I'll do some testing this week.


I absolutely love the changes and new additions to the game. I feel like the gameplay should finally be more sim and way less arcade. Only things I didn't see addressed are Line play and penalties. What goes on in the trenches so to speak is probably the most important factor on how successful you are on gameday. I would appreciate it if the CD guys would chime in on those two legacy issues.

Ok I see G has addressed some areas that weren't overhauled, but what about penalties? Any tuning or changes to them?
Trust me, they know that we want line play addressed, I assure you of that. It's not happening this year unfortunately but they know how big of a complaint this is. As for penalties, I'm not aware of any specifics on that... I'll try to find out more but from a personal standpoint, that's never been a huge issue from the community until this year (NCAA12). I think the OL/DL, WR/DB, and Special Teams have always drowned those out, at least in my mind.

they didnt talk about weight/momentum.....was anything changed regarding that?

i keep coming back to this extreme example but its a good indicator of how flawed some aspects of the game are.

you can edit a d-tackle to be 7'0" tall, 400 lbs, but only a 50 ovr rating, and have him line up over an offensive guard who's 5'5" tall, 160 lbs, but a 99 ovr; and the guard will hold the d-tackle back all game long. a sumo wrestler vs a 6th grader in a shoving match....and the 6th grader wins?I don't know if they made any specific changes to that this year but I know that last year that was improved... weight particularly mattered in blocking matchups. That said, ratings are going to override characteristics... otherwise, what is the purpose of having those ratings.


Did you feel as though the pass rush was able to get there quicker than last year consistently? Last year it was basically an instant sack or 8 seconds to throw the ball.
I haven't seen the game since January so I really can't give very good impression on that. However I'll certainly look at it while I'm down there this week.

Any changes or tuning to the non-option running game? Can the user tell the difference between a power back(I was one and I haven't felt the game replicates this accurately since NCAA 06) and a finesse back(Jukes, running to daylight, avoiding contact)?I don't believe they gave any particular focus to that but that's not to say that small tuning couldn't improve it somehwat. I'll take a look and give you some feedback on what I see.

[WolverineJay]

Thanks Kwizzy. I see what you're saying and do wish other areas were the main focus for gameplay in 13'. I really think it would be in EA Tiburon's and us as a community best interests to have the first community day whenever they are deciding what to focus on gameplay wise. I understand you guys like me want the best game possible but it seems your hands are tied on how much of an impact you can truly make if the decisions are made and implemented before you even get there. Having said that I'm sure you do your best to give feedback in the areas of the game that need serious overhaul and improvement.

Thanks G for taking the time to answer our questions. I do appreciate what all you CD guys do each year.

[illwill10]

Any changes to playbook and Dline play?

[gschwendt]

Any changes to playbook and Dline play?What changes are you looking for in each area? As mentioned, no overhaul to OL/DL interactions but if there's something else you're looking at specifically, let us know.

[xMrHitStickx904]

Any changes to playbook and Dline play?

Read Kwizzy's post sir.

[illwill10]

Long story short here fellas, Line play was NOT the focus this year. I know it's disappointing for many of us who have it ranked as the top gameplay item, but it it what it is. The decision was made to focus on the passing game aspects discussed in the playbook. Now, as someone who typically focusses on the run game (especially from the shotgun & pistol) I was pretty dsappointed when the gameplay enhancements were announced but only because they are not in MY most important areas. 2 of my top 3-4 wishlist items were OL/DL play & momentum in interactions. This is not to say that things haven't been tuned because, as G said, they have done some with it. The overhaul many hoped for was not in the plans this year. Disappointing for many I know, but once you deal with that fact, read on.

([
I am run-first guy. There were alot of games where if I had 60+ plays on offense, I ran 40+, even 50 times a game. I recruited 2-3 RBs at a time. If i didnt have 200 yards rushing a game or had a big advantage in TOP, I was disappointed. But, I run majority out of pro-style formations.
I was actually hoping for a realistic rb touch slider. I want to run a RBBC offense like LSU. But, I dont want to make serious changes to fatigue slider that will keep my star RB out.

[illwill10]

What changes are you looking for in each area? As mentioned, no overhaul to OL/DL interactions but if there's something else you're looking at specifically, let us know.
I dont know why I put Playbook there. I meant run game.
As far as DLine, I want to know if DTs arent overpowered as they were last year and if DEs have a bigger impact. I can deal with OL play as far as no double team pass blocking and almost entire offense syncing up and blocking every defender on a run play.

As far a run Game, I want to know about any changes to break tackle animations

[WolverineJay]

I'm taking it that the QB Ratings from Madden still haven't come over to NCAA? Short, Medium, Deep Passing Accuracy, Throw on the Run, and Playaction. I was really hoping with the passing game changes this would be included.

Even if it was generic like a Scrambler would have low PA ability but a very high Throw on the Run rating and a pocket passer would have terrible ability to throw on the run. If they aren't in can Awareness be tuned in somehow to make it where higher AWR Qb's are better at PA and get more bites on the play fake or pump fake although not ideal it would still help make the smart veteran QB stand out over the young inexperienced QB.

[Kwizzy]

Thanks Kwizzy. I see what you're saying and do wish other areas were the main focus for gameplay in 13'. I really think it would be in EA Tiburon's and us as a community best interests to have the first community day whenever they are deciding what to focus on gameplay wise. I understand you guys like me want the best game possible but it seems your hands are tied on how much of an impact you can truly make if the decisions are made and implemented before you even get there. Having said that I'm sure you do your best to give feedback in the areas of the game that need serious overhaul and improvement.

Thanks G for taking the time to answer our questions. I do appreciate what all you CD guys do each year.

I actually think that the January event is a a perfect point to get the community events started. It's early enough in the cycle to still have a real impact in the game (At least one really HUGE thing that I noticed from our first event conversations was added that wouldn't have been in the game) while being late enough in the cycle for us to be hands on with some of the stuff that's already done. If we went any earlier we wouldn't be able to test out anything directly.

As for bringing us in while they are deciding what to include in this year's game: They have our lists from the end of the event in January. I know my list and others include not only feedback on the current game, but a Top 3-10 items for each area for next year. On top of that, they constantly look on community sites & their own social networking accounts for feedback as well. All of that is factored in to the decision making process and with that they decide on a feature set.

As an example here are my Top 6 Items for NCAA 14 taken directly from my notes in January:


NCAA 14 Top 6 Gameplay Items:
1.OL/DL Interactions (Including momentum conservation)
2.Pursuit Angles and Realistic Run Fits
3.WR Blocking (In both running plays & in WR Screens)
4.New Win/Loss Animations
5.CPU AI Execution (Especially the QBs & HBs)
6.Special Teams Overhaul


*Edit*-I should note that Item 5 will be on my list until the day I can't tell whether I'm playing the CPU or a human player at all.

[WolverineJay]

I actually think that the January event is a a perfect point to get the community events started. It's early enough in the cycle to still have a real impact in the game (At least one really HUGE thing that I noticed from our first event conversations was added that wouldn't have been in the game) while being late enough in the cycle for us to be hands on with some of the stuff that's already done. If we went any earlier we wouldn't be able to test out anything directly.

NCAA 14 Top 6 Gameplay Items:
1.OL/DL Interactions (Including momentum conservation)
2.Pursuit Angles and Realistic Run Fits
3.WR Blocking (In both running plays & in WR Screens)
4.New Win/Loss Animations
5.CPU AI Execution (Especially the QBs & HBs)
6.Special Teams Overhaul

This is why I still think it would be in everyone's best interest to go in earlier and then again after the final decisions are made(like your January event) on what the next version will focus on. That way I think that one huge item that you got into NCAA 13 might have been 3 or 4, but who knows its all speculation on my part.

[Kwizzy]

This is why I still think it would be in everyone's best interest to go in earlier and then again after the final decisions are made(like your January event) on what the next version will focus on. That way I think that one huge item that you got into NCAA 13 might have been 3 or 4, but who knows its all speculation on my part.

To be clear, I'm not saying there's only 1 but that 1 really jumped out at me as Legend was giving his presentation. While I see what you're saying, I don't know that there would be value in making a trip before Jan. We are in pretty consistent contact with EA with regards to the community's feedback & wishlists. A good example of this is the TGT Wishlist tournament. You can ask CDJ, JB & G for more details but, one of the reasons it has become more broken out into different areas of the game & takes place earlier in the year now is a direct result to conversations with the devs as to how to make that bracket have as much impact as possible. I have personally been asked a dozen times "How'd we do addressing the tournament results?". So there are mechanisms inplace & constantly being tweaked to allow for more community impact. The events without the game there to be played would be pretty worthless IMO.

[baseballplyrmvp]

I don't know if they made any specific changes to that this year but I know that last year that was improved... weight particularly mattered in blocking matchups. That said, ratings are going to override characteristics... otherwise, what is the purpose of having those ratings.
thanks for the responce tommy. in responce to the bold, its absolutely true....and i'm not gonna question that.

however, in the example i referenced, i dont expect a 50 ovr 400 lb dt to toss aside a 99 ovr 160 lb guard like he's a ragdoll. that shouldnt happen due to the ratings. i fully expect the guard to stay in front of the dt and in-between the dt and the qb. from what we were told a couple of years ago, the run and pass block strength and footwork ratings are only used when a defender uses a particular move against them, and the generic run and pass block are used to get in position to block. even with that though, the 400 lb dt doesnt need to pull a move to have an impact in the game. he (dt) should still be able to push back the guard into the qb even if his moves arent working against the guard.

but hey, the additions they did make look awesome.

[WolverineJay]

To be clear, I'm not saying there's only 1 but that 1 really jumped out at me as Legend was giving his presentation. While I see what you're saying, I don't know that there would be value in making a trip before Jan. We are in pretty consistent contact with EA with regards to the community's feedback & wishlists. A good example of this is the TGT Wishlist tournament. You can ask CDJ, JB & G for more details but, one of the reasons it has become more broken out into different areas of the game & takes place earlier in the year now is a direct result to conversations with the devs as to how to make that bracket have as much impact as possible. I have personally been asked a dozen times "How'd we do addressing the tournament results?". So there are mechanisms inplace & constantly being tweaked to allow for more community impact. The events without the game there to be played would be pretty worthless IMO.
True they do have the wishlist tournament results to look at prior to the community events. And I do understand that a community event without the ability to actually play the game would be not as helpful to EA Tiburon as it is currently when you can give them immediate feedback after playing the new game.

[baseballplyrmvp]

question on the shovel pass.....does your rb have to have a certain route called or does it just happen if he's set to block?

[Kwizzy]

question on the shovel pass.....does your rb have to have a certain route called or does it just happen if he's set to block?

My understanding is that if he is a reciever (ie-has a button assigned to him) and he is pretty close to the QB, then throwing the ball to him should result in a shovel animation where appropriate. I can't remember off the top of my head, but does a HB who is blocking have an icon still?

[ram29jackson]

...430 new catch animations...

dear God, those penn State whites look great on my new screen LOL

[steelerfan]

Just watched the webcast. There were a ton of tweaks discussed and I'm excited, in particular, for a few of them.

Number one, for me, is the ability to disguise coverages. That is huge. I'm hoping to see the day when zone coverage is as effective (relative to the specifics of the situation) as man. This is a big step towards that (and to getting me out of the habit of calling so much Cover 2 Man).

I like the changes in the punt game. I was hoping for a serious special teams overhaul, but this is a good start. At least something was addressed.

I love the read and react stuff. The video that showed the USC QB dropping a pass in over #46 for Oregon was nice. In the past, that one is broken up or picked.

I like that alot of QB animations have been sped up. Particularly the deep ball delivery. That bothered me alot in 12.

I'm also happy to see so many new catch animations. There was too much weird warping to overcome angles in the receiving game last year. It really made it tough to get nice looking highlights (particularly photos).

That's it off the top of my head. We'll see how all of this pans out in July. Till then, I'm looking forward to the Dynasty webcast.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk 2

[Cane305]

They do anything on defense to stop the four vertical plays or the deep ball in general? In 12 you could run four verts every play and someone would always be open.

[volstopfan14]

Sorry, posted in the worng thread.

[AustinWolv]

They do anything on defense to stop the four vertical plays or the deep ball in general? In 12 you could run four verts every play and someone would always be open.

No shit. Encountered that yet again last night.

Be interesting to see how shovel pass is tuned. Looks like another tool for the cheesers.

[Cane305]

No shit. Encountered that yet again last night.

Be interesting to see how shovel pass is tuned. Looks like another tool for the cheesers.

Yea would be nice if they made the defense play well enough for the user to actually have to open the play book and use more then 3-4 rotating plays that work 99% of the time....

[Rudy]

There was a lot of impressive stuff in there. New animations for throwing and catching, new drop backs, new trajectories, better defensive alignment, no psychic defense (allegedly), better option plays and punt blocking. But all of that stuff focused on the user. We heard nothing about how the cpu will execute any of these new tools. EA has never had the cpu run the spread right. Oregon has always been way too easy to beat and stop. Will the cpu RBs use special moves and show some personality? Will the cpu throw the ball to their top WRs? It's like playing LeBron in an NBA game and he only takes 5 shots. These improvements are great but if you don't see the cpu use them like a human it's pointless for an offline gamer like me. Unfortunately online dynasty and head-to-head gaming seems to take a priority over offline single player. It was a really good webcast but many more questions remain.

[Cane305]

There was a lot of impressive stuff in there. New animations for throwing and catching, new drop backs, new trajectories, better defensive alignment, no psychic defense (allegedly), better option plays and punt blocking. But all of that stuff focused on the user. We heard nothing about how the cpu will execute any of these new tools. EA has never had the cpu run the spread right. Oregon has always been way too easy to beat and stop. Will the cpu RBs use special moves and show some personality? Will the cpu throw the ball to their top WRs? It's like playing LeBron in an NBA game and he only takes 5 shots. These improvements are great but if you don't see the cpu use them like a human it's pointless for an offline gamer like me. Unfortunately online dynasty and head-to-head gaming seems to take a priority over offline single player. It was a really good webcast but many more questions remain.

:nod: agreed...

[Kwizzy]

There was a lot of impressive stuff in there. New animations for throwing and catching, new drop backs, new trajectories, better defensive alignment, no psychic defense (allegedly), better option plays and punt blocking. But all of that stuff focused on the user. We heard nothing about how the cpu will execute any of these new tools. EA has never had the cpu run the spread right. Oregon has always been way too easy to beat and stop. Will the cpu RBs use special moves and show some personality? Will the cpu throw the ball to their top WRs? It's like playing LeBron in an NBA game and he only takes 5 shots. These improvements are great but if you don't see the cpu use them like a human it's pointless for an offline gamer like me. Unfortunately online dynasty and head-to-head gaming seems to take a priority over offline single player. It was a really good webcast but many more questions remain.

I agree with you completely about the viability of the CPU Rudy. I have made those concerns known and will continue to do so. I think you did however hear them address how these things will affect the CPU somewhat. I understand it's not exactly what we are looking for, but things like: CPU QB's getting better/more realistic drops (especially on screens), throwing on the run without stopping to set up, disguising coverage, QBs moving in the pocket, etc... are all things that will apply to the CPU/that the CPU will use, that will improve its competetiveness IMO. Again, I understand and agree entirely with what you are looking for & wholeheartedly agree that the things I have listed are not enough. But my hope is that these will improve it somewhat and further tweaking can also help.

IMO though, until they make this one of the "main features" so to speak, for a year this will continue to be an area that is lacking.

[Rudy]

IMO though, until they make this one of the "main features" so to speak, for a year this will continue to be an area that is lacking.

Some these things probably require big re-writes in code. But some can be fixed with sliders. Adding a shotgun run slider would be huge in terms of tuning the cpu spread-option running game. I think you or someone else mentioned a more detailed slider set other than RB Ability - maybe separate sliders for speed vs. special move. Improving punt returns sounds nice but adding a slider for kick returns would also be a big help. I'd still love to see pass coverage split between man and zone.

As a big slider guy I always believe the more the better. Are the devs slider haters or have they considered these things?

[baseballplyrmvp]

My understanding is that if he is a reciever (ie-has a button assigned to him) and he is pretty close to the QB, then throwing the ball to him should result in a shovel animation where appropriate. I can't remember off the top of my head, but does a HB who is blocking have an icon still?

thanks kwizzy. i take it, with no actual shovel pass plays then, it'd be unlikely to see something similar to this vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCRyc_s9390)? the 2 linemen kick out on that play and block upfield for alex green. Or could it be done by calling a hb slip screen and keeping my qb somewhat close to the rb when he slips out?

also in the webcast, they hit on the different dropbacks and how on bubble screen plays, the qb only takes 1 step and then fires it out there. is the wr blocking logic fixed? the receivers have the old blocking logic of running to a certain spot on the field and then looking for a defender, rather than seeking out someone to block from the get go (like what the o-line currently do).

as far as penalties go, are there multiple penalties per play like in this vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A6rQ_mHXnfw&feature=relmfu)? or offsetting penalties?

[Kwizzy]

Some these things probably require big re-writes in code. But some can be fixed with sliders. Adding a shotgun run slider would be huge in terms of tuning the cpu spread-option running game. I think you or someone else mentioned a more detailed slider set other than RB Ability - maybe separate sliders for speed vs. special move. Improving punt returns sounds nice but adding a slider for kick returns would also be a big help. I'd still love to see pass coverage split between man and zone.

As a big slider guy I always believe the more the better. Are the devs slider haters or have they considered these things?

I would tend to agree that more sliders=better. I honestly don't know that I have ever had a conversation with the devs about sliders. I will make sure to ask next time I have the chance, or better yet, Tommy can you get a feel for that when you're down there?

[Cane305]

Kwizzy, I know should be under sights and sounds, but they also keep mentioning not to pay attention to player models etc cause work in progress..but do you know if they are going to implement new player models or why do they keep mentioning it? As vids show, players appear same as last year?

[Kwizzy]

thanks kwizzy. i take it, with no actual shovel pass plays then, it'd be unlikely to see something similar to this vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCRyc_s9390)? the 2 linemen kick out on that play and block upfield for alex green. Or could it be done by calling a hb slip screen and keeping my qb somewhat close to the rb when he slips out?

also in the webcast, they hit on the different dropbacks and how on bubble screen plays, the qb only takes 1 step and then fires it out there. is the wr blocking logic fixed? the receivers have the old blocking logic of running to a certain spot on the field and then looking for a defender, rather than seeking out someone to block from the get go (like what the o-line currently do).

I don't believe the WR blocking has been addressed, at least in terms of making it as it needs to be, hence it being in my top 6 list for 14. I do know that it's something that's on the gameplay guys' radars in a big way. In terms of this year's game I think a couple things in addition to the QB animation will help:

1) The off man coverage.
2) Read-React & tuning should make it so that defenders aren't sprinting at the screen from the instant the ball is snapped.
3) There is a third part that I think will help here but it wasn't mentioned in the blog so let me get confirmation before I spill the beans. Rudy, this component should also help with the shotgun running game.

[ReBuKez]

I wish they would show NC STATE. Just wanna get a glimpse to see if they put the right jersey.:o

[baseballplyrmvp]

thanks for lettin me pick your brain kwizzy.

[Kwizzy]

Kwizzy, I know should be under sights and sounds, but they also keep mentioning not to pay attention to player models etc cause work in progress..but do you know if they are going to implement new player models or why do they keep mentioning it? As vids show, players appear same as last year?

Well, everything is a work in progress until the code is final, I know sometimes they are working like hell to make something work & have to pull it at the last second. Also, I think today they were just trying to stress that they were showing off gameplay & that the graphics were not representative of the actual game.

[Kwizzy]

thanks for lettin me pick your brain kwizzy.

Anytime man, I just wish I could answer your quesitons better. Especially with the shovel passes, I just haven't seen it in action enough to really give you a solid answer.

[NCSUholmey]

I wish they would show NC STATE. Just wanna get a glimpse to see if they put the right jersey.:o

We might get more than the Red / White home and away for the first time. Since NCAA01 I cant remember when we have had anything other than that

[baseballplyrmvp]

one thing i liked seeing in the webcast, was the zone depths have finally been fixed to match the play art. one something like the cover 2 play art out of a 4-3, the mlb has always been shown as having a deeper zone than the outside backers, but he's always played the same depth in the game. that seems to have been fixed as there was one shot showing 2 yellow zones at different depths on the same play.

[Rudy]

3) There is a third part that I think will help here but it wasn't mentioned in the blog so let me get confirmation before I spill the beans. Rudy, this component should also help with the shotgun running game.

You have me intrigued. Interesting. I wonder if this is line splits.

[baseballplyrmvp]

to the guys attending the community event this week, at some point, would it be possible to get an "official" definition of what every rating does? how it applies to actual gameplay (just gameplay, not supersim logic)? and what position(s) it has an effect on? we've never really known for sure what some ratings do.

[ryby6969]

Disappointed in OL vs DL not being revamped along with the lack of info on read and react defense and the running game. Did they at least fix the fact that DT's get pressure way too quickly no matter their rating even in a 3 man front?

[xMrHitStickx904]

^ that needs to be fixed, the roided DT's have to go lol.

[Deuce]

I'm sure this is the case but will wr's adjust when they look for the ball based on the QB's arm strength? When a weak armed QB throws a seam will the wr look for the ball sooner?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Jayrah]

There's always gonna be stuff that we want in that doesn't make it. But HOLY CRAP that is a lot of stuff that they got to! I am absolutely thrilled. One of the big things in the set that I really, really like is the blitz pick up by the rb. I still have an rb miss the guy that runs right at him even when I keep him in to block in 12. Very frustrating. As all are saying, it really looks like they took what they worked on and fully immersed it.

On screens: My #1 complaint as 12 rolled on is/was screen passes. I am very pleased with the new drop back system that allows screens to be completed without getting sacked on the snap. And the one step bubble is fantastic looking! I still am hoping that when the linemen get in front, they go and get somebody instead of allowing the only guy out in the flat to make the play right through the middle of them. Also, with off man, we can finally throw a screen pass with some hope of moderate success, while not going the all or nothing route. I am excited that I can read it and decide to get out of or into a screen based on coverage alignment, this is something that Washington State will do a lot of this year.

Thanks for the info guys. Great stuff so far

[SmoothPancakes]

as far as penalties go, are there multiple penalties per play like in this vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A6rQ_mHXnfw&feature=relmfu)? or offsetting penalties?

Just a random comment, but from the looks of it, the center was at fault. Clearly there was a specific snap count, thus the entire offense moving (line and everyone) all moving at the exact same time, and the center apparently didn't remember what the snap count was. As for the flag itself, the ref said the entire offensive line at the time, but based on the second flag, where he just said false start on the offense, it would have probably just been a single flag counted against one player.

[baseballplyrmvp]

thanks for bein a smartass smooth. you totally destroyed what i had going there. thanks a lot. /sarcasm

[SmoothPancakes]

thanks for bein a smartass smooth. you totally destroyed what i had going there. thanks a lot. /sarcasm

Anytime buddy. :)

:D

[Jayrah]

The more I think about it, the more I love the feature set. The only thing I wish they'd have touched on a little bit more is wr/db interactions on the deep ball, ie maintain contact down the field. But I love it! As long as it plays the way it's supposed to these are all fixes to things that drove everyone here nuts in the past and honestly if they would've taken on line play I still would've had a fit just about every game about zone depth and Lb swat and sliding defenders and my qb flipping around to throw the ball away. On the other hand, these fixes will help me not think about such things as line play as much. Again, the screens were my main issue with line play and I think with the new pass animations they may have fixed all of part 1 of the problem, which is getting sacked before the rb got into the route. Part 2 is the O-line running and blocking after the catch, which is still to be seen.

And I can't stress how big the option game changes are, especially the pitch relationship fix and the pitch motion fix. That's going to have a huge impact for me because I like to run some option sets and it's difficult when half of the plays go for big loss or turnover. Also the read option having the qb break out faster is going to impact that play's use as well.

[Avross]

Can u ask about 3 things on the podcast please. Updated or upgrades to cleats/gloves/team specific socks such as michigan socks with the "M" and the Nike elite socks. No teams or player where ankles socks. Brands Such as the under armor new cleats and gloves more accurate Nike and Adidas gear

[Little Steve]

i wanna see two streak left side right side and see what the oposite conner does if the pass is in the air. does he turn his head and run immeditly because the "force is with him" or if he didn't look will he not help? what im trying to ask is "whats the timeing of cb looking"" this is VERY IMPORTANT from what i can tell based on the deep throwing in the passing game. MY BEST GUESS IS he going to copy what the wr does.

[Little Steve]

i wanna see two streak left side right side and see what the oposite conner does if the pass is in the air. does he turn his head and run immeditly because the "force is with him" or if he didn't look will he not help? what im trying to ask is "whats the timeing of cb looking"" this is VERY IMPORTANT from what i can tell based on the deep throwing in the passing game. MY BEST GUESS IS he going to copy what the wr does.

[xMrHitStickx904]

I still want to see man coverage. It's been broken over the past few years, and I hope the man align from PS2 helps defend the bunch/tight sets. I don't need my LB's on slot receivers. Also, now that we can turn man lock off, no more throwing blindly into coverage, which is really nice. Of course, this is only as good as the zones & man defense is. As long as we don't have super linebackers, it should be fine. Madden 12 did zones pretty well, with the exception of purple & some yellow zones. Hope 13 can have Madden 12 zones, but even better. Just ready for the demo to see for myself.

[baseballplyrmvp]

are you guys allowed to say anything regarding formation subs? did they bring the quick subs feature over from madden, that allows you to insert subs from the playcall screen? or do you still have to pause the game in order to use formation subs?

[Jayrah]

are you guys allowed to say anything regarding formation subs? did they bring the quick subs feature over from madden, that allows you to insert subs from the playcall screen? or do you still have to pause the game in order to use formation subs?probably the same as last year. I never had a problem as I just did it pregame and then used packages in game

[JBHuskers]

For whoever asked about shovel passes, it is only on certain plays.

I tried to make the RB do a curl route and run at him, but the QB just does a soft toss, not a shovel pass.

[xMrHitStickx904]

For whoever asked about shovel passes, it is only on certain plays.

I tried to make the RB do a curl route and run at him, but the QB just does a soft toss, not a shovel pass.

I hope we get those shotgun option, shovel pass type of plays that the past Florida teams were known for.

[I OU a Beatn]

I hope we get those shotgun option, shovel pass type of plays that the past Florida teams were known for.

With as bad as the offensive line play has been, that play doesn't stand a chance in hell of succeeding. That's exactly why it's a little baffling to me we've gone all these years and the most broken part of the game is still the offensive/defensive line interaction. If EA would take care of that, they would end up fixing a ton of related issues as well. Oh well...I'll say what I've said for 6 years...maybe next year. :D

[Rudy]

Kotaku has a nice article (nothing really new though).

http://kotaku.com/5902407/

[Boucher]

Why is it so hard to put in different throwing styles?

[baseballplyrmvp]

since they worked on passing trajectories, did they work on kicking trajectories too? like on a 50+ yard field goal, if you stick a guy who's like 6'6" or taller in the middle of your fg block formation, can you block it?

[JeffHCross]

Good jobs on the blogs, to both Larry and Chris. Great details and all around solid reads.

As far as the actual gameplay changes, like some others I'm cautiously optimistic. The changes sounds solid, but I'm not sold on there being enough defensive changes to offset the offensive passing improvements. Disguised coverage will be very nice, but I haven't seen many people using the man-in-motion method the last few years, so I'm not sure how many of my opponents it will actually affect.As a run-first, defense-second guy, there's not much to be enthusiastic about. Tommy's relentless efforts on getting alignment fixed (not that he did it alone ;)) will be welcome, but otherwise it feels business-as-usual -- on paper. Obviously, the offensive improvements sound great -- on paper. Though I'm not personally a fan of the auto-dropback. We'll see how the game actually plays in a few months.


since they worked on passing trajectories, did they work on kicking trajectories too? like on a 50+ yard field goal, if you stick a guy who's like 6'6" or taller in the middle of your fg block formation, can you block it?If your opponent chooses/needs to put their own trajectory on the lowest settings, blocking with tall players is already doable. The problem there, IMO, is partially the ability to hit from distance WITHOUT low trajectories, as well as the lack of penetration by the FG block.

[baseballplyrmvp]

If your opponent chooses/needs to put their own trajectory on the lowest settings, blocking with tall players is already doable. really? oh, well then nvm...

[Avross]

I wanna know if they fix the socks no more ankle socks and add team specific socks suck as Michigan "M" and all nike elite socks and if they added more cleats Nike Adidas under armor and under armor gloves gone tune te color of Alabama jersey

[Jayrah]

Good jobs on the blogs, to both Larry and Chris. Great details and all around solid reads.

As far as the actual gameplay changes, like some others I'm cautiously optimistic. The changes sounds solid, but I'm not sold on there being enough defensive changes to offset the offensive passing improvements. Disguised coverage will be very nice, but I haven't seen many people using the man-in-motion method the last few years, so I'm not sure how many of my opponents it will actually affect. As a run-first, defense-second guy, there's not much to be enthusiastic about. Tommy's relentless efforts on getting alignment fixed (not that he did it alone ;)) will be welcome, but otherwise it feels business-as-usual -- on paper. Obviously, the offensive improvements sound great -- on paper. Though I'm not personally a fan of the auto-dropback. We'll see how the game actually plays in a few months.

If your opponent chooses/needs to put their own trajectory on the lowest settings, blocking with tall players is already doable. The problem there, IMO, is partially the ability to hit from distance WITHOUT low trajectories, as well as the lack of penetration by the FG block.
1: People haven't been using the man in motion because they can tell it's a zone in multiple ways. The cb's do not line up straight right away in zone they start outside and slide in. It's a dead give away and you don't need motion to figure it out.

2: As I understood it, there's no more auto-drop back than there already was. Instead of one dropback there's 3 now, all matched up with the initial primary route. It was specifically stated in the webcast that the user can take over the drop at any time.

3: You can block kicks with tall people behind the line with a low trajectory? I've blocked at least 20 kicks but always on timing from the edge...

[Avross]

At the community event can someone ask about accurate socks such as the nike elite and michigan "M" with thier white jersey updated and new cleats and gloves. such as under armor cleats and gloves adidas and new nike. And offensive double team team line play. Maybe add the ability to manually double a great pass rusher. Can I please get a answer Kizzy

[Avross]

Wish they make the knee pads higher no one wear them below the knees and add te ability to add and remove pads like madden. And eliminate ankle socks. Fix jersey colors such as Alabama

[Jayrah]

I wanna know if they fix the socks no more ankle socks and add team specific socks suck as Michigan "M" and all nike elite socks and if they added more cleats Nike Adidas under armor and under armor gloves gone tune the color of Alabama jerseyDon't hold your breath Av. I don't expect those things to be added, except I think that the lighting will tune the color of the Bama jerseys much better. I have the same issues with the Wazzu colors but hopefully it'll be better than ever this year.

[Avross]

Dang. So adjusting socks lengths and adding a few cleats and gloves are hard for the development team at this point? Sucks I was hoping to see cam new under armor cleats and the new Nike line up as well as gloves. Was hoping for those teams specific socks

[SmoothPancakes]

I think ram officially has a challenger for the title of dress up guy on these forums.

[beartide06]

I think ram officially has a challenger for the title of dress up guy on these forums.

:up::D

[xMrHitStickx904]

Dang. So adjusting socks lengths and adding a few cleats and gloves are hard for the development team at this point? Sucks I was hoping to see cam new under armor cleats and the new Nike line up as well as gloves. Was hoping for those teams specific socks

Thread is about gameplay. Just in case you didn't notice already.

[xMrHitStickx904]

doublepost.

[Kwizzy]

At the community event can someone ask about accurate socks such as the nike elite and michigan "M" with thier white jersey updated and new cleats and gloves. such as under armor cleats and gloves adidas and new nike. And offensive double team team line play. Maybe add the ability to manually double a great pass rusher. Can I please get a answer Kizzy

Sorry Av, didn't see your PM's 'til now. I don't really pay attention to uniform stuff (Gameplay & Dynasty are the only things I really care about), that's more of a question for CDJ and or Paakaa as they are always on top of that stuff. That being said, I know that the devs said in the sights and sounds playbook that not all that much time was spent adding new equipment this year as the art department was busy with other things.

[souljahbill]

Thread is about gameplay. Just in case you didn't notice already.

LOL! :D

[steelerfan]

http://img.tapatalk.com/62c401e2-46ee-44a0.jpg

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk 2

[Jayrah]

http://img.tapatalk.com/62c401e2-46ee-44a0.jpg

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk 2:D:D:D

[baseballplyrmvp]

2 more questions: are the 6 qb ratings in or does the 1 throw accuracy rating still control every type of throw a qb can make?

second question: has the depth chart been changed at all, whether offensive style specific or just more slots added?

[Kwizzy]

2 more questions: are the 6 qb ratings in or does the 1 throw accuracy rating still control every type of throw a qb can make?

second question: has the depth chart been changed at all, whether offensive style specific or just more slots added?

No on both to my knowledge

[xMrHitStickx904]

http://img.tapatalk.com/62c401e2-46ee-44a0.jpg

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk 2

LMAO, well played.

[baseballplyrmvp]

No on both to my knowledge:bang:

why the hell not? :mad: every question i ask has "no" for an answer. :mad:

[Rudy]

Not sure where this trailer is posted here so I'll paste it here. Looks nice.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zypqU4n3qBI&feature=player_embedded

[Little Steve]

:bang:

why the hell not? :mad: every question i ask has "no" for an answer. :mad:

cause ur old:P....no not really its cause what we young people call(not you) ***. their ***

[baseballplyrmvp]

cause ur old:P....no not really its cause what we young people call(not you) ***. their gayi hope you realize that a good majority of the people who post here regularly, are over the age 20

you high school kids are part of the minority on this site.

[xMrHitStickx904]

i hope you realize that a good majority of the people who post here regularly, are over the age 20

you high school kids are part of the minority on this site.

yes, a very big minority at that. I'm right at 20 though, lol.

[SmoothPancakes]

http://img.tapatalk.com/62c401e2-46ee-44a0.jpg

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk 2

:D I was waiting for you. I knew you'd be along with something great eventually and you didn't let down. :D

[ram29jackson]

wht is meant by the option pitch being enhanced? whats different about it ?

[ram29jackson]

LOL make fun of socks all you want..but it does look silly when you alot of big 10 schools have ankle socks..the pac 12 I can understand, but not
the Big 10 schools

[xMrHitStickx904]

wht is meant by the option pitch being enhanced? whats different about it ?

I would say that the animation of the pitch is enhanced, like the whole arm extends. On past versions of the game, there were instances that the ball just catapulted out of the hands of the QB lol.

[Kwizzy]

LOL make fun of socks all you want..but it does look silly when you alot of big 10 schools have ankle socks..the pac 12 I can understand, but not
the Big 10 schools

I will never understand how the hell you guys even notice the socks & whatnot... Not that I'm knocking it at all. I just don't even pay attention to that stuff for a nanosecond! :dunno:

[SmoothPancakes]

I will never understand how the hell you guys even notice the socks & whatnot... Not that I'm knocking it at all. I just don't even pay attention to that stuff for a nanosecond! :dunno:

I can honestly say never once, since I started played the NCAA series back with NCAA Football 99, that I have ever even looked a single ever time at socks, in any mode or variation of the game. There are many, much more important things that need to be added, fixed, or worked on in the game before socks would even ever possibly make it onto the list, for me at least.

[JeffHCross]

1: People haven't been using the man in motion because they can tell it's a zone in multiple ways. The cb's do not line up straight right away in zone they start outside and slide in. It's a dead give away and you don't need motion to figure it out. True. But they were citing the man-in-motion method in the blog, so that's what I was mentally focused on. Suffice to say, I'm not sure how many of my opponents over the last couple years have cared enough to figure out what I'm running pre-snap. They can usually beat me either way :D.

It was specifically stated in the webcast that the user can take over the drop at any time.Thanks for the correction. The Kotaku article mentioned the auto dropback without highlighting that it was still breakable. I guess I didn't notice in the other articles and comments where it's been mentioned as they "want" you to use auto-dropback, not that you have to.

3: You can block kicks with tall people behind the line with a low trajectory? I've blocked at least 20 kicks but always on timing from the edge...I've seen it done. Not with any frequency, but I've seen it done. That wasn't my main point though. Trajectory isn't the problem on kicks. It's lack of penetration up front combined with being largely unnecessary to go for a low kick.

[xMrHitStickx904]

I will never understand how the hell you guys even notice the socks & whatnot... Not that I'm knocking it at all. I just don't even pay attention to that stuff for a nanosecond! :dunno:

I could careless about socks. honestly.

[ram29jackson]

I could careless about socks. honestly.

yeah but if you can start showing a bunch of different helmets and facemasks, you are showing that you analyze details. So why not get a majority of details right?

[Little Steve]

i hope you realize that a good majority of the people who post here regularly, are over the age 20

you high school kids are part of the minority on this site.
Ya but we da best! No but really they are ***... i completly argree on both the subjects u posted up their^ that they sould be in the game. o well next year. next year. next year ect....

[xMrHitStickx904]

yeah but if you can start showing a bunch of different helmets and facemasks, you are showing that you analyze details. So why not get a majority of details right?

I'm all for detail, authenticity. I hope that NCAA has a bunch of uniforms, more chants/fight songs, things that make it sound, look & feel like College Football. However, I ultimately play NCAA for what's on the field. The only thing aesthetically I care about on the field is the grass. Besides that, I want my different zone depths to work, expanded playbooks, PS2 Man Lock/Man Align back, better capability of running my spread, taking away the handicaps that make bad players able to compete with hardcore players like me, and me being able to run a simple play without finding a game breaking glitch. I'll trade a logo on socks any day for game play to be almost flawless.

[baseballplyrmvp]

i'm not making this up. i'm playing an offline dynasty game right now as :USC: against arizona state. asu's top 3 receivers are 77, 66, and 65 ovr, with release ratings of 76, 67, and 73 (all respectively). i'm playing straight up man coverage. every play, i'm calling 2 man under, whether its from dime, nickel, or out of any 43 defense.

my corners are 96, 92, and 91 ovr, with man coverage ratings of 98, 92, and 93, and press ratings of 99, 94, and 92 (all respectively). so why are my corners getting torched so easily when their press ratings are 20+ points higher than the wr's release ratings?

can this be fixed in 13? in 1 on 1 ratings battles (like press vs release to determine if the press is successful) where one is light years higher than the other, i'd expect the better one to win a ton more than the other one.

[Rudy]

I've never noticed socks either. If I listed all my complaints with the game the visual details would be WAY down the list in the do not care category. The game itself looks really good imo. The lighting and everything else. In fact when I saw images of some of the first couple versions of the game NCAA 12 looks significantly better. I understand we all have different tastes so I don't mind guys wanting to see that stuff but I think that should remain in a different thread. Of course I'm still waiting for in game saves.

[Dr Death]

Alright... so the Video Blog was on Tuesday and since my DVD Burning Drive was failing, my computer was in the shop until tonight. I was able to watch the video blog on my Samsung Galaxy S II smartphone... {yes, I am proud of my phone and LOVE it} but now I finally have a chance to chime in on some things...

1: As someone who passes the hell out of the ball I am very excited about the new 1, 3, 5 and 7 step drops. Very cool.

2: Love the fact that you can throw to a guy whose icon hasn't lit up yet and you just have to manually take over that WR/TE/RB.

3: Shovel passes finally make it in the game but there's no designed Shovel Pass??? And - if I have my info correct - there are only certain plays that actually will have the Shovel??? This is both good and bad. It's still inexcusable that no designed Shovel Passes are in the game considering these are used a lot in many offenses, including the Run & Shoot - Air Raid - Spread. They need to implement Shovel Passes in next year that are out of 3-wide, 4-wide and 5-wide. In 5-wide it either involves a man in motion or, the inside guy on the Trips side runs behind the line at the snap of the ball. I really can't comprehend why they would include SOME Shovel Passes but not have any DESIGNED SP's...

4: Saw many passes in the VB that would have been picked or batted down in previous years.

5: Love that if your guy is running a 15 & Out you can lead him to the Corner and he will adjust.

6: My bet is this year's game is going to be massively wide open, in terms of passing and scoring. Next year they will improve the D.

7: Love the fact that you can disguise coverages but... and like Roseanne Barr, this is a BIG but... but defensive teams don't disguise coverage every single play. I get the feeling that in NCAA 13 they will "disguise" coverage on every play. That's a shame.

8: Love that QB's will no longer come to a complete stop when "throwing on the run..."

9: Very disappointed that they chose to fix the Bubble Screen by backing defenders off the line. This is not the way to do this. I get that their engine either can't do it or they can't figure out how to make their machine do it right {WR's blocking, etc...} but hopefully the Bubble will work better this year, I just hope the CPU doesn't run this 15 times a game and have every one go for 50+ yards and/or a TD.

10: As someone else said in this thread, I hope they are already working on the engine for the next-gen of consoles {PS4/X-720} or whatever they will be called. With all the new stuff being added it would be a grave mistake to have to start from scratch yet again.

I have many more thoughts/ideas/questions... but those will come in time.

[steelerfan]

:D I was waiting for you. I knew you'd be along with something great eventually and you didn't let down. :D

;)

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[Jayrah]

wht is meant by the option pitch being enhanced? whats different about it ?Updated qb hit/pitch animations that allow the ball to come out cleanly without the stupid warping and suction pitches that used to happen. It looks a lot more like a truer, flatter flip now than previously. Also the pitch relationship between qb and hb has been tweaked (looks like the hb is flatter and further away, giving a better pitch angle). I don't however know if there are still bad pitches based on late pitch? There should be, but I'm guessing it's a play and see thing there.

[Jayrah]

1: As someone who passes the hell out of the ball I am very excited about the new 1, 3, 5 and 7 step drops. Very cool.

Also stated in the podcast that there are variations of each drop! Very very very Cool indeed!

2: Love the fact that you can throw to a guy whose icon hasn't lit up yet and you just have to manually take over that WR/TE/RB.

I am on the fence about this. I'm not sure I like that timing has been addressed but you can still cheese the route if you're quick enough. Hopefully db's and lb's are able to react quickly on this type of play and break up passes so that you are forced to be patient for the most part. That or I hope it is difficult to switch and make this catch.

3: Shovel passes finally make it in the game but there's no designed Shovel Pass??? And - if I have my info correct - there are only certain plays that actually will have the Shovel??? This is both good and bad. It's still inexcusable that no designed Shovel Passes are in the game considering these are used a lot in many offenses, including the Run & Shoot - Air Raid - Spread. They need to implement Shovel Passes in next year that are out of 3-wide, 4-wide and 5-wide. In 5-wide it either involves a man in motion or, the inside guy on the Trips side runs behind the line at the snap of the ball. I really can't comprehend why they would include SOME Shovel Passes but not have any DESIGNED SP's...

Agreed. I don't think it's a matter of what play you call though, it's more a matter of qb/wr/hb relationship on any given play

4: Saw many passes in the VB that would have been picked or batted down in previous years.

5: Love that if your guy is running a 15 & Out you can lead him to the Corner and he will adjust.

Hope this is not 100% effective though. I hope you can still overthrow receivers.

6: My bet is this year's game is going to be massively wide open, in terms of passing and scoring. Next year they will improve the D.

God I hope not! It sounds like it but I think they did some defensive tweaking in animations and such to help the db's. Of course their going to showcase the offensive changes because that's what they're talking about, but I'm holding out for SOME defense.

7: Love the fact that you can disguise coverages but... and like Roseanne Barr, this is a BIG but... but defensive teams don't disguise coverage every single play. I get the feeling that in NCAA 13 they will "disguise" coverage on every play. That's a shame.

hmmm. defenses TRY to disguise SOMETHING almost every play with preplay movement in some way or fashion. I don't exactly know what you mean here though, it's not about disguise as much as it is about proper defensive alignment so that the right players are covering the correct area of the field. I actually think that this will help the defense much more than we could imagine at this point.

8: Love that QB's will no longer come to a complete stop when "throwing on the run..."

9: Very disappointed that they chose to fix the Bubble Screen by backing defenders off the line. This is not the way to do this. I get that their engine either can't do it or they can't figure out how to make their machine do it right {WR's blocking, etc...} but hopefully the Bubble will work better this year, I just hope the CPU doesn't run this 15 times a game and have every one go for 50+ yards and/or a TD.

I don't believe that's the fix. They just added Man-Off coverage as part of the proper alignment in certain defenses. In this case it would be a good time to call a bubble as you have some space. There's still regular and press coverage if I understood that correctly.

10: As someone else said in this thread, I hope they are already working on the engine for the next-gen of consoles {PS4/X-720} or whatever they will be called. With all the new stuff being added it would be a grave mistake to have to start from scratch yet again.

I have many more thoughts/ideas/questions... but those will come in time. Good thoughts. Commented within the post.

[Kwizzy]

Ok so, I know I left you guys hanging on the third thing that I thought would help on WR screens and hopefully the shotgun running game. In the EA podcast yesterday they answered my question & talked about it so now I'm sure I can discuss it.

This year they have improved the WR alignments. That this means is that WRs will spread out further (more realistically) horizontally before the play. In past years, WRs were given a fixed landmark a certain distance out from the TE or T to line up. The result was that the offensive formation was never as spread out as it should've been, and thus the defense was also highly concentrated. This year the WRs will line up in a much more realistic way and, with the defensive alignment fixed, the defense should be a little more spread out when you call those spread formations. Below is part of the explanation I got from the gameplay team.

If the ball is on either hash to two yards inside of it, the receivers to the wide side have specific landmarks/locations they will align to. Trips the outside guy is top of the numbers, the second receiver is hash plus two, and the third splits the difference between the tackle and the number two receiver. We also adjusted their alignments to the short side as well. All of that is based on film study and talking to college coaches. It really helps out the passing game to the wide side. Defenders being spread further out opens more vertical/horizontal seams for receivers to work in.

So as I alluded to before, I think this could also have some nice repercussions in the spread run game because those defenders will be taken a little further out of the box.

[Dr Death]

Good thoughts. Commented within the post.

Thank you Jayrah. Re: this comment you made:


hmmm. defenses TRY to disguise SOMETHING almost every play with preplay movement in some way or fashion. I don't exactly know what you mean here though, it's not about disguise as much as it is about proper defensive alignment so that the right players are covering the correct area of the field. I actually think that this will help the defense much more than we could imagine at this point.

One thing I saw in the Video Blog was a Cover 2 defense where the offense lined up w/ two WR's, a TE and 2 RB's. They had both WR's on the left and the CB was covering the Z WR {far right} who was now in the slot on the left. When he {WR} motioned, the CB went w/ him. I don't believe I have ever seen a team come out in Cover 2 and yet have their CB in the slot on the opposite side of the field from where he should be lined up.

That one seemed a bit of a stretch for me. Also... if they're going to show Man every play - and that's what it seemed like from the video - then there will be so many ways to exploit that when you see they're in Cover 2. You know they'll either be in Cover 2 or Man w/ 2 over the top. And in real life, teams call Cover 2 for a reason and having their 2 CB's playing their normal positions is one of those. If that guy follows a WR in motion or lines up in the slot w/ the WR, who's going to cover that area of the field if you leave the guy in the slot?

Since I run 5-wide, I could kill against that defense. So that's what I am referring to. Teams will disguise, yes, but not every single play and again, I reiterate, I have never seen a Cover 2 defense w/ one of the CB's playing in the slot on the opposite side of the field. Hopefully they have thought this through. If the D disguises coverage some of the time - say 40 or 50 % of the time - that will make it much more of a chess match and require you and me and everyone else to really read the defense. I just don't want to have them always showing Man and putting guys out of position if they're in Zone, because from what I saw, that could be easily manipulated.

[xMrHitStickx904]

I happen to agree with Dr. Death in terms of the wide open, scoring type of a game. However, I do think defense will play a part in the game, but only if shading coverages, coverage depth, man align & the lack of man lock works the way it did on PS2.

[Deuce]

CD guys..I know things are still being tuned but how has the scoring been so far? Any low scoring games?


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[Kwizzy]

CD guys..I know things are still being tuned but how has the scoring been so far? Any low scoring games?


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I think the only worthwhile answer you'll get will be once JB & Tommy get back. Not enough of this was playable or tuned when I was there in Jan.

[ryby6969]

JB is a DJ at a stripclub and cannot score so he will be no help.

[Deuce]

I think the only worthwhile answer you'll get will be once JB & Tommy get back. Not enough of this was playable or tuned when I was there in Jan.

Thanks Kwizzy...I know a lot can still be tuned so I'm not too concerned. I just really prefer low scoring, defensive struggle type games. Hopefully JB or G will have some insight.


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[Marlowe]

JB is a DJ at a stripclub and cannot score so he will be no help.

Lol :D

[Kwizzy]

Thanks Kwizzy...I know a lot can still be tuned so I'm not too concerned. I just really prefer low scoring, defensive struggle type games. Hopefully JB or G will have some insight.


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I'm right there with ya man. I completely understand the concern everyone has with it. Obviously a great deal depends on tuning and implementation but I think there are a couple things that will help the defense compete with the changes made on offense:

1)Pre-snap Alignment being fixed is half the batlle IMO. Getting players lined up properly will go a long way in helping the defense and I think it's a reason to hold off until the demo at least before starting to worry too much.

2)Not only do defenders need to see the ball to make a play but recievers do too. What that means to me is that good defensive playcalling should be rewarded. If you call a well timed blitz now and the offense doesn't have an outlet to get the ball to quickly it should spell trouble for them. They can throw the ball to any reciever they want but if he's not looking it's gonna mean trouble for them. To me it's going to force the offense to call more realistic plays based on the down and distance they're facing. Now of course some of that will depend on how they've tuned pass rush and whatnot, but hopefully you can see my point.

[Kwizzy]

JB is a DJ at a stripclub and cannot score so he will be no help.

:D Fair point...

[Deuce]

I'm right there with ya man. I completely understand the concern everyone has with it. Obviously a great deal depends on tuning and implementation but I think there are a couple things that will help the defense compete with the changes made on offense:

1)Pre-snap Alignment being fixed is half the batlle IMO. Getting players lined up properly will go a long way in helping the defense and I think it's a reason to hold off until the demo at least before starting to worry too much.

2)Not only do defenders need to see the ball to make a play but recievers do too. What that means to me is that good defensive playcalling should be rewarded. If you call a well timed blitz now and the offense doesn't have an outlet to get the ball to quickly it should spell trouble for them. They can throw the ball to any reciever they want but if he's not looking it's gonna mean trouble for them. To me it's going to force the offense to call more realistic plays based on the down and distance they're facing. Now of course some of that will depend on how they've tuned pass rush and whatnot, but hopefully you can see my point.

Good points...even if it is wide open I'm sure there will be a tuner set that will make it more defensive.


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[baseballplyrmvp]

2)Not only do defenders need to see the ball to make a play but recievers do too. What that means to me is that good defensive playcalling should be rewarded. If you call a well timed blitz now and the offense doesn't have an outlet to get the ball to quickly it should spell trouble for them. They can throw the ball to any reciever they want but if he's not looking it's gonna mean trouble for them. To me it's going to force the offense to call more realistic plays based on the down and distance they're facing. Now of course some of that will depend on how they've tuned pass rush and whatnot, but hopefully you can see my point.

what about user controlled players on defense? do i need to try strafing at the last second to get my lb to see the ball and then swat it or does looking for the ball automatically happen depending on his awareness?

[Kwizzy]

what about user controlled players on defense? do i need to try strafing at the last second to get my lb to see the ball and then swat it or does looking for the ball automatically happen depending on his awareness?

While I'm not 100% sure, I think user controlled players are handled differently. I haven't talked to the devs about this however them saying that you could throw the ball to a WR who isn't looking and click on and make the catch makes me think that user control makes the player look for the ball.

I would actually like to get more info on exactly what determines when the defensive players look for the ball. Is it their AWR or some other combination of things? I was able to find out that for WRs, when they look for the ball is only based on the route they are running and those special proximity rules that have been mentioned (corner blitzes=look for ball). AWR, at this point, does not factor in to that at all.

[xMrHitStickx904]

The more I think about the dimmed-icons, the more I like it. See, I user catch ALL of the time, regardless of the pass or route. This just means that guys with no stick who quick pass all of the time won't be very effective. For those who don't user catch, once they play people online, or in a Online Dynasty who can user pick, it'll separate the good players from the bad players.

[baseballplyrmvp]

is the cpu flagged for intentional grounding and pass interference this year?

[ram29jackson]

so...if you are in a 7 step drop, are you locked in the animation so the idiots that find the nano blitz when you need a pass play can just abuse it/you ?

[Kwizzy]

so...if you are in a 7 step drop, are you locked in the animation so the idiots that find the nano blitz when you need a pass play can just abuse it/you ?

You're never locked into a drop animation, just like you never have been. You can hold the left stick from before the snap or whenever you want just like always.

[Rudy]

You're never locked into a drop animation, just like you never have been. You can hold the left stick from before the snap or whenever you want just like always.

One thing NCAA did a couple year ago was to have auto-evade (could have been Madden but I think it was only in the game one year). Where not only do you not drop back but the cpu will move the QB around in the pocket to avoid sacks. It could be annoying because some times the cpu actually took off scrambling when you didn't want to but I did like this feature. Does the cpu just do the auto dropback or is there an option for auto-evade as well?

[Kwizzy]

Im not aware of any auto evade.

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[Jayrah]

One thing NCAA did a couple year ago was to have auto-evade (could have been Madden but I think it was only in the game one year). Where not only do you not drop back but the cpu will move the QB around in the pocket to avoid sacks. It could be annoying because some times the cpu actually took off scrambling when you didn't want to but I did like this feature. Does the cpu just do the auto dropback or is there an option for auto-evade as well?that was only if you didn't turn off qb-assist from the main menu. I hated that feature. The qb would run or throw without you if you didn't take over the drop back. Annoying!!!

[Jayrah]

You're never locked into a drop animation, just like you never have been. You can hold the left stick from before the snap or whenever you want just like always.also now you will be able to cancel play action mid play! Very excited about that one!

[steelerfan]

JB is a DJ at a stripclub and cannot score so he will be no help.

:D:D:D:D

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[Rudy]

that was only if you didn't turn off qb-assist from the main menu. I hated that feature. The qb would run or throw without you if you didn't take over the drop back. Annoying!!!

Maybe it was Madden one year but I remember the QB moving in the pocket for me, doing the drop back but NOT throwing the ball. They would run for you which I didn't like but they wouldn't throw it.

[oweb26]

Did they fix the pistol? I know it has been asked about the shotgun running game, but as a guy who lovess the pistol, it was questionable at best on 12.

[Little Steve]

Did they fix the pistol? I know it has been asked about the shotgun running game, but as a guy who lovess the pistol, it was questionable at best on 12.

one of the pistol draws worked almost every time i ran that like 10 times a game vs user.

[jaymo76]

Did they fix the pistol? I know it has been asked about the shotgun running game, but as a guy who lovess the pistol, it was questionable at best on 12.

I must concur. I have the Pistol in my custom playbook this year and I tried to operate the PISTOL in 11 as well. However, the result is always the same... passing has no issues, draws has some success, and almost every other run play goes nowhere as the defenders swarm into the backfield far too fast.

[Rudy]

Tradition sports is posting a lot of feedback from the community event. They are saying the read-option is better and the player movement is heavier and no so herky jerky which I like. Not a big change they are saying but a subtle one.

[will41]

Did they add any new formations this year.That would be consider under gameplay right.

[Jayrah]

Did they add any new formations this year.That would be consider under gameplay right.Good question. Although I have a feeling most of their formation moderation was from tweaking proper alignments this year. I thought I read or heard in a webcast that they added some Wing T formations for option though? Or maybe it was another formation but something Army does I believe

[JeffHCross]

Or maybe it was another formation but something Army does I believeWingbone. See this video from Keontez (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9uKPyERG5_s).