Backbreaker

[JBHuskers]

The demo is out today....anyone with early impressions?

[xGRIDIRONxGURUx]

is it available for d/l on PS3? ill get it after my meeting this morning if so

"E"

[JBHuskers]

is it available for d/l on PS3? ill get it after my meeting this morning if so

"E"

PS3 will probably be Tuesday. Sony just puts content out once a week, Microsoft does whenever.

[Anton32]

I had the chance to play the demo today, with a live stream going and here are my thoughts. If you want to pay 60 dollars for a Arcade Football game then Backbreaker is there for you! The Controls arent smooth as they are in madden, you have to use the RS to pass, The Play art stays on the screen during the play on both sides of the ball, the announcer does not show any enthusiasim at ALL, the Football is Yellow the entire time during the game. Alot of ppl talk about Madden and some of the Flaws it may have, but It is the next best thing to real football! From presentation all the way down to the fans in the stands. Backbreaker doesnt give me the hype as Madden does. When Im on Madden Im always hollaring Lets Go and with back breaker i cant get hyped for it. The Players are Big and Bulky No cheerleaders, IMO its a terrible game. I have been hearing about this game so much on the ea forums and I guess I can say you really dont know what you have with Madden until you play Backbreaker. The Left Stick controls the camera and if you hit it while you press A to hike the ball, your screwed. Terrible Game Not buying it. Ill stick to Madden!

[xGRIDIRONxGURUx]

this is what i was afraid of... from the very start of BB... arcade... a la... Blitz...

always seemed like a huge hit-fest... they made the game all about the "tackle"... and not about the "game" itself...

i will prob still try it... but... L...O...L... at all the goons on "another site" that will be so pissed when they get to play a physics based game and it sucks... 48

"E"

[Deuce]

Since I can't dl today (PS3) I went over to OS and read some of the impressions. I was surprised to see that they were mostly positive. Of course, everyone loves new games at first...time will tell.

[JBHuskers]

Yeah I'll have to download this after I get off work. I've seen enough proof that this is probably going to be okay to play here and there, but will not have any lasting power. Embargo on any reviews til release, devs giving up on the forums back in early 2009....there are some positives with the tiered franchise system and such....but if the game is taxing to just get through, I sure as hell wouldn't want to do multiple seasons. I'll definitely give the demo a shot, and then wait for it to drop to $15....Amazon's starting price point is $44.99, so that may not take long.

[AustinWolv]

Just set it to download on XBL site.

[cdj]

Played through some of the tutorial, some Tackle Alley, and an Exhibition.

I think it's a fun game and has fun aspects. It's really tough to try and appreciate what they've done when everything is in the third-person view. (Maybe there's a way to change it, but I didn't look at all.) The Instant Replay is a slight zoomed out version of the third-person view, so you can't go watch the o-line or anything.

What I didn't like: The controls take some getting used to, the camera angle takes some getting used to, the plays are Tecmo Bowl-esque (about 4 for each Run, Pass, Special, Coverage, Balanced, etc), and the CPU logic was iffy at times (going deep on 3rd & inches, not calling timeout as I let clock run near end of half when waiting to punt) but that may have been due to playing on Arcade and Easy difficulty. I noticed that if you run backwards when going towards a defender (go straight at them, then run at 8 o'clock), you can sometimes get them to dive into the air. Seems like the tackle logic makes the CPU think you are breaking away, so they sometimes dive.

Running the ball is pretty fun in the game. That's my favorite aspect. Didn't look at ratings, but noticed my leading rusher was my FB - sure seemed like a good RB when I used him at the time.

I had a sweet PR for TD called back on roughing the kicker. I didn't get to the landing zone in time and the ball bounced over my head. I ran back, grabbed it, made one or two guys miss, threw a stiff arm and went the distance. However, the penalty negated it.

I am missing how to select your defender pre-snap easily. I kept hitting A and cycling through; hopefully there is an easier way. Though, it is a lot of fun to be on the edge or play as a blitzing defender and try to get the QB. Basically, defense is just Player Lock from NCAA Football, so if you like that you will like defense in BB.

[Rudy]

I don't know if I'll even bother with the demo. The impressions on OS are suprisingly positive but some people are just trying to like it imo. When someone picked the cpu off about 6 times the guy tried to justify it by saying "Maybe futuristic football games will feature 6 picks a game." C'mon. I'm glad some really like it but that camera is awful. I want a more zoomed out view, not a first person camera. I know I won't be able to adjust.

[JBHuskers]

I love how people are saying give it a chance because this is a brand new engine....no this took about four years for them to even get a releasable game out on this engine. Plus it's not a physics based engine....another myth Backbreaker devs confirmed on Twitter. There should be a Myth Busters episode centered around Backbreaker LOL ... with that said, going to finally fire up the demo for Backbreaker Blitz.

[JBHuskers]

Wow....after playing the demo, I don't know if I even want to pay $10 for it. The only cool thing was defense and tackling, but even then there were some animations that looked horrible. The jerseys look like styrofoam (the jersey of the future?), the player models looked horrible, especially when juking. Instant replay is worthless, so is the presentation. The playbooks look like they were designed on the Atari.

[JBHuskers]

Just playing a half at two minute quarters plus the tutorial made my eyes hurt LOL .... I seriously wanted to give it a chance down the road, but man after playing the demo there is not any way I'd want to play a full game let alone a franchise.

[Jayrah]

this is what i was afraid of... from the very start of BB... arcade... a la... Blitz...

always seemed like a huge hit-fest... they made the game all about the "tackle"... and not about the "game" itself...

i will prob still try it... but... L...O...L... at all the goons on "another site" that will be so pissed when they get to play a physics based game and it sucks... 48

"E"

I can't begin to tell you how funny it is that those "goons" thought this was going to be THE game. I mean if you watched any previews, and looked at the play, and then looked at the devs talking about it, and listened to their view of *American* football, hahahahahahahaahaha! You just HAD to know. NCAA just looks better and better from here on though, so that's a positive probably. Nice try BB, but FAIL. :eek: :p

PS. I will be :confused: if BB makes it more than 2 or max 3 seasons, with all the upgrades coming to NCAA and Madden recently. Maybe BB's the reason that NCAA put SO MUCH effort in from a gameplay standpoint this season though. So it's probably worth a "thank you for your sacrifice" situation. Oh the irony.

[Rudy]

I think the EA haters really want to like BB and will overlook a ton of stuff they normally crucify Madden and EA on. There are a couple of guys that I was debating a bit on twitter a couple months ago. They are very critical of EA saying their games aren't sim and then said they couldn't wait for Tecmo Bowl and Backbreaker. I called them hypocrites. Tecmo and BB won't be close to being sims and they get a free pass? The response was - different goals. I simply said then you should accept Madden/NCAA for what they are and not the supreme standards you demand from them.

Don't get me wrong. There was a lot of stuff I didn't like about NCAA 10 and I consider last year's football gaming season to be the most disappointing to me in 5 years. But I don't think it's fair to hold companies to such different standards. I did this a bit with MLB the Show 10 and MLB 2K10 so I'm a little bit of a hypocrite too. MLB the Show just hasn't changed very much and so it got stale for me. I actually prefer MLB 2K10 over MLB10 this year because it's a nice change of pace. There are so many more things wrong with it but it is fun. It does have some things on it's side that the Show needs to adopt - analog controls, better pitching/batting angles, slower pitch speed (the Show has always been too fast for me even with the slider at 0) and better commentary.

[I OU a Beatn]

I played 2 games. I can honestly say I'll never buy it. I have never seen such a retarded AI in my life. All you have to do is run a go route, let the receiver get down the field, and lob it to him. Guaranteed catch 8 out of 10 times. Also, while playing against the CPU, the CPU threw a combined 7 picks in 2 games. That's probably out of like 15 passes. I'm not a fan of the camera at all, and I absolutely hate it on defense. I hate how it doesn't auto switch you if your team comes up with an interception. It makes me feel as if I have little to no control over the game. Definite no buy from me.

[steelerfan]

This game looks like a steaming pile. I will play the demo when it drops on PS3, but wow - the vids on youtube look terrible. I'm glad so many on another site like this turd so much. I can honestly say the guys who like it never have anything positive to say about NCAA.

"This engine is in it's infancy." (after 4 years of dev?)

"This shi*s all over anything EA has ever done."

Seriously?

It took 4 years to make THAT?

[xGRIDIRONxGURUx]

when i get the demo... ill pick it apart... but from the feedback so far... it wont be hard to do... obviously theres not much there lol

"E"

[NatureBoy]

For a game that's been hyped to death for four years, I was expecting to be blown away. To say I wasn't would be an understatement. The horrible camera angle and the awful controls are the two biggest things that come to mind. Tackle Alley was pretty fun but I sure as heck wouldn't pay 50 bucks just to play that mode. I would give it a 2/10.

[JBHuskers]

It's good to see a realistic view of this game over here.

The presentation on all aspects (menus, playbook layouts, etc.) are absolutely horrible. Using the right stick to switch WR's is okay but not well done, the camera makes this pretty worthless as you really can't see much. Throwing the ball is a crap shoot, there is no trial and error on it, it's more of a coin flip.

The one had tackle animation I was talking about....the defender was leading with his chest with his head and legs pulled back....I'll take a "canned" animation over that crap any day.

The player models are ridiculous. This thing has been in development for so many years and everything from their shoulders all the way down to their ass doesn't even move at ALL in a juke (or at all for that matter)....NCAA got hammered for this, yet Backbreaker has it after years of development.

All of these guys saying this is sooooo great and is making Madden and NCAA look like garbage, let's check their gamertags to see if they're playing in August....hell a month from now for that matter.

I'll give it a few more chances but the games I've played already have made up my mind for the most part that I don't even want to get this at bargain bin price.

[Solidice]

I actually had low expectations for this game before the demo, and after playing the demo, I think it may be even lower. I don't have very good "stick skill" ability, but in 10+ games on hard, the CPU has yet to score on me on offense. I've only scored 1 TD on offense myself, but I have about 5-6 punt returns for TDs, and probably another 5-6 on defense due to pick 6's. the CPU AI seems to be very bad. I'm not a fan of the camera angle either.

[steelerfan]

everything from their shoulders all the way down to their ass doesn't even move at ALL in a juke (or at all for that matter)


It's because they all have had their backs broken....DUH!:p

[I OU a Beatn]

I doubt the game lasts for anyone. Not only does the gameplay suck, IMO, but there isn't a whole lot of replay value. I kind of knew it was going to suck, so I didn't really get my hopes up for it being good. Oh well. 3 football games releasing this year and I know 1 of them sucks already. Hopefully 1 of the other 2 is at the very least decent. I haven't played a football game since last August. :D

[JeffHCross]

I'm amused that the reception pretty much seems to be either total love or total hate.

[steelerfan]

Damn, I hope this game announces that there will be some sort of $10 online pass so I can watch all the EA bashers say, "This is EA's fault" or suddenly change their tune and say, "This is smart business - I'm ok with it, this game was made from scratch by 2 guys in their grandma's basement and I'm gonna support 'em".

[JeffHCross]

Yeah ... not a chance. :D

[steelerfan]

You had to quash my dream, Jeff. :sigh:

[JBHuskers]

Problem with that is getting someone to pay $10 for the game in the first place LOL

[JBHuskers]

I'm amused that the reception pretty much seems to be either total love or total hate.

That total love is just from people who totally are against EA......if some of the flaws that were in Backbreaker are in any EA football game, they would write 20 pages of threads about it.

[Jayrah]

That total love is just from people who totally are against EA......if some of the flaws that were in Backbreaker are in any EA football game, they would write 20 pages of threads about it.

And with good reason

[Deuce]

Any of you PS3 guys going to DL this tomorrow? I'll probably give a shot but I know I'll never be able to get over the player models.

[steelerfan]

Any of you PS3 guys going to DL this tomorrow? I'll probably give a shot but I know I'll never be able to get over the player models.

Yeah, I'll try it. I have no expectations of anything resembling football so even a glimmer of that would be a surprise to me.

[JBHuskers]

Any of you PS3 guys going to DL this tomorrow? I'll probably give a shot but I know I'll never be able to get over the player models.

Nah .... downloading it on one system was enough....

[Deuce]

Nah .... downloading it on one system was enough....

I figured...I wonder if I'll make it through a full half.

[JBHuskers]

I figured...I wonder if I'll make it through a full half.

If you do, that's it ... two 2-minute quarters is all you get.....and all you need LOL

[xRomo9]

I was not really impressed with Backbreaker... Yoda "far from Sim it was young Skywalker" ;)

[JeffHCross]

That total love is just from people who totally are against EA.......Not all of them. There are definitely some anti-EA in the bunch, but there are also quite a few that are just excited because of the difference. Backbreaker seems like it has the opposite problem APF 2k8 did. For 2k8, everyone was so focused on the lack of an NFL license that they didn't give it a chance, even with superb gameplay. Backbrearker has been so oriented toward top-of-the-line gameplay that people are ignoring the obvious flaws because it's new and exciting.

I can only imagine a Euphoria engine combined with 2k8 polish. That would blow Madden out of the water, license or no license.

Any of you PS3 guys going to DL this tomorrow? I'll probably give a shot but I know I'll never be able to get over the player models.Definitely going to try it. I'm a game designer at heart, so I want to see what's out there, even if it's not my cup of tea. This is why you'll see me pop Mirror Edge in now and then.

[jaymo76]

Any of you PS3 guys going to DL this tomorrow? I'll probably give a shot but I know I'll never be able to get over the player models.

Not planning on buying it but I will download it just to see for myself how it feels. Actually I am less interested in how it compares to EA. I want to see what it's like as compared to 2k8.

[JBHuskers]

Not all of them. There are definitely some anti-EA in the bunch, but there are also quite a few that are just excited because of the difference. Backbreaker seems like it has the opposite problem APF 2k8 did. For 2k8, everyone was so focused on the lack of an NFL license that they didn't give it a chance, even with superb gameplay. Backbrearker has been so oriented toward top-of-the-line gameplay that people are ignoring the obvious flaws because it's new and exciting.

I can only imagine a Euphoria engine combined with 2k8 polish. That would blow Madden out of the water, license or no license.
Definitely going to try it. I'm a game designer at heart, so I want to see what's out there, even if it's not my cup of tea. This is why you'll see me pop Mirror Edge in now and then.

The problem is I'm almost positive the Euphoria engine doesn't allow fatigue or injuries at all. So all it will be is something different.

I played a lot of 2K8 on the PS3, but just couldn't get into the gameplay. There were so many great things that 2K8 did though.

For most I think Backbreaker is going to be great til August, then it will be relatively forgotten. I could barely stand to play two 2-minute halves with the camera system and crapshoot passing game. I kinda liked the passing game at first, then learned that there isn't much variety to it. The running sucked too with those player models...the juking looked atrocious. The only thing I kinda liked was the defense.

I will probably put it in for a couple more tries, but at this point it's not even a bargain bin buy for me.

[Deuce]

The problem is I'm almost positive the Euphoria engine doesn't allow fatigue or injuries at all. So all it will be is something different.

I played a lot of 2K8 on the PS3, but just couldn't get into the gameplay. There were so many great things that 2K8 did though.

For most I think Backbreaker is going to be great til August, then it will be relatively forgotten. I could barely stand to play two 2-minute halves with the camera system and crapshoot passing game. I kinda liked the passing game at first, then learned that there isn't much variety to it. The running sucked too with those player models...the juking looked atrocious. The only thing I kinda liked was the defense.

I will probably put it in for a couple more tries, but at this point it's not even a bargain bin buy for me.

Ya, I tried 2K8 as well but could not get into it. I tried and tried and tried. Finally sold it back to Gamestop. I never saw what people loved about it.

[JBHuskers]

Ya, I tried 2K8 as well but could not get into it. I tried and tried and tried. Finally sold it back to Gamestop. I never saw what people loved about it.

Simple, it wasn't EA so it's the greatest thing ever.

I actually liked a lot of things about it...especially building up my team with legends, and creating teams. Eventually I just got tired the gameplay.

[JeffHCross]

I'm the opposite, JB. I got tired of the building teams that didn't quite fit what I wanted, but I never tired of the gameplay. Now that I've got my PS3 back I'm planning to play some 2k8 again.

My liking 2k8 had nothing to do with 2k or EA. I didn't enjoy any of the previous editions of the title. But for 2k8, the blocking on it was so impressive. I'm hoping NCAA and Madden will reach that level this year with the improved AI.

[I OU a Beatn]

I'm personally waiting for the day that the exclusive license run out and another developer can make a college football game. I wouldn't necessarily buy it, but I think it would be good for everyone to have a little competition. Look at the NBA 2k vs NBA Live. For several years, 2k has been making Live look like a joke. However, 2k has begun to become mediocre and Live had been creaping up on them every year to the point that I would say Live was actually better than 2k with the 2010 iterations.

Competition = better games for everyone.

[JeffHCross]

The two NHL series have been the same way. And I don't think FIFA would have risen from the ashes without PES and Winning Eleven.

That said, NCAA seems to be rising up this year without competition. Healthy competition always helps, but sometimes willpower and motivation works too.

[Jayrah]

I'm personally waiting for the day that the exclusive license run out and another developer can make a college football game. I wouldn't necessarily buy it, but I think it would be good for everyone to have a little competition. Look at the NBA 2k vs NBA Live. For several years, 2k has been making Live look like a joke. However, 2k has begun to become mediocre and Live had been creaping up on them every year to the point that I would say Live was actually better than 2k with the 2010 iterations.

Competition = better games for everyone.

Did you play 2K10? It's still top dawg IMO. There were definitely some presentation things I really like about Live, especially the interactive seasons with the fans, that was super cool. But gameplay and pregame presentation still goes to 2K. Maybe it's a preference thing though. I really liked ncaa basketball 10 as well, and it was a lot like Live. I wish that they could have made the crowd better in the college game though. There were some decent aspects, but they didn't react well in crunch time like Live did.

1 thing's for sure, if they could get any of that crowd presentation into ncaa football, it would brighten the experience times 100. The crowd sucks the life out of you sometimes

[I OU a Beatn]

I thought the gameplay in Live blew 2k10 out of the water. The motions were more fluid, the gameplay was smoother, and the game just felt better. 2k10 felt slow, awkward, and dated to me. Not to mention I love having the crossovers freestyle dribbling on the right stick as opposed to the retarded L2 + whatever 2k10 used. Like you said, a lot of it probably has to do with preference. NBA Live is a much faster game and that's what I prefer.

[Jayrah]

The two NHL series have been the same way. And I don't think FIFA would have risen from the ashes without PES and Winning Eleven.

That said, NCAA seems to be rising up this year without competition. Healthy competition always helps, but sometimes willpower and motivation works too.

True, true. You don't think Backbreaker brought out the need for a Locomotion type engine and some other stuff from the ncaa team though? I think it had a lot to do with some of the gameplay improvements that they chose to pursue this year. Mainly motion and blocking AI. So in a way, competition was a part of it. At least in my opinion.

[Jayrah]

I thought the gameplay in Live blew 2k10 out of the water. The motions were more fluid, the gameplay was smoother, and the game just felt better. 2k10 felt slow, awkward, and dated to me. Not to mention I love having the crossovers freestyle dribbling on the right stick as opposed to the retarded L2 + whatever 2k10 used. Like you said, a lot of it probably has to do with preference. NBA Live is a much faster game and that's what I prefer.

Yeah I thought maybe preference thing. I had to pull the gamespeed up to 73 or so in 2k, cause I like it faster too. I'm interested to see how ncaa 11 plays in this aspect for me, being that it's a trite slower this year. I think I'll like it though, and I do love the right stick for making moves. Somewhere between ncaa 10 and madden 10 is where I hope gameplay will be as far as speed. From my ear I think that's about the consensus so far.

[JBHuskers]

Competition is definitely better for all parts involved.....look at pro wrestling, until TNA or something else becomes a legit contender, Vince is going to stick with the PG entertainment crap.

Competition is great; however, a mediocre All Pro Football 2k8, and a seemingly annoying and poorly produced Backbreaker are just quick flashes for people to say they're great, then they'll either collect dust on the shelf or go up on eBay once they realize they're not that fun to play a couple months down the road. If APF 2K8 was so great....then why didn't it sell more than 400k copies on both systems combined? And I do believe it started at a lower price point. Not sure on that though.

I mean after playing the Backbreaker demo, I really didn't want to play another game, let alone a season or a franchise. But for me the writing was on the wall when we barely got anything from 505 (and remember the last company to have 3 numbers, I think it was 989 ;) ) in terms of solid information until really late. That conference call that was posted on OS, there were so many NO's littered throughout the feature rundown. I gave the game a good hour, and all it did was give me a good headache from the camera.

The problem isn't EA being a monopoly, because all other games where they're not a monopoly, the competition may put out one good title, but sure as hell can't build upon it. NHL 2K is a huge example, and what was brought up earlier, NBA 2K....I had a blast playing NBA Live this year, and they're gaining on NBA 2K. Another problem is look how much time it took Backbreaker to even get traction and get a firm release date. You can use the excuse of how many are on the dev team or what not, but in the end, it's just an excuse.

[Rudy]

I'm a guy that didn't like the 2K series until 2K3. I had tried 2K and 2K1 but the game was so raw that Madden was just better. But I got a used copy of 2K3 which I really liked despite the tackle bug tipping run/pass. Then 2K4 was awesome. I loved that game. It was second only to NCAA 06 on my football gaming list on the PS2. I actually felt 2K5 took some backwards steps and it disappointed me. So I did give APF 2K8 a chance.

I had liked the engine in the past and liked the idea of playing with Marino but that game disappointed me so much when I popped it in. It felt just like 2K5 but with no team logos and only a handful of players. Throwing to your generic slot receiver just wasn't fun. And the graphics engine looked just like last gen! I swear I thought about throwing the disc in to my PS2 to see if it would play the game. That's what pissed me off about 2K8 fanboys bashing EA's next gen football titles for not having refs, chain gangs, etc. because their game had it. Well their game had crappy last gen player models and graphics. Of course it's easier to implement some of that stuff.

[cdj]

If more people could be logical and state what they liked between two direct competitors like IOU, Rudy, etc. have in this thread, more people would be sympathetic to the 'no exclusive license' debate. It's easy to write off that belief when there are people who demand it, yet when a direct competitor comes out they can only state 'Company A defecates over Company B' despite never owning or playing one (if not both) of the titles.

A lot of sports gaming companies say they have competitors, even if they have an exclusive license. They know at $60 a pop, if their game isn't fun people will just go buy something else. For example, if people play the BackBreaker demo and don't enjoy it, their money may not go to another football game - it could go to Red Dead Redemption, UFC 2010, Alan Wake, etc. Even the most ardent sport gamers play another genre of games and they can go elsewhere.

It'd be great if each league allowed two (or more) studios to make a licensed game, but I understand why they do not. They have an image to protect and if they feel it's best served to only allow one company the license, then I can't really begrudge them. Some people have made the point that leagues should be required (by govt, I assume) to allow at least two companies for each licensed aspect of their sport, but what if they only feel one company is worthy? Why should they be forced to allow anyone they don't want to make a licensed product?

Even if there was no exclusive license, what companies could afford the license anyways? EA could, 2K is iffy, 505 Games probably not. We'd probably be in the same boat. Companies bailed out of the NFL and NCAA games even before the exclusive licenses occurred.

I may be wrong, but I believe the practice of the exclusive third-party license started when 2K Sports grabbed the MLB license and EA Sports responded by grabbing the NFL & NCAA licenses. EA takes the brunt of the criticism, when in all reality they were responded to what 2K started.

Also, I've heard that these licenses are just for third-party publishers. Technically, first-party publishers (Sony, Microsoft, and Nintendo) could make an NFL game similar to what Sony does with MLB: The Show. That may not be right, but I've heard it several times.

[Coachdenz]

I'm going to try and download the demo sometime this week, doubt that I will play it much, but my 5 year might.

[JBHuskers]

I may be wrong, but I believe the practice of the exclusive third-party license started when 2K Sports grabbed the MLB license and EA Sports responded by grabbing the NFL & NCAA licenses. EA takes the brunt of the criticism, when in all reality they were responded to what 2K started.


Yeah I think it's flip flopped. EA obtained the NFL license in 2005 (well December 13th of 2004). 2K's started in 2006. But as everyone knows, it wasn't EA Sports that wanted the exclusive license. The NFL didn't want a $20 product representing them. Before you say that NFL 2k5 is GOD, remember we're talking business and not gaming here. The NFL didn't want to be a dollar store product, so they seeked out who would best be able to hold the exclusive license.

The main difference, the NFL seeked out EA for exclusive rights, Take Two and 2K seeked out MLB in response.

[AustinWolv]

I've really liked playing the Tecmo Bowl remake on the 360 arcade, does that count?
:)

I wish they could bring back Coach K college basketball on the arcade now. That game was the best college bball game of all time.

[I OU a Beatn]

If Sony made a NFL/College football game, I'd be all over it. The Show is golden. And yes, CDJ, I think you're right. I'm 99% sure that the exclusive license only applies to 3rd party publishers. If Sony or Microsoft wanted to, I'm very sure they could develop a NFL game.

[JBHuskers]

If Sony made a NFL/College football game, I'd be all over it. The Show is golden. And yes, CDJ, I think you're right. I'm 99% sure that the exclusive license only applies to 3rd party publishers. If Sony or Microsoft wanted to, I'm very sure they could develop a NFL game.

The Show is golden, but their NBA franchise deserved golden showers :D

[UGA14]

If Sony made a NFL/College football game, I'd be all over it. The Show is golden. And yes, CDJ, I think you're right. I'm 99% sure that the exclusive license only applies to 3rd party publishers. If Sony or Microsoft wanted to, I'm very sure they could develop a NFL game.

I thought EA's deal was entirely exclusive. Whereas 2K's deal with MLB was exclusive only that it pushed out third-party developers so that Sony or Microsoft could develop MLB games... basically all it did was lockout EA.

[I OU a Beatn]

The Show is golden, but their NBA franchise deserved golden showers :D

Haha, yeah, I forgot about that. NBA '09 wasn't that bad, IIRC. It definitely wasn't on The Show's level.

As for the deal, I'm not positive, but like I said, I think the deal only applies to 3rd party developers. I don't know about the deal with Madden and the NFL, but I'm pretty sure the deal with NCAA and EA are similar to 2K's with MLB.

[JBHuskers]

Unless there is a re-up the MLB deal ends in 2012.

[Rudy]

Can't forget that the deals are not just exclusive deals with the league but also the player's union. At any time the NFLPA could step in and say we'll give the license to anyone. The NHLPA actually reached an exclusive deal with EA a few years ago and Bettman and the NHL stepped in and said they would only grant the NHL license if there was no exclusive deal. The NFL and NFLPA don't care about the gamer. They only care about maximizing cash.

[JeffHCross]

True, true. You don't think Backbreaker brought out the need for a Locomotion type engine and some other stuff from the ncaa team though? I think it had a lot to do with some of the gameplay improvements that they chose to pursue this year. Mainly motion and blocking AI. So in a way, competition was a part of it. At least in my opinion.I think it's possible, but it also could be total coincidence. For all we know, they've been working on some of these improvements for two years (because, honestly, this seems like a lot to do in a one year dev cycle).

No matter what, if Madden or NCAA ever get true physics, everyone's going to point to Backbreaker. Maybe it'll actually be true, maybe not. I'd guess not.

[JeffHCross]

If Sony made a NFL/College football game, I'd be all over it. The Show is golden. And yes, CDJ, I think you're right. I'm 99% sure that the exclusive license only applies to 3rd party publishers. If Sony or Microsoft wanted to, I'm very sure they could develop a NFL game.No.

The NFL/EA arrangement encompasses action, simulation, arcade-style, and manager games made for PCs, consoles, and handhelds (both the DS and PSP, included), giving EA a firm hold on the football gaming market. The deal does not include titles for mobile phones or Internet-based games, but does include online features of consoles. The MLB deal with 2k is the only one that allows first-party developers (i.e. Sony) to develop a game using the license. The NFL and NCAA licenses (or at least NFL, I can't find details on NCAA) is exclusive for everything except mobile.

[I OU a Beatn]

Interesting, that's a bummer. Not like they see the interest or appeal of making a college football game anyway.

[JeffHCross]

Give us backbreaker you saps. You’re going to hurt sales for Naturalmotion.Found on the response to the PSN update blog. Lmao. Yes, because that's a reason for Sony to release Backbreaker early rather than when it's done.

[I OU a Beatn]

I love reading those. The most idiotic people you'll ever find make their home in the comment section. :D

[JeffHCross]

Copying from the Utopia BB thread:

It's too bad EA is willing to just sit back on their laurels. They have the resources, the money, the talent, the ability ... they could make (if they used Euphoria) the best football games EVER.

Instead they seem content with making piece meal improvements year to year and trying to squeeze by with just adding a few new animations and features.Something I've been convinced of as I've watched this year's development cycle (and Madden's last year) is that EA Sports did a disservice to themselves by rushing to put out Madden 06 and NCAA 07 on the 360.

MLB: The Show 07 released in May 07, nearly three months after the same title released on PS2 and PSP. The Show 07 is notably known for having barely above PS2 level visuals, while getting in the vast majority of the featureset from the PS2 version.

Compare with NCAA 07, which had significantly better visuals on 360 than PS2, but was lacking all but the basic features.

Since then, we've heard on several occasions that one of the issues plaguing NCAA has been the framerate. The graphics engine was built in such a way to max out the visuals based on the 22 players already on the field. Thus, there was no room for growth in the graphics engine. This means that time (and resources) must be spent on optimizing the current engine to get a few more visuals out of it (i.e. players on the sideline, refs).

I have long believed that the primary issue series like NCAA face is prioritization. We all believe here that we "know" the direction EA should go with their series. And to satisfy the hardcore, we're probably right the majority of the time. But the hardcore, the userbase of Utopia, is not NCAA's primary target audience. It never has been. So that's why features like Season Showdown may make no sense to the hardcore userbase, but the casual fans might find it very interesting (judging by participation in it last year, I think they did).

Finally, one more point to make. In 2004, the late Randy Pausch (he of "The Last Lecture" at Carnegie Mellon ... look it up if you've never seen it) spent some time at EA (not EA Sports, but EA Corporate) and wrote up an academic paper (http://www.etc.cmu.edu/about/press_articles/EAFieldGuide.pdf) about his observations.

A few major takeaways:

One of the biggest challenges for EA is the centralization of tools and technology; currently most titles "fend for themselves," with very little code reuse across EA's portfolio. (There is more code reuse in the Vancouver studio, especially amongst the various sports titles). (Note when I was recently talking about the lack of code sharing between EA titles, I didn't even remember this quote. I had come up with it independently after looking at Online Franchise and Online Dynasty.)

EA, like Intel, is a very paranoid company; there is no sense of resting on their laurels or of taking anything for granted. They are well aware of what they perceive their weaknesses to be.

I thought there was something about legacy code and maintenance, but I can't find the quote now.

[jaymo76]

I was looking forward to dowloading backbreaker today... but... ps3 strikes again. First tecmo now backbreaker. I would suggest Sony not drop the ball with the NCAA demo or else there will be hell to pay. I can live without tecmo/backbreaker but NCAA is entirely different.

[JeffHCross]

Re: Tecmo

Has Tecmo ever confirmed they actually submitted it for PSN? All I've seen is "no release date" since the very beginning.


That just means the title was being planned for PSN, but says nothing about where it is in the process. It seems like people are assuming it's in Sony's QA queue. I find it difficult, at best, to believe that, since we still haven't seen an official date. Contrast that with BB which told everyone who would listen that both M$ and Sony had their demos for review.

There's a significant part of me that believes Tecmo still isn't done with the PS3 version and hasn't even sent it to Sony yet.

[I OU a Beatn]

I very much doubt the PS3 version is even done yet.

[jaymo76]

I very much doubt the PS3 version is even done yet.

But I thought backbreaker was advertising a Tuesday PS3 release???

[I OU a Beatn]

I meant Tecmo Bowl. :D

Backbreaker is releasing Tuesday. Sorry for the confusion.

[Jayrah]

I think it's possible, but it also could be total coincidence. For all we know, they've been working on some of these improvements for two years (because, honestly, this seems like a lot to do in a one year dev cycle).

No matter what, if Madden or NCAA ever get true physics, everyone's going to point to Backbreaker. Maybe it'll actually be true, maybe not. I'd guess not.

Yeah, definitely most of this stuff was 'set up' through the groundwork of last year. We commented a lot before 10 came out that it seemed ea was waiting for 11 to take it up a level. Last year was definitely a 'get through it' year, with the focus being to lay some ground work and update just enough to get it on the market, with some eye candy features. This year obviously is a different story, and I don't know if they were going to hire a new executive producer or not, but that seems to have worked out well too.

[Rudy]

Something I've been convinced of as I've watched this year's development cycle (and Madden's last year) is that EA Sports did a disservice to themselves by rushing to put out Madden 06 and NCAA 07 on the 360.

MLB: The Show 07 released in May 07, nearly three months after the same title released on PS2 and PSP. The Show 07 is notably known for having barely above PS2 level visuals, while getting in the vast majority of the featureset from the PS2 version.

I agree. I'd rather a company port over a game with all it's features and substandard graphics the first year. At least the game will have some polish and claim to be better than the past gen version. After that work on upgrading player models and improving the graphics and animations. EA has usually struggled when going to a new console. Look how bad they ruined NBA Live when they went from the PS1 to the PS2. NHL was pretty crappy too.

[cdj]

Thanks for the correction on the info, dudes.

So is the PS3 delay due to Sony being backed up, them finding an issue in the BB demo or what?

pastapadre had a nice write-up on demo impressions (http://www.pastapadre.com/2010/05/25/backbreaker-demo-impressions).

[Anton32]

I agree, ppl that hate ea will still say bb is better then madden! WRONG

[Deuce]

Thanks for the correction on the info, dudes.

So is the PS3 delay due to Sony being backed up, them finding an issue in the BB demo or what?

pastapadre had a nice write-up on demo impressions (http://www.pastapadre.com/2010/05/25/backbreaker-demo-impressions).

Wow. After reading this I'm glad I wasn't able to dl Backbreaker. Would have been a waste of 30 minutes and half a gig or so of memory.

[JBHuskers]

Wow. After reading this I'm glad I wasn't able to dl Backbreaker. Would have been a waste of 30 minutes and half a gig or so of memory.

That's what I thought about Backbreaker, except I gave it over 60 minutes.

[morsdraconis]

Just to reiterate everything that JB has said about this game; it's basically the most nauseating experience I've ever had playing a football game. That camera is THE WORST and throwing the ball is the most unappealing thing I've ever experienced (and that even includes the vision cone thing from Madden a few years back playing as a QB in Superstar mode where you HAD to switch the cone to whoever you were throwing the ball to before you threw it to them).

The controls are stiff, sometimes unresponsive, and awkward. Even switching to the other control mode, the spin move is atrocious. It's the most canned looking animation crap I've ever seen.

[JBHuskers]

I'm very curious to see the reviews on this. I love how on another site people who were so optimistic on the EA games is so blind. But yet when they're called blind on saying how great Backbreaker is, well you just can't call them a hypocrite.

[I OU a Beatn]

But it has Euphoria physics!!!1!!11

[JBHuskers]

But it has Euphoria physics!!!1!!11

But it's not a physics engine!!11!!!!! :D

Short memory is abundant, but also that engine doesn't have the capability of injuries or fatigue either.....but maybe in Backbreaker 2! *cue sarcasm*

[I OU a Beatn]

EA haters will latch on to anything I guess. I haven't been a fan of their football games either that past 4 years, but Jesus, Backbreaker doesn't even come close to filling that void no matter how thick the fanboy glasses are.

[DavePSU]

I got this in the mail today (full PS3 release). I was sorely disappointed. Game is far too easy, over-complicated, lacking AI and feels "redundant" in a way that I just can't fathom how I'm going to justify playing 10-12 hours to write a proper review.

[I OU a Beatn]

Exactly. The terrible AI and how easy it is just to completely dominate the CPU immediately ruined it for me. Just for good measures, the camera is just horribly designed. Have fun with those 10 hours, though! :D

[JBHuskers]

I got this in the mail today (full PS3 release). I was sorely disappointed. Game is far too easy, over-complicated, lacking AI and feels "redundant" in a way that I just can't fathom how I'm going to justify playing 10-12 hours to write a proper review.

Like I said on Twitter...if you get 10-12 hours of playing in, you're a better man than I :D

[morsdraconis]

Like I said on Twitter...if you get 10-12 hours of playing in, you're a better man than I :D

Better man than most and definitely a better man than me.

I'm extremely picky about video games and this game's demo lasted ~15 minutes before I was like, "Well, that's enough of that."

[JBHuskers]

Better man than most and definitely a better man than me.

I'm extremely picky about video games and this game's demo lasted ~15 minutes before I was like, "Well, that's enough of that."

But it's the best video game EVAR!

[Solidice]

there is a few people who got the game today and been streaming it online. looks like a CPU Int fest, even on hard. don't think I've seen the human lose yet, or even close to losing. AI runs on 3rd and long way too often.

[JBHuskers]

http://www.pastapadre.com/2010/05/28/early-backbreaker-impressions

Pasta's early impressions as he rec'd the full version today. As expected, not that glowing of a review. A whole lot is wrong with the game when the most positive thing you have to say is the load times are good. :D But hearing how easy this game is, I may now get it again as a bargain bin deal for $10 down the road just try to get the platinum trophy. I just need a buddy who will put up with 20 online games with me to get that trophy :D

[Deuce]

Fast load times??! Its a definite buy for me now!

[cdj]

It seems like pasta's comments fit in line with the majority. Some cool things in the game, but also aspects that are detrimental to the experience - both of which should have been expected going into it. I'm anxious to see Dave's review as well.


OS was reporting that GameStop (and maybe other locations, if they get the word) have been given the green light to start selling the game tomorrow (Sat., May 29).

[I OU a Beatn]

Mine is selling them tomorrow. I might actually get it. I have $50 on a GS card and already have all the other games I want in the coming months preordered and paid for, but I don't know...my experience during the demo only goes with what pasta said, the AI is retarded and put up no fight whatsoever.

[cdj]

Mine is selling them tomorrow. I might actually get it. I have $50 on a GS card and already have all the other games I want in the coming months preordered and paid for, but I don't know...my experience during the demo only goes with what pasta said, the AI is retarded and put up no fight whatsoever.

You and that cat are going to find out what curiousity does. :p

I'm tempted to get it sometime, but I just don't think I'll get my moneys worth out of it. I have RDR to complete, plus Tiger 11 and the NCAA 11 demo on the way. Not to mention a backlog of games I haven't beaten (or started) for that matter. I just don't see any longevity in the game for me to pay retail price.

[Rudy]

It's simply impossible to make a good football game on your first try. Even 2K's first game was OK but really lacked polish and had issues imo. It takes years. I think football is the hardest sport to program for since you have 22 players on the field and they all interact with each other on every play. It's truly a team sport where everyone must be in sync.

[NatureBoy]

But it's the best video game EVAR! That's what all the BB trolls that come to the Madden forums having been saying for over a year now. lol! The joke is on them. The demo was more than enough for me.

[I OU a Beatn]

I decided that I'm getting it today. My guess is that I'll get enough play time out of it to justify the $0 I have to spend on it, so it's worth it. :D

I'm really hoping that a lot of people play online so I don't have to play the CPU much. Besides, have you guys looked at the trophies? I'll platinum that in 8 hours tops. :D

[steelerfan]

Wow, TD catches in the back of the end zone are ruled as touchbacks. This game is a complete POS. They should have taken another 4 years to develop it before being bold enough to ask anyone for $50. I don't think I'll even bother with the demo. I've got better ways to waste my life.

[JBHuskers]

I decided that I'm getting it today. My guess is that I'll get enough play time out of it to justify the $0 I have to spend on it, so it's worth it. :D

I'm really hoping that a lot of people play online so I don't have to play the CPU much. Besides, have you guys looked at the trophies? I'll platinum that in 8 hours tops. :D

Yeah the trophy list has what has brought me back to bargain bin buy status. I'll pay $10 for it....maybe $15 at the most.

[JBHuskers]

Wow, TD catches in the back of the end zone are ruled as touchbacks. This game is a complete POS. They should have taken another 4 years to develop it before being bold enough to ask anyone for $50. I don't think I'll even bother with the demo. I've got better ways to waste my life.

Yeah it is just making the anti-EA BB blind lovers look so dumb. Don't forget roughing the kicker on a kickoff return for a TD :D

[steelerfan]

Don't forget roughing the kicker on a kickoff return for a TD :D

Ha! I missed that!:D:D:D

[I OU a Beatn]

My post from Utopia:

Some stats from my 2nd game. 5 minute quarters on Pro-Hard using my created team Florida vs the computer's "Colorado Six Shooters" which was randomly chosen as my opponent.

Team |1st | 2nd | 3rd | 4th
Colorado | 0 | 3 | 0 | 3
Florida | 7 | 10 | 7 | 14|

The Colorado QB had 246 yards passing on 19/38 with 0TDs and 5INT. He was also sacked 5 times. The running backs combined for 13 rushing yards on 12 attempts. All things included, they finished with 219 passing yards, 13 rushing for a total of 232 yards of offense. They had 6 turnovers and 10:55 TOP. They were 1/10 on 3rd down and 1/3 on 4th.

The Florida QB had 389 yards passing on 23/36 passing with 4 TDs and 6INT(see paragraph after the stats). He was sacked 8 times. The running backs combined for -9 yards on 8 attempts. All things included, I had 314 yards passing, -9 rushing for a total of 305 yards of offense. I had 6 turnovers, 9:05 TOP, was 2/7 on 3rd down, and 2/3 on 4th down.

Now, out of this game, there were a few things that really made me go what the fuck? 5 of the 6 interceptions I threw were bombs into one on one coverage where my WR pulled the ol' NCAA act and didn't even try to make a play on the ball while the DB went up and casually caught the ball. This didn't happen for me in the demo, but it's very consistent. It's annoying for sure, but I guess it's better than the demo was. My other pick came on a play where I was going for a post route and a safety coming to play short middle happened to be in the right place at the right time. Had I waited another .5 seconds, it would've been an easy 6.

The running game is retarded. I don't see the point in the running the ball because the blocking isn't very good and it's extremely hard to find holes with the camera.

I LOVE playing defense with the safety on this game. It is so rewarding to make a tackle. I think I had the sweetest play I've ever experienced in a football game. I was playing safety(as I did the whole game) and the CPU had called crossing post routes. I started to go with the receiver on my right, and then quickly jumped back to the one on my left right as the CPU was throwing the ball. I stepped in front, picked it off, and was unfortunately tackled at the 1 yard line by the QB. Pissed I was. [laugh]

Now, the CPU's defense is good enough I would say. The offense is just...not quite up to par. They had no problem moving the ball most of the time but always ran into snags as the drive progressed. They were in the redzone 4 times and only came away with 1 FG from it. One of the turnovers was a fumble off a sack. The ball bounced back 10 yards and my guy was in position for an easy scoop and score. Instead, he pounced on the ball and never attempted to get up. [glare] They would also take untimely sacks and call bad plays(a draw on 3rd and 12 is usually a bad call). They also did something really, really fucking stupid in the 4th quarter. They had the ball at my 10 down 24-3. It comes up 4th down with 2:30 left in the game. They kick the FG. [rock]

They also need to fix the stupid fucking penalties. 4 or 5 times in my game I got hit directly after throwing the ball and they threw a flag for roughing the passer even though it clearly was not. I declined them all, but they definitely need fixed. I saw some missed pass interference calls as well, and did not see a single holding call the entire game.

Editing wise, the team creator is pretty extensive and pretty fun to mess around with. From what I saw, you can only create logos and change the color layout for your jerseys. You can't actually edit the jersey design like you could in APF where you could edit the kind of pant stripe you want, or jersey stripe, or helmet type, etc...

Also, from what I saw, you can't edit your player ratings nor can you edit the team ratings. I didn't look extensively, but those are both major bummers.

All in all, I'm having fun with it so far. It would be nice if we could get a lot of the issues patched up, but I don't see that happening. I'm personally glad I got it, but if you're unsure, I'd say wait until it gets a price drop.

[JBHuskers]

Good writeup dude.

Yeah, I think there was a statement made somewhere that there would be no DLC.

Just for trophy grabbing sake, I'll prob drudge through the games needed to plat.

[I OU a Beatn]

Well, I don't really care about DLC, but if they want my money for BB2, they sure as hell better release a patch or two to fix some of the shit that I KNOW can be fixed. If they just hop right to BB2 and don't support this after release a bit, there's absolutely no way I'm going to support them any further. They can easily patch the responsiveness the right stick, improve the AI in certain situations, and hopefully do something about what I posted earlier:

This is baffling. I don't understand how one of the dumbest things in EA's football games somehow makes it into another company's game. The defensive players' awareness of where the ball is is much, much greater than the offensive player. I tried it a bunch more today and just ended up pissing myself off. The defensive player will actually under cut the route and go for the ball. The offensive player will just continue his route and wait for the ball to come to him. So naturally, the one way to combat this would be to user catch like in NCAA/Madden, but you can't do that. The other possibility is to lob the ball, but the stupid controls for lobbing the ball are so damn hit or miss that I often end up switching to another receiver and taking a sack.

Very fucking annoying, indeed.

[JBHuskers]

Well, I don't really care about DLC, but if they want my money for BB2, they sure as hell better release a patch or two to fix some of the shit that I KNOW can be fixed. If they just hop right to BB2 and don't support this after release a bit, there's absolutely no way I'm going to support them any further. They can easily patch the responsiveness the right stick, improve the AI in certain situations, and hopefully do something about what I posted earlier:

This is baffling. I don't understand how one of the dumbest things in EA's football games somehow makes it into another company's game. The defensive players' awareness of where the ball is is much, much greater than the offensive player. I tried it a bunch more today and just ended up pissing myself off. The defensive player will actually under cut the route and go for the ball. The offensive player will just continue his route and wait for the ball to come to him. So naturally, the one way to combat this would be to user catch like in NCAA/Madden, but you can't do that. The other possibility is to lob the ball, but the stupid controls for lobbing the ball are so damn hit or miss that I often end up switching to another receiver and taking a sack.

Very fucking annoying, indeed.

I was almost heading to bed at that point, meant to say that post release, I wouldn't expect anything. But you never know.

[JBHuskers]

Reviews should start pouring in tomorrow I'm guessing since the game came out early, and most publications probably got it before that. So far scores of 70 and 57 according to Metacritic.

[JBHuskers]

505 is playing the blame game it seems....word to the wise, don't blame Sony for your inability to not pass certification. Below is a comment from one of the better commenters on PastaPadre's site from this story (http://www.pastapadre.com/2010/05/31/early-backbreaker-online-impressions).


The PSN store update just hit for Tuesday, June 1st, 2010 and the Backbreaker demo was not among the offerings for download, despite the game being released in stores across the U.S. today.

This development makes the earliest probable demo release date next Tuesday, June 8th, 2010. This matches up with an email written by 505 Games customer service in late April/early May saying that the demo would be available for PS3 on Wednesday, June 9th, 2010--the store update day for the European PSN store.

http://www.digitalsportscene.com/forum/madden-nfl-ncaa-football-backbreaker/6045-backbreaker-demo-update-bad-news-ps3-owners.html

It has become clear that this delay was the decision of 505 Games, not Sony, despite prevailing opinion that it was Sony that was at fault for the demo not coming out at the same time as the Xbox 360 demo.

Not a good way to start putting the franchise out there to PS3 owners.

[cdj]

IOU - Have you played it much since the weekend? Just wondering if it grew on you or not. Are there many people in the lobbies or on the leaderboards?

[JBHuskers]

Enough scores now for a Metascore. Early ones are not good as expected. 56 on PS3 and 60 on the 360.

[I OU a Beatn]

IOU - Have you played it much since the weekend? Just wondering if it grew on you or not. Are there many people in the lobbies or on the leaderboards?

I've been playing it here and there, mostly Tackle Alley trying to get the Wave 100 trophy. As for as Exhibition/Season/Online games, I'll do what I have to for the trophies, but beyond that, I'm not interested. The AI is way too bad for me to be able to get into the game. I'm playing on the hardest difficulty and I think my closest game was like 52-10. I've only given up one touchdown to the CPU in around 10 full games. Online isn't fun because the defense is so bad that if you get a stop, it's because your opponent doesn't know what they're doing. Not very many people play it online. I think the leaderboards just barely go past 100.

[cdj]

Well, I don't really care about DLC, but if they want my money for BB2, they sure as hell better release a patch or two to fix some of the shit that I KNOW can be fixed.

In this thread at the BB forums, the dev only posted once (http://forum.backbreakergame.com/showthread.php?t=7026) but he didn't commit to saying there will be a patch. He only explained a little how it works.


We may be getting ahead of ourselves (yourselves) but patching works by replacing the executable. Not sure how big it is for BB, but probably a few megabytes (4 or so).

Things that are possible are pretty much anything that doesn't require data... ie, we couldn't change elements of the stadiums since the is held is large data files, or specific animations as they are held in asset files, but most logical things we can change.

Hope that helps - note Im not saying we are patching, just discussing how patches work

Todd.

[JBHuskers]

That's pretty lame to come right out and say "I'm not saying we are patching", considering you should be patching before release on what was wrong with the retail disc.

[cdj]

That's pretty lame to come right out and say "I'm not saying we are patching", considering you should be patching before release on what was wrong with the retail disc.

It's probably 505 Games' decision and they are likely waiting on sales numbers to justify the cost & dev time. Just a guess though.

[JBHuskers]

It's probably 505 Games' decision and they are likely waiting on sales numbers to justify the cost & dev time. Just a guess though.

At the same time, they should have just not said anything if they're not sure, that just stirs the pot even more considering they just released the game, and they bring out a statement like that. I don't think that statement of "I'm not saying we're patching" really has any time of being a good time to say. They're already getting it for blaming Sony on the PS3 demo. It just seems like all news is bad news when it comes from 505.

[I OU a Beatn]

505 Games still has Naughty Bear coming out, they'll be okay.

[cdj]

505 Games still has Naughty Bear coming out, they'll be okay.

And the Michael Phelps swimming game. (If that's still in development.)

[I OU a Beatn]

I got to wave 89 before I used all my lives. This shit is just impossible.

[JeffHCross]

IGN review: 5.0 (http://ps3.ign.com/articles/109/1094390p1.html)


If the XFL was still around today, Backbreaker would be its videogame incarnation. It feels as though Natural Motion's first venture into the sports arena is trying to be over the top but isn't sure if it wants to leap head-first into the arcade realm. I think I would have been fine with the blend of arcade and simulation-style gameplay, but it's some of the game's poor design decisions that ultimately tackle it for a loss.

[JBHuskers]

if the xfl was still around today, backbreaker would be its videogame incarnation.

x :D :D :D

[JBHuskers]

I don't get how people are trashing the IGN review. Maybe they didn't get past that first XFL sentence :D because the score and most of the review are spot on I think.

The end of the review stated:


As it stands, this game feels more like a beefy Xbox Live Arcade or PlayStation Network release searching for its identity than something that belongs on retail store shelves.

I think I remember CDJ saying that exact same thing in regards to it being a PSN Store, XBLA title.

[JeffHCross]

Agreed JB. Anybody trashing the IGN review is a fanboy. You might not agree with the IGN review, but he explains the reasons for his score. You can't fault the reasoning.

[vertigho]

I personally love the game. After my first game, I was starting to question whether I made the right decision in buying it, but I let the game grow on me and now I love it.

Playing this game is very rewarding - you actually to work to become good, but once you get the hang of things, it's a ton of fun. I went from throwing 5 or 6 INTs per game, to now throwing 1 or 2. The physics are awesome and throwing the ball is a ton of fun (once you get the hang of it).
Anyhow, biggest complaints would be the lack of playbook depth and lack of more game options (snow, wind-speed, stadiums).

Overall, I love this game, and if patched, it could be mighty great!

[jaymo76]

Agreed JB. Anybody trashing the IGN review is a fanboy. You might not agree with the IGN review, but he explains the reasons for his score. You can't fault the reasoning.

I haven't played the game yet so my opinion means little but perhaps the IGN backlash is because it's IGN??? Over the years I haven't found IGN score ratings to be all that useful (Madden 08... cough, cough...). Regardless of ratings only positives can come from quasi football competition.

[vertigho]

I haven't played the game yet so my opinion means little but perhaps the IGN backlash is because it's IGN??? Over the years I haven't found IGN score ratings to be all that useful (Madden 08... cough, cough...). Regardless of ratings only positives can come from quasi football competition.

There's the spirit!

[JeffHCross]

I haven't played the game yet so my opinion means little but perhaps the IGN backlash is because it's IGN?Well, I'm sure it's half because its IGN and half because no fanbase wants to see a game they are passionate about to receive a low score.

This is the same fan base that has decided PastaPadre is an EA fanboy because they've decided he doesn't like Backbreaker. :: shrug ::

On another note, I borrowed The Force Unleashed from a buddy over the holiday. After playing some of it and reading the reviews of Backbreaker, I'm even more convinced that euphoria (the animation system that powered both) is incredibly good, technically, but takes a massive effort to actually turn out a quality product. Otherwise it just looks really pretty but plays like ... well ... yeah.

[I OU a Beatn]

Well, if they didn't like IGN's review, they sure as hell wouldn't like mine. I'd give it a 3 at the very most.

[lilheavy]

I think its a pretty solid game head to head. So far the biggest complaints I have overall is the playbook and my RB going down pretty easily when he runs into his own man. Once I got the hang of how the player moves with the camera I really started to enjoy the game, especially on defense. Its very satisfying to read the guard and then make the play as a linebacker meeting the RB in the hole. The physics is awesome when making contact.

Playing offline in RTBB mode is pretty tuff at first because your team is rated very low, in the 20's. It is almost impossible to pass at this point, but once you sign a higher rated QB you can really tell the difference, quicker realease and more accurate. You can really tell the difference between lower rated players versus higher rated ones. The MLB I started off with was very strong and even though I was making the tackle, most of the time I would end up on my back. Once I purchased a guy with more strength, I started punishing RB's in the hole with some vicious hits.

I am enjoying my time with it.

[I OU a Beatn]

FINALLY beat Tackle Alley. It took hours and hours of cussing, swearing, and tons and tons of frustration, but I was finally able to do it. Made it to level 100 2 different times before I was finally able to do it. I'm one of only 3 on PSN to beat it, so it's definitely a very difficult thing to do.

On another note, they may brag about the physics in this game, but Tackle Alley shows a bunch of issues with it. I can't count the number of times I put someone on their face, and they were able to get back up and catch me within 3 or 4 seconds. Complete bullshit. Good luck to anyone trying to accomplish the same, you'll need it.

[JBHuskers]

Let the path to the bargain bin begin! GameStop's deal of the day....

http://www.ebgames.com/gs/thedeal/?loc=homedeal

[I OU a Beatn]

Fuck this game. I'm only 3 trophies off the platinum and they're all time consuming. I'm trying desperately to get them finished off by Sunday when the 50% extra trade in value ends, but I don't know if I'll make it.

[JBHuskers]

Fuck this game. I'm only 3 trophies off the platinum and they're all time consuming. I'm trying desperately to get them finished off by Sunday when the 50% extra trade in value ends, but I don't know if I'll make it.

http://ihasahotdog.files.wordpress.com/2008/12/funny-dog-pictures-let-the-force-be-with-you.jpg

[I OU a Beatn]

:D I'll definitely need it.

[I OU a Beatn]

Oh. My. God. I just saw the dumbest shit I have ever seen on a video game and I'm actually pissed I didn't have my video capture equipment hooked up so I could have recorded it. I was playing the CPU in season mode(damn trophy) and the CPU QB was sitting in the pocket. He does a complete 180 and throws the ball backwards straight towards his endzone. My defender picks it up and scores with it. :D

[JBHuskers]

Probably won't try to platinum this but whenever I decide to get it, I'll at least get the first down trophy :D

[I OU a Beatn]

There's only one hard trophy and that would be beating wave 100 of Tackle Alley. That shit is on the same level as hitting 29 home runs in a single round in The Show 10. Everything else is as easy as pie.

[JBHuskers]

There's only one hard trophy and that would be beating wave 100 of Tackle Alley. That shit is on the same level as hitting 29 home runs in a single round in The Show 10. Everything else is as easy as pie.

I'll get it to pad the trophy stats whenever I can get it for $10. August probably.

[JBHuskers]

First sales figures for Backbreaker top out at a WHOPPING 30k copies - http://gamrreview.vgchartz.com/game/42980/backbreaker/

[I OU a Beatn]

That's about 29,999 too high.

[cdj]

Ouch. I was hoping it would do better than that.

For comparison's sake, here's some other first week sales numbers of semi-recent football titles:

Game|360|PS3
Backbreaker|17,418|11,017
APF 2K8|57,015|16,574
NCAA 10|250,089|149,787

They don't have a license and are a small team, so expenses should be relatively low but I'm not sure it can survive those kind of numbers.

[Rudy]

Those numbers are terrible. No wonder they aren't working on a patch. I think they are lying about BB2. APF probably cost a lot more to make because they paid the HOF guys a ton of money but they will struggle to sell 50,000 copies at regular price.

[I OU a Beatn]

:D This game just wont end. You have to complete Road to Backbreaker which consists of (I think)3 seasons. The first season is 8 games. I get through that quickly. The 2nd is 16. Little longer but not too overbearing. I get to the 3rd season and I have to play 31 freakin' more games. Good Lord. Combine that with the 19 I have to win online and I wanna punch a baby.

[cdj]

PS3 demo should be available today.

[I OU a Beatn]

It's not even worth the download. No, I'm not kidding.

[CLW]

PS3 demo should be available today.


It's not even worth the download. No, I'm not kidding.

Wow I had high hopes for this game. However, everywhere I go people bash this game to death. EA has to be smiling though.

[JBHuskers]

Wow I had high hopes for this game. However, everywhere I go people bash this game to death. EA has to be smiling though.

Man it's terrible...I even gave the demo a good hour+

[JeffHCross]

It's not even worth the download. No, I'm not kidding.Eh, it was at least worth the download. Funny thing is that I'm sucking at it worse than I am at NCAA. And I'm doing pretty bad at NCAA.

[I OU a Beatn]

Got my Road to Backbreaker trophy tonight, which unlocked the platinum, and I did so in dramatic fashion. Road to Backbreaker is simple. You start out in an 8 team league. Your goal is to win that league and advance to the next season which is 16 teams. Your goal there is to win that and advance to the 32 season where your goal is to obviously win the league, beat the all star team, which beats Road to Backbreaker. They dumb down your team at the very beginning of the 8 team league and you use credits you get from winning to buy better free agents. It also increases in difficulty with each league. So, I go undefeated in my first league, advance to the 2nd. I go undefeated in that and advance to the 3rd and final league.

That's where the trouble starts. I'm playing with 1 minute quarters and the hardest difficulty, so it's kind of hard to get into rhythm offensively. I start out 6-7 with the 25th best record in the league. The top team is 10-1-1. I look on the internet and realize that I HAVE to finish first for the stupid trophy to unlock, so here I am, basically halfway through and no way to turn back. Probably should have looked before, but oh well. I start running the ball instead of throwing all the time and eventually work my way to 16-10 with 5 games remaining and I'm tied with another team. I pull the 5 remaining games out of my ass and finish with a record of 21-10, which is tied for the best record in the league. Supposedly, that was good enough, as they gave me the game against the All Stars. If I win, I get my trophy. It's tied 0-0 at the half. I blew a fairly decent opportunity to get a score at the end of the half, which was my own fault. They drive down and waste the entire 3rd quarter. They're inside my 20 and I look over to my buddy and say, "I REALLY need a pick here." Sure enough, next play, CPU throws a bullet right to my user controlled defender. :D

I work my way to midfield with 12 seconds left and overthrow a pass on a wide open receiver. There's 6 seconds left, it's 4th down, and I'm at midfield with the scored tied at 0. I run a go route, pump fake, and throw a bomb for the hell of it. While the ball is in the air, the DB covering me slips and falls flat on his face(it was raining) and my wide out catches the ball and starts running. I get tackled at the 1, but my wide out sticks out the ball and crosses the goal line as time expires. Ding. End of the Road. Ding. Platinum Trophy. Gorgeous.

[lilheavy]

Got my Road to Backbreaker trophy tonight, which unlocked the platinum, and I did so in dramatic fashion. Road to Backbreaker is simple. You start out in an 8 team league. Your goal is to win that league and advance to the next season which is 16 teams. Your goal there is to win that and advance to the 32 season where your goal is to obviously win the league, beat the all star team, which beats Road to Backbreaker. They dumb down your team at the very beginning of the 8 team league and you use credits you get from winning to buy better free agents. It also increases in difficulty with each league. So, I go undefeated in my first league, advance to the 2nd. I go undefeated in that and advance to the 3rd and final league.

That's where the trouble starts. I'm playing with 1 minute quarters and the hardest difficulty, so it's kind of hard to get into rhythm offensively. I start out 6-7 with the 25th best record in the league. The top team is 10-1-1. I look on the internet and realize that I HAVE to finish first for the stupid trophy to unlock, so here I am, basically halfway through and no way to turn back. Probably should have looked before, but oh well. I start running the ball instead of throwing all the time and eventually work my way to 16-10 with 5 games remaining and I'm tied with another team. I pull the 5 remaining games out of my ass and finish with a record of 21-10, which is tied for the best record in the league. Supposedly, that was good enough, as they gave me the game against the All Stars. If I win, I get my trophy. It's tied 0-0 at the half. I blew a fairly decent opportunity to get a score at the end of the half, which was my own fault. They drive down and waste the entire 3rd quarter. They're inside my 20 and I look over to my buddy and say, "I REALLY need a pick here." Sure enough, next play, CPU throws a bullet right to my user controlled defender. :D

I work my way to midfield with 12 seconds left and overthrow a pass on a wide open receiver. There's 6 seconds left, it's 4th down, and I'm at midfield with the scored tied at 0. I run a go route, pump fake, and throw a bomb for the hell of it. While the ball is in the air, the DB covering me slips and falls flat on his face(it was raining) and my wide out catches the ball and starts running. I get tackled at the 1, but my wide out sticks out the ball and crosses the goal line as time expires. Ding. End of the Road. Ding. Platinum Trophy. Gorgeous.

Did the cpu play better in that 32 game season? Sounds like you had a bit of a challenge.

[I OU a Beatn]

Did the cpu play better in that 32 game season? Sounds like you had a bit of a challenge.

Not really. With one minute quarters, it's kind of hard to put distance between yourself. It comes down to whether or not they put together a bullshit scoring drive or not. If they drive down and score a TD and waste a half, then I only have 2 minutes to score the tying touchdown. If I had played with 5 minute quarters, it wouldn't have been nearly as challenging.

[lilheavy]

Gotcha

[Rudy]

I downloaded the demo. Tackle alley was fun. My son thought it was hilarious and liked playing it too. The demo just goes up to Wave 5 so I was disappointed when it wouldn't let me continue. The tackles are pretty cool. I tried a brief exhibition game and I do like the defensive camera better than the player lock option in NCAA because I like how the camera doesn't rotate automatically and it's a bit more zoomed out. I'd love it if NCAA offered a true defensive camera (just rotate it 180 degrees). The offensive camera angle is horrible. I'll never try playing it again. I'm just going to leave the demo on to play tackle alley. My son liked it so if that gets him more interested in football I'll take it!

[Moostache]

I do not try to convert people to like this game - they either are willing to put in the time and learn to play a different style of football game or they are not...but to write it off so completely is a mistake.

There are many, many things missing - most of which have been cataloged in this thread, but the one thing it does do spot on is handle player interactions - collisions, blocking, hits, gang tackles, etc. The things that Backbreaker is missing are all the things that the EA games have on them in spades. Presentation, player models, playbooks, stadiums, etc. But the one thing utterly missing in EA's renditions remains convincing gang tackles and a dearth of tackle and blocking animations in general.

Backbreaker is a mediocre title with some incredible elements to it. I will never be convinced otherwise...it was an elaborate effort to get EA to license the technology for their sports games. With the announcements of real time physics in NHL and NBA 11 titles, I can see that EA decided to go on the cheap and reverse engineer their own version for their games. Make no doubt, THE addition to NCAA 12 and Madden 12 will be EA's homegrown version of real time physics.

Backbreaker is a commercial failure, but it is also a landmark turning point in sports gaming. After spending time with it, I can say that the total lack of multiple impacts (or any real impacts at all for that matter) makes the NCAA demo feel incredibly robotic and sterile and the videos of Madden 11 fair even worse. It will be a geat day for all gamers when EA finally either gets their own real-time physics into the game or just breaks down and licenses Euphoria for the task. PRO-TAK is a hideous failure when viewed side-by-side with the real gang tackles of Euphoria. I just hope the same is not true for EA's homebrewed real-time physics...

[Adam Thompson - EA]

Finally, one more point to make. In 2004, the late Randy Pausch (he of "The Last Lecture" at Carnegie Mellon ... look it up if you've never seen it) spent some time at EA (not EA Sports, but EA Corporate) and wrote up an academic paper (http://www.etc.cmu.edu/about/press_articles/EAFieldGuide.pdf) about his observations.

A few major takeaways:
(Note when I was recently talking about the lack of code sharing between EA titles, I didn't even remember this quote. I had come up with it independently after looking at Online Franchise and Online Dynasty.)


I thought there was something about legacy code and maintenance, but I can't find the quote now.

That's interesting about the sharing of the technology and such. Around 2006 I think we split off a lot of disciplines that shared between different games into their own departments that supported multiple titles. I wonder if that decision was based off this guy's analysis?

[oweb26]

It's not even worth the download. No, I'm not kidding.

So I went and bought a used copy....and........its already back at the store, it was just terrible and I'm fairly easy to please.

[steelerfan]

So I went and bought a used copy....and........its already back at the store, it was just terrible and I'm fairly easy to please.

Wow! LOL!

How much did the one-hour rental end up costing you?

[oweb26]

A couple of hours out of my life, I got a full refund baby, pros of buying used.

[I OU a Beatn]

I still have mine. I'm waiting for GS to have a good deal on trade ins and then I'll definitely get rid of it. If anyone wants it on here, $20 and it's yours! It's the best game I've played this generation! :D:D

[JBHuskers]

I still have mine. I'm waiting for GS to have a good deal on trade ins and then I'll definitely get rid of it. If anyone wants it on here, $20 and it's yours! It's the best game I've played this generation! :D:D

$20 with minus $10 shipping and I'll buy it. $10 is about all I'll pay to try to whore the trophies.

[I OU a Beatn]

That's probably about all it's worth. If I can't get rid of it within the next week or so, I'll just let you have it. Every time I plan on taking it to Gamestop, something happens that makes it impossible to do so, and I know for a fact the trade in value for something like this drops every day. I doubt if it's even worth $15 now.

It's already down to $45 on Amazon, and it hasn't even been a month since release. :D

[JBHuskers]

That's probably about all it's worth. If I can't get rid of it within the next week or so, I'll just let you have it. Every time I plan on taking it to Gamestop, something happens that makes it impossible to do so, and I know for a fact the trade in value for something like this drops every day. I doubt if it's even worth $15 now.

It's already down to $45 on Amazon, and it hasn't even been a month since release. :D

It actually started at $45 at release LOL

[I OU a Beatn]

Oh, wow. I should have bought it from them instead. I had gotten a $50 GS card as a gift a long ass time ago, and figured this was the perfect opportunity to spend it. It probably would have been better spent on Hannah Montana.

[JBHuskers]

Oh, wow. I should have bought it from them instead. I had gotten a $50 GS card as a gift a long ass time ago, and figured this was the perfect opportunity to spend it. It probably would have been better spent on Hannah Montana.

You'd get an easy platinum. I've still gotta play it :D

[JeffHCross]

That's interesting about the sharing of the technology and such. Around 2006 I think we split off a lot of disciplines that shared between different games into their own departments that supported multiple titles. I wonder if that decision was based off this guy's analysis?Very well could be. From my understanding, Randy spent a lot of time working closely with EA, at least in that time frame. It could have been that analysis.

Then again, 2006 would have also been when new teams were starting because of the new consoles. Could be either one, or even both.

[Rudy]

it was an elaborate effort to get EA to license the technology for their sports games. With the announcements of real time physics in NHL and NBA 11 titles, I can see that EA decided to go on the cheap and reverse engineer their own version for their games. Make no doubt, THE addition to NCAA 12 and Madden 12 will be EA's homegrown version of real time physics.

PRO-TAK is a hideous failure when viewed side-by-side with the real gang tackles of Euphoria. I just hope the same is not true for EA's homebrewed real-time physics...

Completely agree on this. I've always felt Backbreaker was created just to see Euphoria to EA for Madden. And I agree that the tackling engine is better than pro-tak. I don't care for some of the shoe string tackles at times but it feels real. Gang tackling in the NCAA 11 demo still feels canned.

[spiker]

If anyone plays this game, you can cut down on the number of INTs the computer throws by playing in "Custom" mode (whatever that is) instead of Pro or Arcade modes. The CPU QB will actually become competent but not a Robo-QB. You should get some closer games on this setting.

[JBHuskers]

I wouldn't hold my breath on Backbreaker 2......only 20k sales on each system currently.

[cdj]

A major patch is in the works for BackBreaker (http://forum.backbreakergame.com/showthread.php?t=8525).


Hi Guys,

I wanted to share something with you. We’ve had to hold back on discussing this for the past couple of weeks but today I can finally tell you that we have been working on a major patch for Backbreaker.

The patch will address many issues and requests raised by the Backbreaker community, so thank you for your valuable input. Further information will follow in good time, but you should be aware that this is something that we are taking seriously and will not be rushing out.

Todd.

[JeffHCross]

PS3 users will see it sometime in December.

[I OU a Beatn]

Well, damn it. I got rid of Backbreaker today. If I would've known this beforehand, I would've gotten rid of it anyway! :D

[Kingpin32]

PS3 users will see it sometime in December.

Who's still gonna be playing this game in December?

[JeffHCross]

Well firstly, I was kidding. I have no idea when it will hit PS3 users.

Secondly ... no idea. Other than a handful of people who, I think, were looking for the flash and don't mind the arcade aspect of the game, I don't know who's playing it now.

[jaymo76]

Finally played the demo today. Honestly, I don't know how I feel about it... I really don't. I don't hate the game but I don't love it either. There is a lot of potential BUT there are so many detractors. I will NOT be buying this game but a Backbreaker 2 may have some potential if they can learn from their mistakes. First off, being a NCAA guy it's difficult to accept anything different from EA so I am trying to like the game but I feel like I'm playing rock em sock em robots.... I mean the graphics are awful... passing game drives me nuts, the lack of features and detail hurt... but... the running, tackling, and hits are a thing of beauty. If this game gets another chance for a part 2 they may be potential for a decent game...

[Rudy]

They announced a patch but people need to remember that patches just fix or tweak some things. Some people think a patch = Backbreaker 2. I've never seen a patch drastically alter a game. It can certainly help by fixing some bugs, making sliders work better, etc but it's not like you are getting a new game. The MLB 2K10 patch took a long time to come out and they still never patched errors or injuries saying they can't fix it until 2K11.

[I OU a Beatn]

There is no patch in the world that can fix all the problems that plague Backbreaker. Not even close.

[beartide06]

Well, damn it. I got rid of Backbreaker today. If I would've known this beforehand, I would've gotten rid of it anyway! :D

Hahahaha that's classic lol. I'd feel the same.

[oweb26]

For whats its worth brackbreaker has an Android app (game) cost 2.99.

[morsdraconis]

For whats its worth brackbreaker has an Android app (game) cost 2.99.

:smh:

[oweb26]

lol....I find one symbol answers funny.

[JeffHCross]

I would expect the Backbreaker Android app would be the same as the app for the iPod/iPhone. It was Tackle Alley, essentially. Since that was one of the more redeeming aspects of Backbreaker, that might be worth a try for Android owners.

[I OU a Beatn]

For whats its worth brackbreaker has an Android app (game) cost 2.99.

That would actually be a pretty fair price for the 360 and PS3 versions of the game.

[CLW]

Got the game coming via GameFLy (it was WAY down on the list). Hopefully, I'll get some quick/easy trophies and mail it back in short order.

[CLW]

Wow you guys were right this game is AWFUL! I'm debating whether to just mail it back now or to mull through it to get the trophies.

[I OU a Beatn]

Good luck getting the platinum. Beating Tackle Alley is an absolute nightmare. If you manage to get that(whenever I got it, I was one of only 5 people who had done so), then you have to force yourself to PLAY through 3 full seasons, and then beat Road to Backbreaker, which is a minimum of 65 games played. I say PLAY because you can't simulate, so you have to play the game yourself. It's a brutal platinum trophy because the game sucks and it makes you play it a good bit, which only adds to the horrible Tackle Alley trophy.

[JBHuskers]

That's okay there is going to be a Backbreaker 2 to make things right.....oh.....wait.....WHAT?.....we've only sold 50k copies???? Okay nevermind.

[CLW]

Yeah I don't think I'm going to mess with it. Back to GameFly you go Backbreaker. I love me some GameFly!

[lilheavy]

Patch Details :popcorn:

http://www.facebook.com/Backbreakergame#!/notes/backbreaker/backbreaker-greathouse-update-summary/416858926465


Backbreaker: Greathouse Update SummaryShare
Today at 9:51am
Over the past few months, the team at NaturalMotion Games has been talking with the community and listening to all of their ideas for Backbreaker. We’ve taken it all on board and, as you know, we’ve been working hard on an update. As a tribute to the Backbreaker forums’ favourite player, we’re naming this update “Greathouse” and it does a whole lot more than simply tweak a few things here and there. We’re very nearly done and now we want to share with you exactly what “Greathouse” will bring to Backbreaker.

One final thing. We take great delight from seeing all your videos and we’re humbled by your support and enthusiasm. If you’ve seen something uniquely amazing in Backbreaker that made you smile, laugh, point, call a friend or rub your eyes in amazement, then you ‘get’ Backbreaker… and we’ve made this game, and “Greathouse”, for you.

Key Additions

Brand new replay camera suite

• New free-flight camera
• Sideline and Endzone cameras including ball lock, pan and tele-zoom function
• A player-centric camera including zoom and rotation function. Track any player on either team.
• Ball camera including zoom and rotate
• Complete replay suite functionality added to Tackle Alley
• Added pause/play to all replay cameras for greater footage control
• Added ability to remove OSD for clean footage capture


Offensive Gameplay Camera

• The Quarterback camera has been pulled back and raised a little. This still keeps the feeling of being down in the action, but provides a slightly wider view and vision over the line
• Added a ‘glance’ button which allows you to instantly check your blind-side


Expanded Playbook

An Extra 59 Offensive plays consisting of these formations:
• Ace – Double Tight End
• Spread – 4 Wide
• Bunch – Bunch right
• Empty – 5 WR!!
• T-form – Old fashioned power football, 3 running backs in the backfield

An Extra 51 Defensive plays have been included consisting of these formations:
• 44 – 4 Defensive linemen, 4 linebackers.
• 46 – Traditional old school defense born of Buddy Ryan
• 33 – Nickel package with 3 defensive linemen and 3 linebackers
• 3 Deep – 7 defensive backs package with 3 deep across the back.

Gameplay Enhancements

Improved Passing Game & Reduced Interception Frequency

Following valuable feedback from reviews and Backbreaker forums, we rewrote elements of the AI that will help make passing a more effective way to gain yards.

Here is a summary of the changes:

• We’ve improved the O-Line for teams throughout the game. This will give you longer in the pocket to make your reads correctly and go through your progression
• We’ve increased the passing animation speed and increased the minimum distance where a long windup will be required. You will now be able to execute the pass more quickly and hit your target more effectively
• There were too many dropped passes to the flats. We’ve introduced a new pass classification for these simple passes and have ramped up the accuracy of the QB when performing this type of pass
• The accuracy of QBs has been increased across the board
• Defensive Backs now fully respect their visibility cone, only seeing interception opportunities when appropriate. The DBs will continue with the assigned role until the either “see” the need to change, or “hear” the need to change, which is typically about 1-2 seconds after the snap
• We’ve tweaked the amount your QB will lead a receiver when activated
• Moved pump fake to shoulder button to make lob passes easier to execute
• Improved mechanism for Quarterback scanning the field
• Reduced penalty applied for throwing out of focus mode




User Interceptions and User Controlled Catching

• Following community feedback, the user is now given full control over interception attempts when controlling a defensive player. Interception attempts are made by holding the left trigger (focus mode), ie. by actively looking towards the ball as it comes in
• Wide Receiver catching in now also uses this mechanic (i.e. hold left trigger when ball is approaching)
• To signal an incoming ball, the user-controlled WR will be highlighted red when targeted by the QB

QB AI Logic

The QB AI has received a major overhaul. Firstly, the opposition QB will now recognise double coverage better. He is also more likely to throw the ball away rather than risk a throw / take a sack. This results in fewer AI interceptions and sacks. We’ve also reworked the QB receiver selection logic and increased prioritisation of throwing to the primary.

Improved Pocket Protection

Following numerous tweaks, the pocket is more solid. Pocket time now averages around 5 seconds and is all linked to the players’ attributes.

Show and Hide Blitz

New ability to show and hide blitz, pre-snap , by pressing the shoulder button.

Jukes and spins

The animation speed of these has been increased and better linked to a player’s agility attribute.

Improved AI Time Management, Audibles and Play-calling

Sophistication of play selection, audibles and timeouts has been improved. Additionally, the AI is more likely to flip their selected play depending on the situation.

Opposition AI

This has been given an overhaul and you should find your opponent much more of a threat. We’ve also rebalanced Easy, Medium and Hard settings to be more challenging and linked almost all AI decisions/speeds to their attributes. Also, you should be aware that all of the notes relating to AI, animation and behaviours above will apply to your opponent as well. These are game-wide changes.

New RB Focus Mode

When holding the left trigger, the camera will turn upfield when the RB is heading towards the sidelines. This is NOT automatic – you need to press the hold the trigger to manually glance upfield.

Stumble Mechanic

We have added a stumble recovery mechanic for when your player has been knocked off course. To recover from a stumble, just press the Action button as quickly as possible.

Fumbles

• Fumbles are now more likely to happen for non-QB players.
• Passes backwards are now classified as fumbles (respecting QB arm movement direction)
• Catches bobbled / dropped within 2 steps as a result of a tackle are marked as incomplete passes rather than fumbles (player deemed not in control of ball)
Bug Fixes & Other High Priority Issues

Friendly Fire!

Your players occasionally reacted too strongly to friendly physical impact. This happened especially when controlling a RB/FB and clashing with your line. We’ve dialled that back, which should make your running game more effective. Players will still react to the collision but will be less likely to be knocked down

Penalties

Users have been reporting a multitude of penalty issues. We have done a comprehensive review of all penalty complaints and bugs (including the infamous roughing-the-kicker) and have been able to resolve them. We believe you will find this drastically improves the quality of the game.

Online Gameplay

• Reduced online lag slightly
• Built in a new protection system against people hacking the game to create a “super team” and taking it online
• Removed the Cancel Stats Posting option as reported by the forum. People were abusing this to avoid losses showing up in their profile
• Fixed a number of other stat posting related issues

D-Line

• Users playing as part of the D-Line were experiencing a slower-than-desired speed in getting off the mark due to a delay in input control. This has been solved
• Users playing D-line can now bat the ball (pull down on the right-stick)
• Spins, rips and swims are now more effective to help you get that sack

Too much Boom!

Stopped “Boom” playing every kickoff. It now only occurs at the start of each half. Yay!

Team Ratings

Offense, Defensive and Overall ratings for teams have been recalculated and now more accurately reflect the quality of the team if all the best players are on the field.

Play Exploits

Thanks to feedback from the forums we have put tweaks in place to prevent exploits on the following:
• RB spinning through the line
• QB sneak
• FG block
• Punt block
• Nanoblitz

Rule Fixes

• Players must take 2 steps before they gain possession of a caught ball
• Tipped punts and kick-offs that touch receiving team players and subsequently go out the back of the endzone no longer cause safeties (just touchbacks).
• Intentional Grounding penalty now causes a loss of down.
• Scrimmage kicks (punts/field goals) can only be returned by the kicking team if blocked before the line of scrimmage
• Two Minute Warning will only stop the game clock after the play has ended.
• Defensive/Offensive Pass interference rules are turned off when the ball touches a player.
• Pre-snap penalties (Encroachment, Delay of Game, False Start) no longer stop the game clock.
• Touchbacks and Safeties are determined by whoever intentionally touched the ball last, instead of whoever physically touched it last.
• Failed field goals restart at the 20 yard line or the point the ball was kicked from (used to be from the 20 yard line or the previous LoS).
• Improved Pass Interference detection.
• Defensive Holding rule now active during punts.
• Game clock is only stopped by a penalty if it is within the last 2 minutes of the first half, or the last 5 minutes of the second half.
• No longer declaring a pass as incomplete if a player catches it in the air with their feet out of bounds (the feet must be grounded).
• Fumbles on a 4th down, or within the Two Minute Warning, can only be advanced by the Defense or by the player who fumbled the ball.
• Improved the "ball carrier" logic.
• Now awarding a touchback when the punting team catches a non-live ball in the opponent’s endzone
• A ball is only considered blocked/batted if it changes the impetus of the ball.
• Intercepting the ball before your own endzone but being carried into the endzone with momentum will now give a touchback instead of a safety.
• If a QB fumbles a ball while in the motion of throwing (i.e. hands moving forwards), then this is now considered a forward pass.
• Ineligible receiver downfield during a pass down penalty now excludes tight ends.

Link to new plays (play art): http://www.flickr.com/photos/naturalmotion-games/sets/72157624482475509/

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs129.ash2/39768_449102331638_14671981638_5941088_2595018_n.j pg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs272.snc4/39927_449102671638_14671981638_5941095_4813363_n.j pg

[I OU a Beatn]

I know I said this game sucked, but holy fuck, kudos to NaturalMotion. That is the single most amazing patch I've ever seen. I don't have the game anymore, so I can't tell how well they work, but they pretty much addressed every single issue I had with the game. Not only that, but they even added formations and plays!! WHAT?!?! How the hell come EA's on their 5th game this generation and they haven't done something like that yet?

I'm not buying it again just to play the patch, as I already got the platinum, but the guys over there have my utmost respect. They knew there was problems with the game, they took their time and made sure they got it right.

[morsdraconis]

I know I said this game sucked, but holy fuck, kudos to NaturalMotion. That is the single most amazing patch I've ever seen. I don't have the game anymore, so I can't tell how well they work, but they pretty much addressed every single issue I had with the game. Not only that, but they even added formations and plays!! WHAT?!?! How the hell come EA's on their 5th game this generation and they haven't done something like that yet?

I'm not buying it again just to play the patch, as I already got the platinum, but the guys over there have my utmost respect. They knew there was problems with the game, they took their time and made sure they got it right.

They've been working on the fucking game for like 3 years. Why wasn't that shit in it already?

[JBHuskers]

Well hopefully they have enough money in the bank for Backbreaker 2, cuz with only 70k sold to date, most people have already made this game an afterthought. They sure didn't mass produce any copies....only 30 or so combined auctions for PS3/360. Which means not that many retailers are selling the game on eBay.

[I OU a Beatn]

They've been working on the fucking game for like 3 years. Why wasn't that shit in it already?

The same could be said for EA's football games. I'm personally wondering why they're on their 5th game this generation and they STILL can't get defense or shotgun run blocking correctly programmed. At least NaturalMotion is putting forth an effort to fix things their community wants fixed. All the issues with NCAA gameplay wise, and I'd be willing to bet a very large sum that not a single damn one of those issues gets addressed via a patch.

Mad respect for NM for actually listening to their community.

[CLW]

That's interesting. I never mailed the game back from GameFly. Maybe I should hold onto it and try it out again.

[morsdraconis]

The same could be said for EA's football games. I'm personally wondering why they're on their 5th game this generation and they STILL can't get defense or shotgun run blocking correctly programmed. At least NaturalMotion is putting forth an effort to fix things their community wants fixed. All the issues with NCAA gameplay wise, and I'd be willing to bet a very large sum that not a single damn one of those issues gets addressed via a patch.

Mad respect for NM for actually listening to their community.

(shakes head)

Mad respect for NM putting out an ARCADE football game that was the most atrocious thing I've ever played and then, take 2 months to release a patch that probably hasn't fixed anything at all?

You've gotta be kidding me. Hate EA all you want, but don't prop up these fuckin' amateur programmers that don't have the slightest clue how to make a football game.

Their patch has nothing on the absolutely terrible pass defense in the game and they've made it easier to pass the ball. Good god. I could already complete 80% or more of my passes in the game and they made it EASIER.

It's NFL Blitz with physics. (yawn)

And, on a side note, don't bring your frustration with playing dumb ass people online into it. It's not EA's fault that you play stupid people online that find exploits in the game JUST LIKE EVERY SINGLE OTHER GAME. For fuck's sake, welcome to playing online. I don't get what you people fuckin' expect to happen.

[cdj]

Let's keep this thread focused on BackBreaker and their patch & game.

[I OU a Beatn]

:D I don't really get what provoked the little flip out, but okay. I was simply saying that regardless of how well it works, I have mad respect for Natural Motion because of their willingness to listen to their community and fix actual problems that the players actually want fixed. I'd personally appreciate that support in all the games I buy, but unfortunately, it doesn't happen.

I also don't get what you're saying about playing online. Backbreaker didn't have issues online. Madden has very few every year. I personally don't think it's asking too much for EA to correctly program the AI so that you can't run money plays every single down. Last time I checked, online play is a feature on the box, so I don't see why issues on that part of the game shouldn't be brought up.

[oweb26]

(shakes head)
And, on a side note, don't bring your frustration with playing dumb ass people online into it. It's not EA's fault that you play stupid people online that find exploits in the game JUST LIKE EVERY SINGLE OTHER GAME. For fuck's sake, welcome to playing online. I don't get what you people fuckin' expect to happen.


IOU tends to have that effect on people from time to time. I think he was due another flip out to keep his yearly average. :) Don't get him started on COD!! LOL

[JeffHCross]

I'd hold off judgement on NaturalMotion's willingness to patch until it's proven any of this is actually 'fixed'. That seems ridiculously convenient to do a sequel-level amount of content in a two month patch.

[jaymo76]

I'd hold off judgement on NaturalMotion's willingness to patch until it's proven any of this is actually 'fixed'. That seems ridiculously convenient to do a sequel-level amount of content in a two month patch.

Maybe, or maybe we have grown accustomed to EA and their minimalist patch reasoning...??? EA is already working on 12 but Backbreaker has no future so they have no development restraints timewise.

[I OU a Beatn]

If BB had no future, do you think Natural Motion would have wasted their time developing the patch? The patch alone almost guarantees a BB2.

[morsdraconis]

If BB had no future, do you think Natural Motion would have wasted their time developing the patch? The patch alone almost guarantees a BB2.

No it doesn't. It's NM PRAYING that people are going to purchase BB now that it's supposedly "fixed" so that their revenue increases enough where they have a reason to make BB2.

Right now, they are squarely in the selling the technology to another company with more resources category to even have a prayer of breaking even on their costs (which I'm sure are quite large even if it was just 4 or 5 guys programming) much less making enough money to justify another one.

[JBHuskers]

I dunno...I think they would need a HUGE push in sales to justify spending more money that they don't have to make BB2.

Red Dead Redemption was in development for quite a while, and granted it had a larger team, they needed 4M to break even (which could have been an exaggeration)....but Backbreaker was in developement forever. We first heard details back in 2007. With only that little of sales, there is no way they are even close to breaking even with it. On top of that 505 is up shit creek with the poor rating of Naughty Bear as well.

Everyone gets one free patch....it's hard telling how long this one free patch was in development. I don't think they started this up at release and it was all based on feedback. There is no way.

[JBHuskers]

Looks like NaturalMotion pulled a Favre .... announced the patch was out, then from Twitter.

GameFocusdotca Update - Don't look for Backbreaker "Greathouse" update. NaturalMotion is backpedaling...

[AustinWolv]

But......do they like Crocs?
;)

[cdj]

The patch is now out for PS3, "soon" for 360.

[JeffHCross]

Maybe, or maybe we have grown accustomed to EA and their minimalist patch reasoning...??? EA is already working on 12 but Backbreaker has no future so they have no development restraints timewise.Uhm ... no. I'm not comparing this to EA. I'm just looking at the list of things being patched, and thinking about any other game out there. That amount of stuff is nearly on par with a sequel, and certainly is eyebrow-raising for a 2 month development cycle. Especially given how many of those things weren't there or were broken after 3 years.

Now, it's possible this was almost 'by design', and NM was working on many of these features before final delivery, but they just didn't ship. That's possible. Unlikely, but possible.

Two month turn around on all of this is insane. The Rule Fixes in particular are the ones I'm hesitant to jump on.

[JBHuskers]

Two month turn around on all of this is insane. The Rule Fixes in particular are the ones I'm hesitant to jump on.

Yeah if they only have a six man team like what was stated or claimed, all of these things are definitely not a result of community wishes over two months.

[ebin]

Yeah if they only have a six man team like what was stated or claimed, all of these things are definitely not a result of community wishes over two months.

Maybe the Backbreaker team spent the past two months perfecting time travel so they could travel to a point in the future where they had implemented all those fixes, and then brought the resulting code back to August, 2010. Hey, it could happen, right? ;)

[JBHuskers]

This quote from Tommy Boy sums it up.


"Here's the way I see it, Ted. Guy puts a fancy guarantee on a box 'cause he wants you to feel all warm and toasty inside. Because they know all they solda ya was a guaranteed piece of shit. That's all it is, isn't it? Hey, if you want me to take a dump in a box and mark it guaranteed, I will. I got spare time."

[I OU a Beatn]

That quote actually sounds a lot more like EA's NCAA Football to me. :D

Of course there's no patch in the world that could have solved all the issues BB had. NCAA, either. Apparently developing a football game is the a lot harder than I think.

[JBHuskers]

That quote actually sounds a lot more like EA's NCAA Football to me. :D

Of course there's no patch in the world that could have solved all the issues BB had. NCAA, either. Apparently developing a football game is the a lot harder than I think.

At least every iteration of NCAA Football I've gotten some enjoyment out of :P

[I OU a Beatn]

I got some enjoyment out of BB - my platinum. :)

[JBHuskers]

I got some enjoyment out of BB - my platinum. :)

But you were walking funny for a few days after right? :D

[steelerfan]

Has anyone actually played this post-patch?

[JBHuskers]

Has anyone actually played this post-patch?

Maybe a couple hundred people :D

[steelerfan]

Maybe a couple hundred people :D

How is that possible?!?!?! This is the game that was nearly half a decade in the making and was going to revolutionise football gaming!!!1!!1 The one that was going to end EA's run!!!1!!1!



:D:D:D

[JBHuskers]

How is that possible?!?!?! This is the game that was nearly half a decade in the making and was going to revolutionise football gaming!!!1!!1 The one that was going to end EA's run!!!1!!1!



:D:D:D

Yeah 30k and 40k on PS3 and 360 respectively will end a run of 2.54M and 2.01M respectively for Madden 10.

[I OU a Beatn]

There hasn't been a revolutionary football game since about 2002. Sports games in general for the most part have been dull as hell since PS3/360 came out.

[JBHuskers]

Coincidence? The week Madden comes out Target has clearanced out their two remaining copies of Backbreaker for $20.

[steelerfan]

Coincidence? The week Madden comes out Target has clearanced out their two copies of Backbreaker for $20.

Fixed. They probably started with 2 copies.

Shouldn't this be in the Gaming Deals thread...wait, my bad, that thread is for good values.

[JBHuskers]

Fixed. They probably started with 2 copies.

Shouldn't this be in the Gaming Deals thread...wait, my bad, that thread is for good values.

Only if they cut it to $10.

[I OU a Beatn]

It's not worth $10.

[JBHuskers]

And sure enough on August 17th, I walk into Target and am able to get a copy for myself and CDJ for $9.98 each (they had only two copies left). This game came out June 1st :D

[I OU a Beatn]

Have fun with those trophies. Road to Backbreaker and beating level 100 on Tackle Alley are soo much fun. :D

[JBHuskers]

Have fun with those trophies. Road to Backbreaker and beating level 100 on Tackle Alley are soo much fun. :D

Yeah I could tell the fun you were having.

[JBHuskers]

The game is a little more enjoyable than the demo, but still just don't feel like a true football game. I'll whore as many trophies as I can off of it, but there is little to no staying power with this game. Tackle Alley is pretty cool, got to Wave 55 last night but it was getting really late so I quit.

[ram29jackson]

The game is a little more enjoyable than the demo, but still just don't feel like a true football game. I'll whore as many trophies as I can off of it, but there is little to no staying power with this game. Tackle Alley is pretty cool, got to Wave 55 last night but it was getting really late so I quit.

what is / how does tackle alley work ?

[JBHuskers]

what is / how does tackle alley work ?

You go through up to 100 waves of rushing down the field trying to avoid the defense coming at you. There are some waves where you have to stay within a barrier.