Omaha.com: Ex-Husker QB Added to Games; Will Be Featured Official

[cdj]

http://thegamingtailgate.com/images/NCAA13/CleteRef2.jpg

Courtesy The Omaha World-Herald (http://www.omaha.com/article/20111110/SPORTS/711109759): In the future, when football fans play the Madden NFL or NCAA Football video game series, they'll see the face and hear the voice of referee Clete Blakeman.

It's the first time an identifiable referee has been chosen for either of the popular EA Sports series, which have been played by millions on PlayStation and Xbox.

Creative Director Jeff Luhr said it isn't certain yet whether Blakeman will be featured in next year's games, which will be Madden 13 or NCAA Football 13. Both come out in the summer of 2012.

"It will definitely will be in (the games) at some point," Luhr said. "Both are considerations."

Luhr is the creative director for NCAA Football, as well as creative director for the Core Football Gameplay team, which serves NCAA Football and Madden NFL.

Luhr said Blakeman traveled to Orlando where he did some motion capture work and photo shoots.


http://thegamingtailgate.com/images/NCAA13/CleteRef1.jpg

With Blakeman having recently been an official with the Big 12 and currently an NFL official, his face and voice will be familiar to both college and pro fans, Luhr said.

Click here to view the full Omaha World-Herald article (http://www.omaha.com/article/20111110/SPORTS/711109759).

***

You can view the page at http://www.thegamingtailgate.com/forums/content.php?526-Omaha.com-Ex-Husker-QB-added-to-games

[DariusLock]

Cool, maybe the ref animations will be better.

[jaymo76]

If they have brought the guy in and did photos/motion capturing, etc... why wouldn't he be in NCAA and Madden 13? This doesn't seem like a huge project that would take two years does it?

[JeffHCross]

If they have brought the guy in and did photos/motion capturing, etc... why wouldn't he be in NCAA and Madden 13? This doesn't seem like a huge project does that would take two years does it?This, itself, wouldn't take two years. But sometimes something of a lower priority can take multiple years to appear in the title because other things take the resources it needs. So it could take two years worth of development for them to have the total time necessary.

The other consideration is that you will practically never see promises from a development team at this point in their cycle :)

[JBHuskers]

That's cool. Clete is from Omaha. He's risen up the ranks to ref really quick in the NFL. Been a in the league only five years, but two or three of them he's been the head ref.

Now for NFL Blitz they need an over steroided Ed Hochuli.

[Roy38]

:fp:

[Pig Bomb]

one more example of EA spending resources on something that doesn't help fix the long list of broken crap in their game

[I OU a Beatn]

one more example of EA spending resources on something that doesn't help fix the long list of broken crap in their game

My thoughts exactly.

[cdj]

If they have brought the guy in and did photos/motion capturing, etc... why wouldn't he be in NCAA and Madden 13? This doesn't seem like a huge project that would take two years does it?

At the least they'll swap in the scanned head and replace existing referee lines with the ones Blakeman recorded so I don't think it would be a huge undertaking, but nothing is a 10-minute fix. Just my guess, but it'll probably boil down to whatever the team decides to do in all aspects of Presentation. If there's enough time after whatever/any big ticket items are added, they'll probably have the Presentation team add it in. If not, then next year. That is how I perceive the comments within the article.

A small detail, but IRL officials are wearing new 'uniforms' this season and they aren't in the game. If added, that could be part of the work here as well.

[JBHuskers]

Again, it's not pulling away gamplay guys to do this....people STILL don't realize that. There are many teams within the game's development.

[I OU a Beatn]

Again, it's not pulling away gamplay guys to do this....people STILL don't realize that. There are many teams within the game's development.

I think most of us realize that, but that doesn't mean it's not wasting resources. I'm positive Blakeman isn't doing the work for free. I'd imagine NCAA doesn't have the biggest budget in the world, and any money wasted on petty stuff like that is just that - a huge waste in my eyes.

[JBHuskers]

Again it's a referee so they are probably not spending a big chunk of the budget on it either.

[I OU a Beatn]

Regardless, it's still a waste. Until they fix the fundamental flaws that have plagued this game for years and years, every thing they do is a waste to me. All the new features in the world do no matter unless it plays like an actual football game.

[steelerfan]

unless it plays like an actual football game.

That you can play in 40 minutes or less. ;)

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk

[bdoughty]

Boo, Hiss, waste of time money and space. Get the Mo-Cap guys some C++ from Dummies books, STAT!

http://oi39.tinypic.com/2evxmv9.jpg

[JBHuskers]

Boo, Hiss, waste of time money and space. Get the Mo-Cap guys some C++ from Dummies books, STAT!

http://oi39.tinypic.com/2evxmv9.jpg

Exactly :D people are acting like this is a major feature that is taking up half the budget :fp:

[I OU a Beatn]

No, like I said, it's a complete waste of resources when their game doesn't function anywhere remotely like it should. I realize most of you live by the "well, it'll have bugs, so we'll just deal with it," but I don't. For six years now, I've played the game for barely a month and given up because of the enormous amount of flaws that have carried over year to year and have seemingly gotten worse(except for this year's game, which was actually improved in some areas). This is coming from someone who played the game year 'round from '04-'07 and would only stop playing when the new version came out.

Until EA proves they can begin fixing issues that have plagued this game(if you want the list of huge issues again, just let me know), beefing up the refs in the game is a huge waste of resources. I said about how cannons were a waste of resources last year, much like Season Showdown was a huge waste whenever that was implemented, and I got much of the same flak and was assured that NCAA '12 was a great game. Well, I guess we see how that turned out. The same exact issues that plagued the previous games were still there in plain sight(except for the pass defense, which was actually mildly improved), and a few more issues sprouted up.

Correcting issues with the actual gameplay > refs, season showdown, cannons, etc...

[JBHuskers]

But they're two completely separate entities....complaining they're working on apples but not fixing oranges makes no sense...kinda like that analogy :D

[I OU a Beatn]

You guys said it yourselves. The NCAA Football franchise under EA doesn't have a large budget. Any amount of money spent on stupid shit like this is a complete waste of resources when the core game play is broken. I would think their limited budget would be better served on fixing the game play rather than giving us realistic referee animations or whatever.

[JBHuskers]

You guys said it yourselves. The NCAA Football franchise under EA doesn't have a large budget. Any amount of money spent on stupid shit like this is a complete waste of resources when the core game play is broken. I would think their limited budget would be better served on fixing the game play rather than giving us realistic referee animations or whatever.

But when you complain about a local article about a ref going in to do mocap work, you're acting like the budget is $100 for the year and it's all blown now. Trust me, the budget may be small compared to Madden, but doing this is not really putting a strain on anything else in the development of the game. On top of that, how do you know this came out of the NCAA budget? This is a shared feature most likely. That's why complaining about this is asinine.

[bdoughty]

Until EA proves they can begin fixing issues that have plagued this game(if you want the list of huge issues again, just let me know), beefing up the refs in the game is a huge waste of resources. I said about how cannons were a waste of resources last year, much like Season Showdown was a huge waste whenever that was implemented, and I got much of the same flak and was assured that NCAA '12 was a great game. Well, I guess we see how that turned out. The same exact issues that plagued the previous games were still there in plain sight(except for the pass defense, which was actually mildly improved), and a few more issues sprouted up.

Correcting issues with the actual gameplay > refs, season showdown, cannons, etc...

First, while some of these features are a waste to YOU, that does not make them a waste to everyone else who purchases the game. Secondly, you have absolutely no idea how a software company runs. Instead of typing a ton of stuff I am just going to link you to this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Video_game_development#Roles

Now only a small segment of that development team would be in charge of fixing gameplay. While you want a priority on fixing gameplay you just can't go willy nilly and axe other departments to beef up on one area. Eventually you will need those other departments and having to replace and rehire employees is not exactly a smart business move. There are issues in the game, nobody would tell you otherwise, that said there are still plenty of people that enjoy NCAA 12, faults and all. What we can hope is that the team learns from their mistakes and makes a better NCAA 13. If they do not meet you expectations, you can save $59.99 and play something else.



But when you complain about a local article about a ref going in to do mocap work, you're acting like the budget is $100 for the year and it's all blown now. Trust me, the budget may be small compared to Madden, but doing this is not really putting a strain on anything else in the development of the game. On top of that, how do you know this came out of the NCAA budget? This is a shared feature most likely. That's why complaining about this is asinine.

Exactly, plus if you have a motion capture studio, one would imagine you are going to use it from time to time. Just a case of people complaining about something to complain about.

[JBHuskers]

Exactly, plus if you have a motion capture studio, one would imagine you are going to use it from time to time. Just a case of people complaining about something to complain about.

Yep. Ridiculous.

If Chris didn't post that local article, people wouldn't have known about it, then when the time comes to see it in action they would have thought it was a cool upgrade.

Since this is the only information regarding anything new to have come out in between games, bitch is the automatic answer, along with OMFG all the resources are going towards this instead of fixing the issues!!!!1111

[I OU a Beatn]

As if we don't have a reason to bitch. Come the hell on. NCAA '12 was the single buggiest game EA has ever launched(would've been NBA Elite, but actual competition made sure that gem never saw the light of day). Line interaction still broken beyond belief. DB/WR interaction still broken beyond belief. Defensive alignment still broken. Outside run pursuit still broken. Pass trajectory broken. CPU playcalling still broken. Online Dynasty was broken for several weeks for a lot of people.

I could go on and on. So yes, until some of that shit is corrected, bitch is going to be the automatic answer whenever we find out they're doing motion capturing for the stupid referees just like the cannons last year and whatever else they implemented.

[bdoughty]

As if we don't have a reason to bitch. Come the hell on. NCAA '12 was the single buggiest game EA has ever launched(would've been NBA Elite, but actual competition made sure that gem never saw the light of day). Line interaction still broken beyond belief. DB/WR interaction still broken beyond belief. Defensive alignment still broken. Outside run pursuit still broken. Pass trajectory broken. CPU playcalling still broken. Online Dynasty was broken for several weeks for a lot of people.

I could go on and on. So yes, until some of that shit is corrected, bitch is going to be the automatic answer whenever we find out they're doing motion capturing for the stupid referees just like the cannons last year and whatever else they implemented.


I hope they double the time spent on cannons this year, making sure that each one has that authentic sound to them, specific to each school. Maybe they will send someone to each school with a high tech audio recorder.

Sweet.

Boo Hoo Online Dynasty was broken for a few weeks for some. Go pick up NBA 2K12, get in an online dynasty and play a bunch of games with humans. Better yet, try to do a bounce pass, oops. Hey they finally launched https://www.nba2k.com/ oh crap Online Association is COMING SOON. Programmers at 2K must be in on the lockout.

Some of you guys act like NCAA 12 is the only buggy game out there. It is one thing to bitch and complain but do we need to see the same bitches and complaints in every other post? I get it you do not like cannons. Got the first time you mentioned it and every time since.

[I OU a Beatn]

I'm not filling up this thread with more useless banter than I already have. I should have known better than even mentioning something negative about NCAA(although, I can't possibly understand how ANYONE would classify this as a good thing) because if anything proved some of you guys will defend NCAA no matter what, it was last year's debacle. Carry on.

[bdoughty]

I'm not filling up this thread with more useless banter than I already have. I should have known better than even mentioning something negative about NCAA(although, I can't possibly understand how ANYONE would classify this as a good thing) because if anything proved some of you guys will defend NCAA no matter what, it was last year's debacle. Carry on.

Nobody is defending NCAA or the developers. Hearing that tired old retort just gets old fast. Some of us just understand the industry and how things work, some realize that it is just a video game and as long as humans are working on them, mistakes will be made.

This site, which is full of "NCAA Defenders" sure offers you a ton of different ways to get your opinion (negative or positive) in for the developers to see.

[I OU a Beatn]

You understand the industry? Oh, okay. Name one other game(other than Madden) that routinely releases with the same issues the previous iteration had. I mean, I truly don't get some of you guys. You're constantly downplaying the significance of some of the issues and for what? I'm fully aware that humans make the game and that mistakes will be made, but we are 100% past that. We are now going into the 7th year of development on this generation of consoles and literally ZERO advancements have been made to correct these reoccurring issues that prevent the game play from being where it should be. '12 was the first time they actually focused on pass defense, which until last year, was a major problem, and their solution only marginally improved it. Whether you like it or not, a good portion of their customers are highly pissed, and again, whether you like it or not, we have more than enough reasons to be pissed.

We had an amazing game on PS2. It functioned as it should, it was balanced, and it was a genuinely fun football experience. While they've been marginally improving for the past two years or so, they are still pretty far off from being able to have that said about this generation.

As for your last statement, yeah. I've been posting on all the major NCAA sites since '04. I know my outlets. I also know that it does virtually zero good. Name one person who thought cannons should be a feature. Name one person who thought referees needed an upgrade. Exactly. Now it's pretty clear we're not going to see eye to eye on this, so there's no point in continuing it.

[JBHuskers]

The point that both Doughty and I are trying to make is every single minute detail that is mentioned doesn't really HAVE to be compared to what is broken and needs fixing.

http://www.thehodgepodge.us/wp-content/uploads/2010/08/ApplesAndOranges.jpg

[I OU a Beatn]

Until it's fixed, why not? Who's to say that if they hadn't spent time on things like season showdown, cannons, referees, and their next gimmick, we might actually see some of the issues getting fixed? You can't say that for certain, and neither can I.

[JBHuskers]

Because they are separate entities.

[I OU a Beatn]

So what? It's still NCAA Football under EA's development. Any resource they devote to bringing something into the game is usually going to take away from something else. Whether that's game play, I don't know, but I do know that very few(if any) people wanted improved referees.

A feature that is brought in that is as useless and unwanted as this, regardless of cost(meaning it could be $1 for all I care), is a waste. How is this even an argument? Did improved referees win the wishlist tournament last year or this year? I sure as hell hope not. :D

[JBHuskers]

http://www.thegamingtailgate.com/forums/showthread.php?3900-Presentation-Championship-Dynamic-Weather-amp-Effects-vs.-Improved-Game-Atmosphere

Improved Game Atmosphere won the bracket.

Refs were begged for. They got in. Now they're improving on them. Again SEPARATE ENTITIES, it's NOT taking away from anything else :fp:

[cdj]

http://www.thegamingtailgate.com/forums/showthread.php?3900-Presentation-Championship-Dynamic-Weather-amp-Effects-vs.-Improved-Game-Atmosphere

Improved Game Atmosphere won the bracket.

Refs were begged for. They got in. Now they're improving on them. Again SEPARATE ENTITIES, it's NOT taking away from anything else :fp:

To be fair, if it takes anyway from anything in game development it would likely be fellow Presentation-related items. However, as already speculated it may be a matter of swapping out existing assets for new which may not be too extensive, but again that's just a guess.

[I OU a Beatn]

http://www.thegamingtailgate.com/forums/showthread.php?3900-Presentation-Championship-Dynamic-Weather-amp-Effects-vs.-Improved-Game-Atmosphere

Improved Game Atmosphere won the bracket.

Refs were begged for. They got in. Now they're improving on them. Again SEPARATE ENTITIES, it's NOT taking away from anything else :fp:

Again, how do you know? You have no idea how much they paid the referee to do the motion capturing and whatever else for them. You're just assuming that it wasn't a huge chunk of resources dedicated to it. I merely said when a game like NCAA doesn't have a huge budget(which YOU have said multiple times it doesn't - and it probably doesn't) that these petty features that are implemented take away resources that could possibly be used to improve more useful areas of the game. I said nothing about developing. I said resources as in the game's budget. I'm fully aware there's a game play team, a graphics team, an audio team, and all the other teams that go along with it.

But oh well. Since you say it's not a waste, answer me this. Would you rather have referees over any of the issues I listed getting fixed? I would hope not. I would hope no one would. So again, I have no idea how EA manages their budget for their games. I'd imagine it's much like every other game developed in which they have a set amount of money agreed upon by their publisher, so I just don't see how implementing something like this isn't seen as a waste to anyone who cares about the actual game play.

Maybe you're just really easy to please? :P:D

[bdoughty]

To improve the gameplay you need programmers that can code AI, variables, etc. They also have to have a solid working knowledge of football. Then if you hire new coders, that do understand football, it is going to take them a bit of time to get used to the existing code before they could even think about improving it. When you are down to two football games on the market that is not exactly something any programmer off the street can do. It is a very niche programming job that requires extensive knowledge of the sport. So no matter what the budget size is you still have limitations within the developer base to begin with and a ton of training. You act like everything else should stop because gameplay issues are not getting fixed. Sorry but that is just not the real world. Game will come out next year, meet a delivery date and try their best to please the stockholders.

[I OU a Beatn]

If that had an ounce of truth to it, then why was the NCAA series on PS2 considered one of the best sports of all time, even today?

[bdoughty]

If that had an ounce of truth to it, then why was the NCAA series on PS2 considered one of the best sports of all time, even today?

The same reason people think Tecmo Bowl is he best football game ever? We have fond memories of our past? I enjoyed the NCAA series last gen but it was far from perfect. Horrible framerate many years. One year I recall certain disc were causing problems with older systems. NCAA 06 was great and 04, I recall but those are games from the past. Still had the suction blocking, force fields, skating, etc, etc. I could never use instant replay in last gen games due to some of the most horrific clipping (animations going through each other) in any video game. Also I would imagine that it was easier to code for on last gen systems, most definitely less lines of code to deal with and smaller animations to work with.

Stick in your beloved NCAA PS2 games back in, run some plays, hit instant replay, slow mo, upload them to youtube and we can discuss.


Oh and never forget - 7" Dude


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZcqmYlRcekE

[I OU a Beatn]

Ha. What do you think I did during '08-'10 while I was so desperate for a good football game? I DID play '04 and '07(my favorites) and they were just as good as I remember them. Pass blocking worked well, but the defense still generated a pass rush. Pass defense was a little bad on '04, a little overpowered on '05, and then they hit the sweet spot for '07 on PS2. The option worked but wasn't overpowered. Outside runs could work but wasn't overpowered. Blitzes didn't take 45 seconds to get to the QB.

The key word is that the PS2 games had BALANCE. The next gen games have no balance whatsoever. It takes forever for blitzes to get to the QB leaving them useless, the front 4 generates virtually zero pass rush, run blocking from shotgun is laughable(but slowly improving), pass defense up until this year was a joke, outside run contain is still horrible, etc..

I can deal with skating and suction blocking all day long as long as there's a balance. It doesn't have to be a perfect game, just a balanced one.

[bdoughty]

Game never felt that balanced to me, in typical EA form sometimes the offense had the advantage and some years it was the defense. How you can so easily overlook all the things I mentioned is a touch odd. It is a visual medium and these were things complained about ad-nausea every year at OS way back when.

We will just have to agree to disagree.

[Oneback]

Game never felt that balanced to me, in typical EA form sometimes the offense had the advantage and some years it was the defense. How you can so easily overlook all the things I mentioned is a touch odd. It is a visual medium and these were things complained about ad-nausea every year at OS way back when.

We will just have to agree to disagree.

Here is where the difference between online and offline players comes into play, '04 and '07 are remembered for being great games by online players because they were balanced online, you could play anyone and have a fun game. '12 is approaching that balance we had back then but the lack of pass rush, number of AI exploits and consistent freezes and disconnects have killed a lot of the good will, not to mention a dev cycle that ran 4 months long and forced a lot of people to stop playing the game. The game has never been balanced for offline players, it's a function of CPU AI and how horrible the CPU plays.

[I OU a Beatn]

Here is where the difference between online and offline players comes into play, '04 and '07 are remembered for being great games by online players because they were balanced online, you could play anyone and have a fun game. '12 is approaching that balance we had back then but the lack of pass rush, number of AI exploits and consistent freezes and disconnects have killed a lot of the good will, not to mention a dev cycle that ran 4 months long and forced a lot of people to stop playing the game. The game has never been balanced for offline players, it's a function of CPU AI and how horrible the CPU plays.

Bingo. I'd also like to throw in the lack of online features that we had on PS2 that we've yet to see on this generation, but other than that, you hit the nail on the head. The people that didn't play PS2 online will never know what we're talking about because they never experienced it, but it was way better than what we have now. The games on PS2 would last me a full 12 months and I would be playing it right up until the morning of the following year's release. Now....I'm done in August. :(

[JBHuskers]

Again, how do you know?

I've been behind the scenes for a few years, I have a good idea.

[I OU a Beatn]

You have a good idea on how some of the stuff works, but I guarantee you have zero access to the information I'm talking about, so it quickly becomes a moot point. I would be interested in knowing the budget of the game, though. EA is one of the biggest publishers in the world and has access to a, I'm sure, substantial amount of money/resources. I just believe they view NCAA as the redheaded step child. NHL got a physics engine, if I remember correctly, so it's immensely disappointing to see their football games getting so little attention in the areas where it matters the most.

[steelerfan]

And how do you know that Madden isn't picking up the lion's share of the cost of this? Or even the entire cost?

The big companies I've worked for split the cost of shared assets proportionally to each budget.

Are you going to complain if they "waste" resources on upgrading online features when they could spend that time and money on gameplay? Get over it.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk

[I OU a Beatn]

Yeah, because online is really comparable to referee animations.:D:D

Online is one of the features on the box(and a fairly major one at that) so any amount of money spent on that is hardly going to be a waste, unless it's something stupid like...I don't even know what. Referees are so unimportant(especially on NCAA where half the penalties aren't even called - I've played nearly 100 games online and I've YET to see a pass interference call) that as I said, any amount spent towards improvement is a waste, especially when there's other glaring issues that haven't been addressed for years.

[steelerfan]

Maybe Presentation (which is what referees fall under) is unimportant to you, but I'm sure that not everyone feels that way.

I couldn't give two shits about online leaderboards, but if they improve them I won't be crying that it's a waste. Leaderboards are lame tools for e-penis measurement, imo. You get off to that? Cool.

Remember all the bitching a few short years ago when refs weren't on the field? Obviously, it's important to someone.

So, again, how the fuck do you know what was spent on this, and who paid it? Since you're able to "guarantee" that you know what JB does, or does not, know you must have all the budget answers too.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk

[I OU a Beatn]

I said I guarantee EA didn't give you guys budget info. Am I wrong? Companies don't give out budget info like that, for the most part, because the customers aren't supposed to know. I think that was more of a common sense statement rather than a "I know everything statement."

I'm done arguing about something as lame as this. We can go back and forth on this forever and it's obvious neither party is going to convince the other they're right. I will say this, though, if ANYONE can justify having money spent on something to do with referees when they've ignored obvious game play flaws for 6 years, then :D.

[steelerfan]

You said you were done.

You lied.

You had to get one more jab, in after that. Are you a woman?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk

[bdoughty]

Here is where the difference between online and offline players comes into play, '04 and '07 are remembered for being great games by online players because they were balanced online, you could play anyone and have a fun game. '12 is approaching that balance we had back then but the lack of pass rush, number of AI exploits and consistent freezes and disconnects have killed a lot of the good will, not to mention a dev cycle that ran 4 months long and forced a lot of people to stop playing the game. The game has never been balanced for offline players, it's a function of CPU AI and how horrible the CPU plays.

Well that is all I played is offline back in the day. Pretty much the same this gen but I have ventured into a few OD's.

[bdoughty]

NHL got a physics engine, if I remember correctly, so it's immensely disappointing to see their football games getting so little attention in the areas where it matters the most.

NHL 11 (the title that first got the Real Time Physics) also has far fewer players on the ice and the area in which they play is much smaller. It is only logical to start a new physics engine with this or basketball. Fifa is still their flagship title and only this year did they get a this implemented.

[MtneerManiac]

C'mon. IOU makes a point, even if it's not a huge one. All in all NCAA 12 was a complete abortion and EA deserves zero benefit of the doubt with these things. Tirbuon is probably the worst game development studio in the United States, so I see no reason to give them a free pass on anything until they release something that's not a buggy piece of shit.

[xMrHitStickx904]

I can't believe I missed this thread.

[morsdraconis]

I can't believe I missed this thread.

Meh, I read the first couple of posts and got bored. Same old dumb ass bitching about resource management, like anything said here is going to change the fact that NCAA plays second fiddle to Madden.

[xMrHitStickx904]

I will say this though, IOU makes a valid point. To me, the PS2 games were great, and I played more offline than online. In fact, I didn't become a heavy online player until NCAA 07. The PS2 versions for the most part was balanced, I could out play call somebody and win, it was fun. NCAA 12 was like that too, except the glitches that happened were atrocious. The fact they took out formations because they couldn't fix the glitches in them was enough to make me not play NCAA 12. Things like that is what turns people off. How can you tout a new feature, then the game comes out and it literally breaks the game. I'm all for new realistic features that improves atmosphere, better refs etc. But, when my gameplay and things that really matter towards a good experience are bad from the jump, my pessimism rises. Madden 12 by no means is a perfect game, but it has been playable from Day 1, and I can really appreciate that.

[JeffHCross]

Tirbuon is probably the worst game development studio in the United StatesNot. even. close.

IOU (et al), if you want to read info on budgeting, give this a look: http://teachgamedesign.blogspot.com/2007/10/modern-video-games-are-incredibly-large.html

( By the way, that also dovetails nicely into the discussion of "why are the PS2 games remembered so highly" -- the game's complexity (along with expectations) has gone up considerably )

[MtneerManiac]

Not. even. close.

IOU (et al), if you want to read info on budgeting, give this a look: http://teachgamedesign.blogspot.com/2007/10/modern-video-games-are-incredibly-large.html

( By the way, that also dovetails nicely into the discussion of "why are the PS2 games remembered so highly" -- the game's complexity (along with expectations) has gone up considerably )

Pardon me: "mainstream" game development studio.

More than anything their conduct is shameful. They released a buggy game and then promptly BROKE it in their horrible attempts at fixing it. The biggest draw for me to NCAA is the Online Dynasty feature, and I can't even play that anymore because it's broke as fuck. Furthermore, they're either too inept to perform the needed fixes or refuse to fix the game and instead want people to just shell out full cash for next year's version. That's fucking ridiculous.

So yeah, they are the worst. I don't know another studio that does that. The most buggy game to compare to NCAA 12 is Rage, and at least iD went back and fixed that shit rather than going full steam ahead on Rage 2 (or more appropriate to the NCAA series, and expansion pack).

And please, nobody should be starting in with the "games are more complicated to make nowadays" argument. They've had this hardware for half a decade, they should know what to fucking do with it. If they're THAT slow in figuring it out, they should go and find another damn job.

[cdj]

A couple of thoughts, guys.

- Cut it out with all of the f-bombs and swearing in the News forum. Posts here show up in the comments for front page readers and lurkers. That will stay safe for work. More adult language is OK in the rest of the forum, but I'd prefer more constructive posts. In the near future, we will be making it a forum rule that any swearing in the News Forum will not be allowed. Whether that means post requests for user edits, deletion, warnings, bans will be up to users.

- Let's learn to pick our battles and work to stay on-topic more often. If we're unhappy with the game, certain features, implementation, etc. that is 100% understandable. However, the recent trend has been for threads to delve into general complaints versus specific discussion. It's turning into the boy who cried 'wolf.' If everything added, done, or thought of is met with criticism and complaints, our voice gets lost very quickly and will be ultimately ignored. None of us would respond positively (if at all) to that kind of language at school, home, work, etc. so let's not be hypocrites or internet tough guys. We're better than that.

Thanks.

[bdoughty]

Pardon me: "mainstream" game development studio.

More than anything their conduct is shameful. They released a buggy game and then promptly BROKE it in their horrible attempts at fixing it. The biggest draw for me to NCAA is the Online Dynasty feature, and I can't even play that anymore because it's broke as fuck. Furthermore, they're either too inept to perform the needed fixes or refuse to fix the game and instead want people to just shell out full cash for next year's version. That's fucking ridiculous.

So yeah, they are the worst. I don't know another studio that does that. The most buggy game to compare to NCAA 12 is Rage, and at least iD went back and fixed that shit rather than going full steam ahead on Rage 2 (or more appropriate to the NCAA series, and expansion pack).

And please, nobody should be starting in with the "games are more complicated to make nowadays" argument. They've had this hardware for half a decade, they should know what to fucking do with it. If they're THAT slow in figuring it out, they should go and find another damn job.

Rage? You might want to look into a game called Brink. Both made by Bethesda by the way. All of the Fallout games are buggy as you know what. Oblivion was buggy and so is Skyrim. I somewhat enjoyed Fallout and love Skyrim but when you are taking one of the worst devs in regards to buggy games, Bethesda must be considered for the top spot. I also recall some of their patches breaking other things in Fallout and while I did not play Brink I have heard nothing but horror stories.

In no way am I defending Tiburon, just saying they have some competition in this arena.

[JeffHCross]

rather than going full steam ahead on Rage 2 (or more appropriate to the NCAA series, and expansion pack).Well, since I have no idea who you're including in "mainstream" and not, I'll just say that there are plenty of studios out there that simply close up shop after releasing a title, particularly an unsuccessful. Very few even attempt four patch cycles. Am I happy with the result? Not hardly. But I also know it could be worse. That's not much consolation, but it's there.


And please, nobody should be starting in with the "games are more complicated to make nowadays" argument.Well, I'd similarly say that "they've done it before, why can't they do it again" doesn't hold much water. But we've each, obviously, got our own opinions about that.

[JBHuskers]

Well, I'd similarly say that "they've done it before, why can't they do it again" doesn't hold much water. But we've each, obviously, got our own opinions about that.

Yeah I've never understood that arguement. We're dealing with a completely different architecture here. It took some companies years with the PS3 just to release ONE GAME.

[I OU a Beatn]

Yes, but most of those games are way better than NCAA Football. There is no other game on the market that releases every year and has so many problems. Call of Duty doesn't even have as many problems as NCAA and it gets 10x as much shit from it's customers as NCAA does. EA doesn't get bitched at because of the problems, they get bitched at because they don't care about the issues and just choose to ignore them. If you have devastating glitches in your game and receive feedback but don't even fix them in the following year's game, you deserve every single ounce of hate that you get.