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View Full Version : Share Your Impressions of NCAA Football 11 (Post-patch #2, LTP #2)



cdj
08-11-2010, 09:52 PM
Starting a new one after the idea from JHC.

With two game updates and two Live Tuning Packages, share your thoughts on the game with the community!

morsdraconis
08-11-2010, 09:53 PM
Defense, in general, appears to be back to what it was in '10. Basically, incredibly easy, even with the sliders I was using to make the CPU better at running the ball prepatch have basically become nothing now as, once again, the CPU is pretty easy to stop.

JeffHCross
08-11-2010, 10:06 PM
So, no reason to try to work on my Max Defense sliders, I take it. :D I finally was going to have time this weekend!

morsdraconis
08-11-2010, 10:22 PM
Oh, I'm sure there's a way to make them actually competent but lets just say I just finished playing a game against Virginia Tech with WVU where I ran the ball for 275ish yards on 25 or 30 carries (Devin had like 20 carries for 230 yards or something insane like that) with rush defense set to 60 and tackling at 50.

I'm probably going to up some things and see if they make a difference. I'm pretty sure that raising tackling actually causes teams to play significantly better defense against the run because I did have it at 55 and they seemed to shut everything down. I lowered it to 50 and it opened up big time. Very strange.

AustinWolv
08-11-2010, 10:50 PM
On my Heisman sliders, after 1 game, my D got sacks galore (QB was holding onto the ball quite a long time....), but the CPU passing % was reasonable and their RB averaged 5.5ypc. Seemed to see better separation against man coverage, particularly when the CPU's S tried to man up on my slot receiver which 86 yards later was a TD......he left him on the cut to the post. The CPU actually played my running game decently, except for the 78 yard TD run I had.....my starting RB was at 4ypc if you leave that run out and the CPU was very aggressive in stopping my run game.
Initial feel, for my Heisman sliders, is that human pass coverage and rush will need to drop slightly, while CPU pass coverage and pass block may need a slight bump up.
Oh, and zones were a bit better about not getting torched as easily......I almost ran no zone pre-patch since CPU would slice them up easily.....now the coverage was making the QB hold the ball a bit and the rush would get to him.

Have to play more games to make sure it wasn't some flukey stuff since it was a home game for me.

gschwendt
08-12-2010, 12:08 AM
Has anyone else messed with fake snap post-patch? fsuprime noticed in a game in our OD that he used it and the opposing DL jumped even when on normal (and maybe on conservative?). He indicated that it could become an issue... any other experiences with it so far?

morsdraconis
08-12-2010, 12:15 AM
Has anyone else messed with fake snap post-patch? fsuprime noticed in a game in our OD that he used it and the opposing DL jumped even when on normal (and maybe on conservative?). He indicated that it could become an issue... any other experiences with it so far?

Against the CPU, I have done it several times and I have yet to get them to jump offsides (that's on All-American with 100 Offsides slider).

steelerfan
08-12-2010, 12:19 AM
Has anyone else messed with fake snap post-patch? fsuprime noticed in a game in our OD that he used it and the opposing DL jumped even when on normal (and maybe on conservative?). He indicated that it could become an issue... any other experiences with it so far?

Twice in 4 games, I got the CPU to jump and give me a "free play". Doesn't seem bad to me. I probably tried about 5 times per game.

Rudy
08-12-2010, 05:33 AM
I was able to play two more games last night with both the patch and tuner. I had read about people saying that a lot of slider tweaks are necessary but I don't think so. Some areas have definitely changed so tweaks may be necessary but I don't think any huge changes will be required. Prior to the patch I probably had both human and cpu running games a little too strong while the passing games weren't quite open enough. The patch fixed both problems for me.

The outside running game is certainly a lot tougher now. I usually run between the tackles and don't use many speed backs so this won't affect me much. But when I called outside runs the results were usually 1-2 yard gains. I did get a couple decent runs but no long runs and my share of negative ones as well. I actually found there were an increase overall in the number of negative runs in the two games I played. I think it's good and helps tone down the ypc. To run outside now I think people are going to have to use it to punish teams cheating inside or use players that have the speed to get outside quicker. I think this is a good change and the overall rushing numbers for both human and cpu will be down a bit post patch.

The passing game has been loosened up for both human and cpu and this was needed imo. Man coverage isn't as tight and I found myself completing a lot more slants. The psychic DBs you would see at times definitely seem toned down. Both myself and the cpu seemed to have more success passing and this is something I was looking forward to. If you liked your sliders pre-patch you might want to boost cpu and human pass coverage a notch or two to keep it the same post-patch. I found the overall offensive numbers in my game to be similar to pre-patch. Its just that the running games took a slight hit and the passing game got a bit of a boost. I don't see a difference in the pass rush. In two games I was able to get about the same amount of pressure as pre-patch so this is one concern that I read about that I didn't see.

I was thinking I hadn't seen many drops until my impact WR dropped a wide open TD pass in the endzone. SOB!! I don't think the Catch or INT sliders need to be adjusted post patch but it's only two games. I had read that quarterbacks were more accurate but I think the jury is still out on that. I still saw misfires by both my QB and the cpu QB. Quarterbacks will have more success now with man coverage toned down but I don't know if the QB accuracies have really increased post patch. With just two games I'm far more likely to keep all my sliders intact at the moment.

I definitely saw a few more penalties than before. You certainly can pull the cpu offsides now. I could never do it prior to the patch. I could catch them cheating but they always got back in time. In two games I got three encroachment penalties and a delayed offsides. Unfortunately, the cpu never drew me offsides and I had my DL on aggressive the entire time.

Maybe I was just lucky but in my first dynasty season I never had any long term injuries. In three dynasty games post-patch (one without the tuner) I've had a RB go down for 7 weeks and my starting QB Forcier go down for 4 weeks. Coincidence or OSU programmer? By the way, screw you Ohio! Had the #1 OLB and #3 DE, both kids from Ohio, commit to OSU this past week. I had been fighting tooth and nail with them the entire season. Not used to not getting recruits but AA recruiting is a lot more fun that way.

I think the punt returns are slightly easier. The blocking isn't quite as dumb but you still won't see many big returns. Kick returns are still tough. I'd rather it be like this than too many big returns but I think it could still be loosened up some more. I think the patch made kicking field goals easier. I have no idea why they would make that change. I had been playing with human FG accuracy at 30 but the last few games the game didn't seem to punish me as hard for not lining the kick meter up right. Am I the only one seeing this? I'll play some more before changing but I really do think this got changed.

Overall I'm happy with the patch. There are some nice changes that I think people will like.

Edit: I think injury notifications are fixed now. Erin Andrews talks more and I think we see them all now.

Also, I only saw one fumble total (on a punt return) between all teams in two games. That may have been toned down.

steelerfan
08-12-2010, 07:46 AM
I've played 4 games and I haven't seen anything that would warrant a slider change just yet. I do wonder about injuries too. I went all season with virtually nothing then had a rash of them in my 2 Dynasty games to close out the season. I still wish we'd see offensive linemen get hurt and a higher occurrence of defensive injuries.

griffin2608
08-12-2010, 09:16 AM
My sliders have changed since the patch. I had them right where I wanted them but now I have to make some changes. Since the patch my pass rush is great, a little too great. Vs Miami I had 7-8 sacks. My run D is great and my rushing is way too good. I had 225 yards on 25 carries and thats them most I have ever had. I think I am going to lower my run block and pass rush and increase the CPU run block and see what that does.

fsuprime
08-12-2010, 11:39 AM
it seems uver v user jump the snap may be broken, i think it may be fine if the users never turn aggressive DL on (i never do) but once someone does and is drawn offsides, even if he changes to normal or conservative his players will be susceptible, lots of talk on utopia about it :/

jaymo76
08-12-2010, 02:24 PM
I agree with Rudy. The patch will have minimal effect on my sliders. The one area that I have noticed a slight difference is cpu rushing and human rushing. My RB aren't breaking huge gains to the outside as often as they were before. That's really good because it has brought my rushing avg down which I just could not fix with sliders. Second, the CPU rushing game is somewhat improved. I originally had the cpu RB at 60 and RB blocking at 80. I am going to move the cpu rb to 50 and the rb blocking to 75 and see how that does.

gschwendt
08-12-2010, 03:04 PM
QB Accuracy may be too good. The sliders I'm using for my OD are set at 25 for HUM QB Accuracy but despite that, my 70THA QB completed 11/21 passes... most of the incompletions were either the defense making a play or me forcing a pass. Pretty much all of the throws were as the QB was standing tall and his couple of throw-on-the-run passes were errant but still yet... just didn't feel right for that low of a rated QB.

griffin2608
08-12-2010, 03:06 PM
I agree with Rudy. The patch will have minimal effect on my sliders. The one area that I have noticed a slight difference is cpu rushing and human rushing. My RB aren't breaking huge gains to the outside as often as they were before. That's really good because it has brought my rushing avg down which I just could not fix with sliders. Second, the CPU rushing game is somewhat improved. I originally had the cpu RB at 60 and RB blocking at 80. I am going to move the cpu rb to 50 and the rb blocking to 75 and see how that does.

What are your rushing sliders set to for HUM and CPU? Also what do you have your tak and Rush d set to for HUM and CPU?

jaymo76
08-12-2010, 04:27 PM
What are your rushing sliders set to for HUM and CPU? Also what do you have your tak and Rush d set to for HUM and CPU?

This is what I am using as of today

Cpu RB 55 (FROM 60)
Cpu run block 75 (FROM 80)
Cpu rush D 70

Hum RB 50
Hum rush block 50
Hum rush D 30

I have tackling at 50 for hum and cpu. Other than the changes listed above I really haven't changed my sliders since week one.

steelerfan
08-12-2010, 06:31 PM
I think I need to trash my ND Dynasty, take some time to rework sliders, and start over.

The sliders I have were perfect before patch 2. Now, in season 4, I'm getting a headache playing the game. I run all over the CPU, I can't pass or pass protect, I get no pass rush, I watch the CPU complete 80%, and I watch them miss PAT after PAT. And, the games are now fumble fests.

I think part of the problem is sliders and part is recruiting and progression issues. I was near the end of year 2 when the first set of fixes hit. That means I had 1 year of bad progression and 2 crops of bad recruits. Now, it shows. I doubt I have the patience to play a few years to let things level out.

But, even if I play horrible teams, the games feel the same. I'm no longer certain if it's bad players, bad sliders or both. I need to play with the default rosters again and see if it's sliders.

I'm skeptical that starting over is going to fix the kicking game. It'd be a shame if such a fantastic game is ruined by so many horribly inaccurate kickers. I know the new classes are better, but I doubt they're good enough. Simming PATs may end up being the way to go.

Honestly, I'm not sure if I have the energy to go through slider work again.

Someone talk me off the ledge, lol.

morsdraconis
08-12-2010, 06:43 PM
Honestly, I'm not sure if I have the energy to go through slider work again.

Someone talk me off the ledge, lol.

I feel the same man and I wish I could but I feel the same way. I'm seeing drastic differences as well in season 4 as well and it's driving me nuts. I hate to start over though cause I'm getting some awesome recruits now and everything but it definitely looks like that's what I'm going to have to do to get any type of consistency out of this game now...

steelerfan
08-12-2010, 07:24 PM
I feel the same man and I wish I could but I feel the same way. I'm seeing drastic differences as well in season 4 as well and it's driving me nuts. I hate to start over though cause I'm getting some awesome recruits now and everything but it definitely looks like that's what I'm going to have to do to get any type of consistency out of this game now...

Yeah, I had the #1 class after season 3. I know what you mean about not wanting to start over. I went 11-2, 10-3 and 11-2 in the first 3 years. I had a blast. Now, I have a headache.

I guess it's up to me to decide if I wanna work with sliders or wait for NHL.

Off topic, I guess, but looking at the CPU's Depth Charts makes me ill. Nearly every defensive position has a FS as a backup. Why on earth would the CPU let an 84 OVR LG rot on the bench while starting a 67 RG and a 52 C? The CPU needs serious work to it's depth chart/position change logic.

Deuce
08-12-2010, 08:58 PM
One thing I've noticed is I can finally get some INT's. Still had several drops but felt I caught the ones that were obvious.

steelerfan
08-12-2010, 10:12 PM
So, I played about a half with the default rosters and, while it may be mental, it sure seemed like the game was playing faster (than my season 4 dynasty). I was using the exact same sliders I have in my Dynasty. Same game speed, everything. I'm beginning to think that the only solution is to start a new Dynasty (after some slider work). I'm reasonably certain, at this point, that recruiting and progression issues are my biggest problem and there's nothing I can do about that. I can only hope the fixes have cleared eveything up or I'll be in the same spot after another few years on a new Dynasty.

morsdraconis
08-12-2010, 10:23 PM
I'm thinking that it's definitely progression causing the issue and instead of fretting over it, I think I'm going to just sim a few seasons forward (still recruiting and everything) and then see if it's still an issue. It's not a very fun alternative, but it's definitely better than completely starting over.

steelerfan
08-12-2010, 10:53 PM
I'm thinking that it's definitely progression causing the issue and instead of fretting over it, I think I'm going to just sim a few seasons forward (still recruiting and everything) and then see if it's still an issue. It's not a very fun alternative, but it's definitely better than completely starting over.

I thought about that too. I don't see myself picking up a few seasons down the line though. When I say "start over", I mean a new team and everything. I think I need to just digest it all for a few days and see what a clear mind tells me.

JeffHCross
08-12-2010, 10:56 PM
I've only played one game post patch, and other than my HUM QB Accuracy being a little higher than I expected, nothing seemed off. CPU running game was decent but not spectacular, my running game was the same.

morsdraconis
08-13-2010, 01:17 AM
Well, lets just say, year 4 with my B across the table team, against an A offense B defense team, I blow them out and run for 250+ yards.

Two games later, same team Bs across against an A- offense B+ defense, I get massacred 60-15, my QB throws multiple absolutely RETARDED interceptions, my offensive line can't block worth shit, my RBs won't break tackles, my corners won't cover anyone, no one will make a damn tackle, etc.

It felt like I changed the sliders significantly when I didn't change a thing at all.

Same offense, same gameplan, same everything (besides playing at their place instead of mine). I mean, that's just fuckin' crazy the incredible inconsistencies put forth by two games. Granted, I was so pissed about that absolute bullshit game, I haven't tried to play it again to see if it was just a fluke or what, but to have such drastic differences in score just blows me away, especially since opponent two had a "worse" offense.

Rudy
08-13-2010, 05:33 AM
I think some of the issues mors and steelerfan are having are due to poor recruiting classes before the patch. I have only had one recruiting class and it was after the first tuning set. Nebraska had a terrible kicker last night but I won't be seeing the progression issues like you guys are and hopefully won't have the same depth chart issues.

I actually think the new patch made running the ball harder. I know I've had a lot less success. I think the human pass rush has gotten a boost and I will tone that down. I think the cpu run block might need some more boosting. I don't see much difference in QB accuracy. One thing I do see is they made all the kickers legs and accuracy better. This might be better for bad kickers down the road but it's not good for the default kickers. I am knocking down every single kicking slider by one notch.

I do notice some glitches. I'm getting audio skips at times when it switches to my custom sounds on 4th down. And I had a game freeze just before halftime of my Nebraska game. I was pretty annoyed to have to play the game 1.5 times last night. Furthermore, replays during the coach's challenge appear to have gone missing. Not a big deal but I don't think it was like that before.

I did see the cpu QB throw the ball downfield on a screen pass. That was nice. Overall I'm happy with the patch but some sliders are going to have to be tweaked. I don't think wholesale changes are necessary based on the initial rosters though.

CLW
08-13-2010, 06:31 AM
I've played several games post Patch #2 now and I'm going to have to adjust my sliders. In my Duke Dynasty I'm in Year 2 now and in the Previous year I got DESTROYED by Va Tech. I adjusted the sliders even more in favor of the CPU to start the 2011 season and I beat Va Tech 34-24 throwing for like 380 something yards with 3 TDs and 0 INTs.

foxdawg2000
08-13-2010, 08:39 AM
two major things i've noticed post patch... cpu qb accuracy increased significantly...
the game glitches at certain points .. happened to me right before a fg...

could be just me but i also noticed a couple times where the WRs caught the ball in a weird animation with their hands...

theres def a diff feel to the game post patch.. i've only played two games since though both on AA... with Louisville (my offline dynasty) first one i beat WV second one got blown out by Pitt...

steelerfan
08-13-2010, 09:28 AM
Rudy, you are correct about recruiting and progression but I would guess that your first class is bad if you started the dynasty before the first tuner. My understanding of the game is that once you start a season and the CPU generates a class, those player's ratings as freshman are set. in other words, just because we can't see that a guy will be an 80 OVR, it's already set in stone. A tuner added in week 11, for example, will not suddenly make that guy an 83. It's too late for that class. The next class (2nd in your case) would be better.

If that's not the way it works, then I only have 1 bad class too.

ebin
08-13-2010, 04:05 PM
My understanding of the game is that once you start a season and the CPU generates a class, those player's ratings as freshman are set.

I'm almost 100% positive this is correct.

Rudy
08-13-2010, 07:18 PM
It's a bit annoying to have to tweak sliders a little more but I think human pass rush (-2 clicks?) and rush defense (-2 clicks?) will need to be toned down. I think the kickers got a big boost in the patch and every one of them needs to be bumped down 1-2 clicks (power and accuracy for human, cpu power although cpu accuracy I'm undecided on). I'm not touching the QB accuracy slider. Still seeing misfires and I like the improvement in the passing game.

Rudy
08-13-2010, 09:50 PM
The more I play post patch the more frustrated I get with the horrible cpu running game. It's just awful right now. I think this area will require a lot more adjusting than I thought. Right now I've got cpu run block at 100 and human run defense at 30. Maybe I should just try human run defense at 0 and see how it plays. The sliders in the run blocking and defense areas are very weak. Reminds me of NCAA 09 in this area and that's not a good thing. I like that the patch made my running game tougher but it's too tough on the cpu right now.

rhombic21
08-13-2010, 10:20 PM
Hook zones are now completely useless when the ball is on the hashmark. I'm not sure if it was always like this or not. For some reason I thought that before the patch you could manually reposition a player and re-hot route him to a hook zone, and he would stay and guard the desired area.

JeffHCross
08-14-2010, 09:28 AM
Agreed on hook zones. I found one way they end up being useful, but that is ... well, not a very useful technique. But without any adjustments, they're absolutely useless from the hash.

rhombic21
08-14-2010, 10:26 AM
Which basically means that zone defense is worthless from the hash. Which then means that pass defense is essentially broken, since the ball is on or near the hash a majority of the time.

JeffHCross
08-14-2010, 11:09 AM
So, in other words, not much has changed from last year on that front. They were broken last year, they're broken this year.

rhombic21
08-14-2010, 11:53 AM
Yes, but this year it's probably a bigger problem because of the running game and also the slightly toned down man coverage (post-patch).

The basic problem is that defenders are too concerned with getting to a predetermined drop point and do not adjust to routes that develop in front of them before they get to that drop point. In the middle of the field this isn't a HUGE issue, since the drop points generally position the defenders so as to remain between the WR and the ball for most of the route anyways, but when the ball is on the hashmark all of the angles change, and so it opens up huge gaping holes in the defense. By the time the defenders hit their drop point and then begin to adjust to the routes, receivers are often running completely free in the secondary.

Because this impacts ALL underneath defenders, there's no real workable way to cover it with manual defense, as there will always be a huge hole somewhere that there shouldn't be. Additionally, the deep zones are just awful at picking up anything other than deep lobs, so if you concentrate on covering the shorter stuff manually then the intermediate to deep stuff will not be covered very well.

JeffHCross
08-14-2010, 12:33 PM
Strange thing ... I was on the hash and called one of the zone defenses ... and then hot routed my two DEs to hook zones. The two LBs in the middle were already in hooks. All four players dropped almost straight back. I almost want to chalk it up to a fluke, but ... I swear I saw it.

jaymo76
08-14-2010, 01:58 PM
After a few days I can now say I have some major issues with this game post patch 2.

1. The game has become to easy... games just aren't as challenging~ I haven't lost a game yet on AA
2. What happened to the cpu rush game? Post patch two not one team has over 100 yards ruhsing.... (the closest was 71)
3. I think zones are even worse than before???

However, the BIGGEST ISSUE that still remains is the CPU DEPTH CHART GLITCH. In year five of my dynasty it is absolutely brutal!!! The strong teams don't have as many issues, but the small programmes are in complete dissaray.

Eg.

Bowling Green:

QB #2 SS
QB#3 FS
RG#1 TE
RT#1 TE
C#1 DT
WR#2 SS
WR#3 CB

DE#1 FS
DE#2 SS
DT#1 TE
DT#3 FS
MLB#1 SS

** notice a trend here? After the game I go and check out BG's roster. They are short in most positions. However, the worst part... no word of a lie...they have 7 Strong safties and 5 Full safties. Once fatigue kicks in it's just a joke. This needs to be fixed. A lot of you who are only in season one/two may not notice this yet but at this point for me it's really impacting a game that just a week ago I was loving. This needs to be fixed ASAP or else a great game will hit the shelf far before its time.

steelerfan
08-14-2010, 03:21 PM
Jaymo, they said they fixed the problem of teams stockpiling certain positions. Your Dynasty (like mine) would take years to correct itself. A patch isn't going to instantly correct a roster that has 7 Free Safeties and such. That would take a few years for that team to turnover their roster.

That being said, I don't know if it's fixed now. The only way to find out would be to start a new Dynasty and get back to year 5 or so.

rhombic21
08-14-2010, 03:37 PM
I wouldn't mind the hook zones issues with the stock plays so much if they at least gave us some kind of over-ride option. It looks like the issue is that the stock plays have hook zones tied to specific areas on the field. If there was at least some way to manually hot route a hook zone that would essentially just drop straight back no matter where the player lines up, then that would be a workable solution.

Realistically, they could also partially solve the problem by having the drop points tied to where the ball is, rather than to field landmarks. So for instance instead of dropping to 8-10 yards and on the hash mark in cover 3, the MLB could instead just drop 8-10 yards off the ball and about 7 yards to the left/right of where the ball is snapped from.

The problem is that right now there are literally areas on the field that are impossible to cover with zones. There is no combination of hot routes that will get a player to go and stand in the desired place. And there are actually multiple players guarding the wrong spot, so you can't even just manually take control of somebody and do it yourself, because that just leaves a hole someplace else.

jaymo76
08-14-2010, 04:49 PM
Jaymo, they said they fixed the problem of teams stockpiling certain positions. Your Dynasty (like mine) would take years to correct itself. A patch isn't going to instantly correct a roster that has 7 Free Safeties and such. That would take a few years for that team to turnover their roster.

That being said, I don't know if it's fixed now. The only way to find out would be to start a new Dynasty and get back to year 5 or so.

Good point Steerlerfan. I guess beig so far into dynasty it will take a lot longer to sort out. That's the crappy part though... I love my team and I don't want to restart. However, do I want to play the next 3-7 seasons before the issues sort themselves out?

steelerfan
08-14-2010, 05:11 PM
Good point Steerlerfan. I guess beig so far into dynasty it will take a lot longer to sort out. That's the crappy part though... I love my team and I don't want to restart. However, do I want to play the next 3-7 seasons before the issues sort themselves out?


That is my quandry too, brother.

cdj
08-14-2010, 06:57 PM
I've only played a couple games since the patch (had to go through offseason in Dynasty Mode), but in a game today the CPU QB was excellent but their run game was very weak. Excluding sacks, I think they had around 10-20 yards rushing for the game. I'm anxious to get into conference play and see if that continues.

JeffHCross
08-14-2010, 08:19 PM
2. What happened to the cpu rush game? Post patch two not one team has over 100 yards ruhsing.... (the closest was 71)In our Online Dynasty, three teams (UNC, Maryland and Iowa) all had 100+ days against top-tier defenses (VT, FSU, and Ohio State).

Rudy
08-14-2010, 08:28 PM
In our Online Dynasty, three teams (UNC, Maryland and Iowa) all had 100+ days against top-tier defenses (VT, FSU, and Ohio State).

Are those sim results or are those cpu rushing totals against human players? If those are cpu rush totals against human players then I'm guessing you guys are playing on Heisman or those guys have no clue on how to stop the run. Iowa is a good running team though.

I'm not a great player. For most guys on hardcore sites I'd probably be considered pretty average. The one thing I'm good at is playing as a LB and stopping the run game. EA ALWAYS releases a game with a neutered cpu running game. I usually have to do big slider changes but that's fine. Now I can't do anything because the sliders are screwed in this area. I've played quite a few games after this second patch and it's a real problem that I think more and more people will find. Right now I don't think people believe me in how screwed up the sliders are. Glad Jaymo tried cpu run block at 100 and human rush defense at 0 to see the horrible results.

Rhombic - have you experimented with the pass coverage sliders in the gameplan section to see how they affect those zone coverages? I do like playing with aggressive zone as it seems better but haven't tried anything else.

rhombic21
08-14-2010, 08:30 PM
The gameplan settings aren't viable. Aggressive zones leaves huge gaping holes down the seams and over intermediate-deep middle.

Oneback
08-14-2010, 09:21 PM
Your best bet when using a zone coverage on the hash is to call a C3 rotation "Cloud" coverage. You will leave the flat to the boundary side open, as with any coverage you will leave something open however.

The Problem though is that EA didn't supply us with a lot of rotation coverages.

In the 4-3 playbook there are only 6 plays that are designed hash zone defenses.

4-3 Normal: Zip Shoot Gut (Blitz)
4-3 Under: Over 3 Strong
4-3 Under: Zone Blitz (Blitz)
Nickle Normal: Over Strong
Nickle Normal: 3 Weak Roll
Dime Normal: Strong Roll 3 (Blitz) will work but you will need to hot route the boundry slot corner to a buzz zone.

There are a few others that you can get to work with hot routing however. Always make sure the cloud corner (plays the flat) is to the field side, if he is playing on the boundary side the buzz defender to the field side will over run the curl leaving it wide open.

Note:
Do not use Nickle Strong: Cloud Zone for this purpose as it covers nothing on the weak side flat or curl, unless you want to hot route a defensive lineman to a buzz zone.

JeffHCross
08-14-2010, 09:49 PM
Are those sim results or are those cpu rushing totals against human players?CPU rushing against humans. All-American difficulty with Oneback's sliders.

To be fair, Iowa only broke over 100 because of a single 74-yard rush against me. No clue how the other two gave up their yards.

Rudy
08-15-2010, 05:48 AM
CPU rushing against humans. All-American difficulty with Oneback's sliders.

To be fair, Iowa only broke over 100 because of a single 74-yard rush against me. No clue how the other two gave up their yards.

By boosting cpu RBA we can have the cpu break the long runs but it's impossible after the second patch to have them establish a consistent ground game unless you go to Heisman imo. Iowa's ground game sounds pretty pathetic against you when you remove that 74 yard run. I know most college backs average 5 ypc in part to longer runs but the cpu doesn't get consistent 3-5 yard runs. There are tons of plays stopped for negative yardage now. Way too much. My NT in 7 games has 21 tackles for loss. It's terrible now.

I even tried a game on Varsity yesterday just hoping the cpu run game would be better (some claim it is) but it still sucked like AA. In a couple Heisman games the cpu can definitely establish a more consistent ground game. At least I have the option of deleting the second patch. You guys don't.

Rudy
08-15-2010, 05:51 AM
What I really don't understand about this second patch is that they boosted the kickers to make them more accurate and have stronger legs. They boosted the QB accuracy (how much can be debated). They dumbed down the cpu running game. NOBODY asked for this stuff. Most people felt these were good or needed to be pushed in the opposite direction. Why on earth would they have adjusted those things? It makes no sense to me.

cdj
08-15-2010, 07:55 AM
What I really don't understand about this second patch is that they boosted the kickers to make them more accurate and have stronger legs. They boosted the QB accuracy (how much can be debated). They dumbed down the cpu running game. NOBODY asked for this stuff. Most people felt these were good or needed to be pushed in the opposite direction. Why on earth would they have adjusted those things? It makes no sense to me.

If true (haven't tested it, but I believe you), that's pretty discouraging. I really liked how they were toned down out of the box this year, but hopefully this is something that a LTP can address. I wonder if they were bumped up to help users who had very poor kickers several seasons into Dynasty Mode before the first LTP arrived.

Rudy
08-15-2010, 09:33 AM
In terms of sliders I don't think the punters were affected too much but the FG kickers have about at least a one click boost in length and accuracy. The one thing I do like about the special teams sliders the last few years is that they are universal across difficulty levels. You don't have to adjust them when you bounce between AA or Heisman.

I actually squeezed in 3 freaking games on Heisman this morning. What I've been doing the last four games is playing a "same" game. Ie. This morning I played VT vs. VT, LSU vs LSU and OU vs OU. It's a really good way to identify imbalances in your sliders when figuring out what to do. I must say I'm very happy with Heisman at this point. It doesn't play cheap imo. It's just harder than most people like at default. With some tweaks in your favour the game plays really well. I don't notice any cheating at all. The only negative is how aggressive the cpu is on defense. They really press and blitz more than on AA. Too many blown coverages where you can hit a player racing down the seam. And I do agree with the one poster on OS that is saying that they tend to do this more on 3rd downs. I hope they tone down the cpu blitz tendencies. I think the cpu can get too pass happy at times but their running game is a lot better on Heisman.

The coach sliders according to guys on OS do not work as well as pre-patch #2. I've never really played with those run/pass tendencies and def aggressive sliders (only available in dynasty under coach positions I think) but some good people are not happy with those either.

JeffHCross
08-15-2010, 07:01 PM
What I've been doing the last four games is playing a "same" game. Ie. This morning I played VT vs. VT, LSU vs LSU and OU vs OU. It's a really good way to identify imbalances in your sliders when figuring out what to do.I suggested this exact technique in the Community Sliders threads. ;)

JBHuskers
08-15-2010, 08:05 PM
Weird....not sure if this is coincidence or not, but the CPU rushed better for me on RTG.

cdj
08-15-2010, 08:21 PM
I played four games today on AA with slightly tweaked sliders (+5 to CPU Run Blocking & +5 Run Ability). Best run game for CPU was 18 for 65, worst was -2 yards, but sacks buried that number. I'm going to bump up each by 5 again and see how that works out.

jaymo76
08-16-2010, 01:05 AM
Yeah, played another AA game vs Oregon.... under 50 total rush yards for the cpu. Whatever EA did, they need to fix it. Here's the question though? Was running affected by the PATCH 2 or Tuner set 2? If it's tuner set two that should be an easy fix??? Hopefully...

Rudy
08-16-2010, 05:13 AM
I'd like to know if the devs are reading some of these concerns. The broken sliders (cpu run block and human run defense) are a huge concern for me. I want those fixed.

Jayrah
08-16-2010, 11:17 PM
I personally think the problem is that across the community boards, kids that get the game and have a difficult time adjusting start complaining that everything is too hard. "OMG it's too hard to run against the cpu. Defense needs to be toned down", etc. That's my read on some of the changes. Like cdj said it was nice how everything was toned "down" to start, and also the recruit rating issue probably is to blame for the special teams boost.

Jayrah
08-16-2010, 11:24 PM
I'd like to know if the devs are reading some of these concerns. The broken sliders (cpu run block and human run defense) are a huge concern for me. I want those fixed.

That's weird because across the board in about 6 games between mine and my brother's dynasties (post patch) the cpu avg rushing has been higher than before, at anywhere from 135-156 yards/game. TF LoC Sliders on all 3 dynasties I'm in.
http://www.traditionfootball.com/forums/showpost.php?p=263642&postcount=2

morsdraconis
08-17-2010, 12:48 AM
That's weird because across the board in about 6 games between mine and my brother's dynasties (post patch) the cpu avg rushing has been higher than before, at anywhere from 135-156 yards/game. TF LoC Sliders on all 3 dynasties I'm in.
http://www.traditionfootball.com/forums/showpost.php?p=263642&postcount=2

Thanks for those man!

I've been meaning to look and see what you guys have been using on All-American and I'm DEFINITELY going to start using those cause I know you guys are right around my skill level so those sliders are going to be great for me.

:thumbsup:

rhombic21
08-17-2010, 01:06 AM
I am still really enjoying this game post-patch. Just hope they hurry up and fix that pump fake glitch so I can play randoms again.

cdj
08-18-2010, 07:58 PM
I saw a tweet from adembroski where he said deleting his tuning file from his system and redownloading the last one fixed some QB accuracy issues.

Rudy
08-19-2010, 05:38 AM
I'm going to give that a try tonight Chris. Can't hurt. He said that Ryan told him that the patch/tuner shouldn't have touched the sliders either. I will find out but I still think they inadvertently broke something. If it doesn't work after that I'm going to delete everything to see how the sliders work without the patches and tuning files.

Rudy
08-19-2010, 08:53 PM
Well I deleted the tuning file and redownloaded it. I didn't see any difference. All I know is they made kickers have stronger legs and be more accurate, made QBs more accurate, made WRs hands a touch better for less drops and broke the cpu run block and human rush defense slider. A lot of changes went away from sim football. I do like the fact they made the outside running game tougher and loosened up the man coverage a bit but the zone coverage against the cpu absolutely blows now. It was at least useable before with aggressive coverage.

I'm still having fun but only on Heisman. AA is completely ruined for me right now. I will say I still see a ton of super leaping swats on Heisman. That could be toned down some more. I hope EA boost up zone coverage to make it more effective and fixes the sliders. That would really improve the game and let me finetune things better.

Played the Little Brown Jug today in the 2nd year of my dynasty. I had a blood pressure game - the kind that pisses you off like crazy. I was playing at home against Minnesota. They are a B team and I'm a B+ so I'm figuring it won't be too hard. They jump out to a 17-0 lead. I'm fuming. Then I score a TD to make it 17-7. Next possession my NT strips the ball and I recover their fumble with less than 2 minutes to go and inside their 25. I punch in another TD to only trail 17-14 at the half. I get the ball first in the second half and promptly score two more times to lead 28-17. I think I've got it made. Wrong.

With just under two minutes left they score a TD and get the 2 point conversion to cut the lead to 28-25. Then they recover the onside kick. They actually march down to my one yard line where I make a goalline stand to force the tying FG. Off to OT and my defense holds and they miss the FG! I march down and punch one in the end zone to win 34-28. I really struggled running the ball but Odoms and Roundtree are impact WRs so they bailed me out in this game. Great game score over 500 (#9 for me) but that game frustrated the heck out of me. I think Minny did pull off an upset at the Big House a few years ago while Carr was coach. That wasn't fun either.

morsdraconis
08-19-2010, 09:31 PM
Well I deleted the tuning file and redownloaded it. I didn't see any difference. All I know is they made kickers have stronger legs and be more accurate, made QBs more accurate, made WRs hands a touch better for less drops and broke the cpu run block and human rush defense slider. A lot of changes went away from sim football. I do like the fact they made the outside running game tougher and loosened up the man coverage a bit but the zone coverage against the cpu absolutely blows now. It was at least useable before with aggressive coverage.

I'm still having fun but only on Heisman. AA is completely ruined for me right now. I will say I still see a ton of super leaping swats on Heisman. That could be toned down some more. I hope EA boost up zone coverage to make it more effective and fixes the sliders. That would really improve the game and let me finetune things better.

Played the Little Brown Jug today in the 2nd year of my dynasty. I had a blood pressure game - the kind that pisses you off like crazy. I was playing at home against Minnesota. They are a B team and I'm a B+ so I'm figuring it won't be too hard. They jump out to a 17-0 lead. I'm fuming. Then I score a TD to make it 17-7. Next possession my NT strips the ball and I recover their fumble with less than 2 minutes to go and inside their 25. I punch in another TD to only trail 17-14 at the half. I get the ball first in the second half and promptly score two more times to lead 28-17. I think I've got it made. Wrong.

With just under two minutes left they score a TD and get the 2 point conversion to cut the lead to 28-25. Then they recover the onside kick. They actually march down to my one yard line where I make a goalline stand to force the tying FG. Off to OT and my defense holds and they miss the FG! I march down and punch one in the end zone to win 34-28. I really struggled running the ball but Odoms and Roundtree are impact WRs so they bailed me out in this game. Great game score over 500 (#9 for me) but that game frustrated the heck out of me. I think Minny did pull off an upset at the Big House a few years ago while Carr was coach. That wasn't fun either.

I've had games like that as well. I think that's what's great about college football and how they translate it to this game. It can really seem like the records are thrown out the door when teams play in rivalry games sometimes and it just makes a game that otherwise would probably be an easy game to win an absolute headache to pull out. It makes you feel that much better about it too when you pull off the win.

Also, I've found AA fun again. Used the sliders that Jayrah linked to over at Traditionfootball.com and they are GREAT. Granted, I'm back to beating CPU teams that are clearly better than me (B+ teams and I'm B), and I don't mind the fact that I've went like 60-0 over the last 5 seasons in my teambuilder dynasty cause that's just what happens when I go to the Big East and I'm clearly a better team than anyone else in the conference. And, during that time, I've had NUMEROUS close call games where I've had to pull it out in the end, so, in the end, I'm happy with my dynasty on AA still.

jaymo76
08-20-2010, 01:17 AM
I haven't played in about three days (NCAA hangover...) but I fired it up today and played a rematch against the Ducks. Last game (play now) I held them to under 50 yards rushing and blew them out 38-7. Well today in dynasty it was a little different.

:Arizona_State: 14 :Oregon: 44 *it was an absolute blowout

O QB 24-32 381 YDS (15 RUSHES 97 YARDS)
O FB 11 carries for 76 yards
O RB 5 carries for 55 yards (then he got injured)
** due to the depth chart glitch Oregon had no more RB's (but they had 4 FB's)

I had 14 yards rushing on 13 carries... this game was just embarrasing. Maybe things aren't so bad post patch???


This recap was brought to you by :reeses: the perfect combination of chocolate and peanut butter

morsdraconis
08-20-2010, 02:42 AM
This recap was brought to you by :reeses: the perfect combination of chocolate and peanut butter

:D

Rudy
08-20-2010, 05:05 AM
Maybe next year we'll get a better sponsor.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Tu76mbalNwg/SZB4-tdXHhI/AAAAAAAAAZ0/QCaUv9dg38Y/s400/217x215_aero.jpg


I think what probably caught me off guard in the Minnesota game is that NCAA 11 is back to being fair and unpredictable on Heisman. AA had become too easy post patch and now I have to fight to win. Apathy had set in on AA and now Heisman forces you to wake up and play smart all game long.

JBHuskers
08-20-2010, 10:15 AM
I think we need to honor the memory of Billy Mays and have NCAA 12 sponsored by Mighty Putty!

http://rotolo.syr.edu/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/mity-putty.jpg

I need to get some more sample sets, but I think struggling on Madden has made me a lot better post-patch on NCAA. I'm going to try to find some time to get my Nebraska Tech dyansty going...that will be a truly good meter of seeing things post-patch.

Deuce
08-20-2010, 10:20 AM
I think JB made a prediction that this game would compare to 2004...I agree 100%. I'm now in my sixth season and I'm still having great games. In season 4 I actually had my first losing season ever (6-7). The next season I went 11-2 but got blown out in the Fiesta bowl by tOSU. This season I'm 4-0 but 2 of those games could have gone either way.

I really can't believe I'm in my 6th season and still not even close to being bored. One thing I've done to help keep me interested is after a good season I assume my o-coordinator gets a head coaching gig and I have to change my O. It's really helped keep the game fresh.

What 'tricks' do you guys use to keep things challenging and fresh?

jaymo76
08-21-2010, 01:49 AM
I think JB made a prediction that this game would compare to 2004...I agree 100%. I'm now in my sixth season and I'm still having great games. In season 4 I actually had my first losing season ever (6-7). The next season I went 11-2 but got blown out in the Fiesta bowl by tOSU. This season I'm 4-0 but 2 of those games could have gone either way.

I really can't believe I'm in my 6th season and still not even close to being bored. One thing I've done to help keep me interested is after a good season I assume my o-coordinator gets a head coaching gig and I have to change my O. It's really helped keep the game fresh.

What 'tricks' do you guys use to keep things challenging and fresh?

After season six I quit my job before the season starts (as a result I lose prestige, etc.) and I then take over a school ranked between 100-120 and start the process again. However, this will be the first time since 07 that I will actually play the game after six seasons to do this ritual. Looks like this year I will be taking over New Mexico... that's going to be a long rebuild.... in four and a half seasons they have won only THREE games (3-51).

Rudy
08-21-2010, 06:23 AM
I think changing playbooks is the easiest and simplest way to keep things fresh.

Later today I'm going to delete the patch and see how I like the game without any patches or tuning updates. AA is broken to me post patch and while Heisman can be fun, the super amount of cpu blitzing, especially on 3rd down where they leave slot WRs open all day is annoying. So is the complete suckiness of zone defenses. At this point I'm calling nothing but man coverages with a few blitzes mixed in on Heisman and that's boring. I like to mix things up but there is zero incentive to do that on Heisman right now. If I like the pre-patch gameplay I will only download the patches/tuning files for offseason work.

Rudy
08-21-2010, 07:14 AM
I deleted the patch and tuning set and I only got 10 minutes in before I had to turn the PS3 over to the kids since I promised to let them play Toy Story 3. The run block sliders certainly do work better but if I'm perfectly honest, those sliders weren't sensitive enough in the first place. The run blocking and human rush defense sliders were weak to begin with. And then the patch came along and it may have made them weaker or not. I do think they are weaker but the biggest problem is that the cpu run game got hurt bad. It may be due to increased human pursuit or an increased ability for DL to simply break blocks but the cpu run game took a big hit. Combine that with super weak or broken sliders and you can't get the cpu running game going again if you are good at stopping the run (I don't even use run commit). Post patch the slider system and cpu run game resemble NCAA 09 which is not good. I really hope they fix those sliders to make them more responsive. Hopefully I'll be able to get some more time in this morning and experiment on AA and Heisman to see the real differences.

JeffHCross
08-29-2010, 02:06 AM
No idea if this is new, legacy, or what-have-you.

I have a CB that came in with 63 CAR, 70 CTH, 54 RTE and 49 SPC. Considering making him into a 2-way player for his FR year and moving him to WR for next year.

When I go to sub him into WR on the depth chart, though, he's really low OVR. In fact, all the CBs are. I scroll over, and their CTH ratings have dropped like a rock. Guys who were 73 CTH are now 48, and my FR is a 46. CAR, RTE and SPC do not seem to be affected.

So not only does he drop to 28 AWR, but his CTH itself goes down.

Note this is on the depth chart. Haven't tried Formation Subs, or Offseason Position Changes, to see if that makes a difference. Seems to be limited to WR though. If I sub him in at HB or QB, CTH (at least, didn't check any others) doesn't change.

Interesting. I could see where this would have been put in as an exploit fix but ... interesting.

EDIT: Oh hell. Stay away from the HB at WR packagaes. QBs and TEs do not appear to be affected ... but HBs and FBs are as well. My HB's 69 CTH drops to 46.

It's a straight 1/3 reduction. I even have a HB that drops from 49 to 32.

EDIT 2: This "bug"/"issue" is not reflected on the Formation Subs screen. A player's "real" values are shown in Formation Subs.

Rudy
08-29-2010, 05:20 AM
I'd love it if they could patch in a separate coverage slider for zone coverage. It needs to be broken apart from man coverage because zone coverage against the cpu on Heisman is just bad. Unless you blitz and get pressure you get eaten alive. I know patching in new sliders is hard to impossible but I'd be willing to swap out the nearly useless punt accuracy slider in favour of a zone coverage slider.

JeffHCross
08-29-2010, 10:28 AM
Zone Coverage on every difficulty is "just bad".

Rudy
09-06-2010, 03:33 PM
Well I should say that I've actually had a lot of fun on Heisman once I settled on some slider changes. I've made one change in over two weeks since I settled on it and have had some good games. I'm 5-1 in my third game and Bama, LSU and Wisconsin all had RBs go over 100 yards against me. I will be a bit sad when the new patch hits tomorrow and I'll be back to playing some Play Now games to see what has changed. I've probably played about 25 Play Now games and over 30 dynasty games so far. But let's hope things get a little better and no problems come up tomorrow. I may go back to AA but Heisman has been fun. It forces you to be on your game all the time.

I freaking missed an XP in my last game against Wisconsin and just about lost because of it. They missed a 48 yarder as time expired for me to hold on to a 26-24 win. I would have been pissed at myself. I already had missed a FG earlier and barely made a 42 yarder with a minute left to take the lead.