Penn State Football

[psusnoop]

Read a rumor on the boards that Matt McGloin will be named the starter later this week :fp:

I'll be honest, I'm not a fan.

Thoughts?

[psusnoop]

I just don't like what McGloin offers compared to Bolden. The problem with McGloin is he is just to cocky to know better. Watching the end of the O$U game and the Bowl game was just painful and hard to watch. If McGloin does get the nod, he better produce this year!

As an little note, my contact says BS on rumor and stated he still felt that Bolden would be named the starter. This doesn't however mean they both won't see action early.

We just need a QB to not lose the game for us, someone to take care of the ball and be smart.

[steelerfan]

I agree that PSU needs someone to take care of the ball. The ground game and defense should be better this year, but if they get lots of turnovers from the passing game it won't make any difference.

[ram29jackson]

well, if NCAA 12 is any indication, Penn State should be better this year..considering last year, they were a B team and this year rated an A team ..theyve never really gotten a stand out QB..Blackledge was the best they ever got

[steelerfan]

well, if NCAA 12 is any indication, Penn State should be better this year..considering last year, they were a B team and this year rated an A team ..theyve never really gotten a stand out QB..Blackledge was the best they ever got

Um, Kerry Collins was pretty damn good too.

[ram29jackson]

Um, Kerry Collins was pretty damn good too.

true..I was just going as far back as I could to find one..but they need that kind of QB when the whole team is good or its just top 25 and nothing more.

[psusnoop]

true..I was just going as far back as I could to find one..but they need that kind of QB when the whole team is good or its just top 25 and nothing more.


This team isn't anything more then a Top 25 team to be honest. I don't see them competeting for a Top 10 this year, but anything less then 9-3 I'm going to be upset. 8-4 is probably where most feel this team falls but I'm a little bit more optomistic and think 9-3, with a HUGE outside chance of 10-2 but that is more of a pipe dream then anything else.

Hey also don't forget about Matt Senecca :nod: :fp: :sick:

[ram29jackson]

Um, Kerry Collins was pretty damn good too.

I rooted for the Giants in that SB too, damnit

[steelerfan]

I'm less optimistic than you, snoop.

[psusnoop]

I'm less optimistic than you, snoop.

8-4 with Bolden, 7-5 with McGloin

Upside with Bolden if he learned anything 10-2, to 9-3 possibly. Bolden worst case is 8-4 imo.

McGloin can only get to 8-4 at most and 6-6 at worst.

[ram29jackson]

youre saying you think McGloin would do a worse job ? he will either be the full starter or they will do it by committee and put Bolden in for speed and options. theres no way bolden is starting..unless his learning curve got real big the last 6 months..but he wanted to go bye bye and transfer didnt he ? I have a tad more faith..until the first qtr of the first game.. in McGloin at this point..he can make reads and stay calm

[jaymo76]

Thw whole divisions in the BIG 10 changes everything now. Once you introduce divisions and a championship game, everything is thrown out the window. I think OSU and MSU will be the most interesting stories to watch this year.

[psusnoop]

youre saying you think McGloin would do a worse job ? he will either be the full starter or they will do it by committee and put Bolden in for speed and options. theres no way bolden is starting..unless his learning curve got real big the last 6 months..but he wanted to go bye bye and transfer didnt he ? I have a tad more faith..until the first qtr of the first game.. in McGloin at this point..he can make reads and stay calm

There is no way you can say McGloin can make better reads then Bolden. The only thing McGloin reads better is when to throw to the opposing team.

Bolden dis say he didn't like how he wasn't given a shot once McGloin threw so many picks and felt slighted which was understandable. I'd be pissed too.

I do think Bolden will be named later this but we shall see soon enough.

[cjg225]

Hey also don't forget about Matt Senecca :nod: :fp: :sick:
Put in Senneca! lol

Whenever our QB in the last several years (whoever it has been) makes a mistake, that is my automatically-yelled command. ;)

To the point, McGloin was a good (sort of) stop-gap while Bolden matured. Should McGloin have started last year? Maybe, maybe not (I wouldn't have started him). He did get us some victories, but they were against teams with absolutely ATROCIOUS defenses. It was very clear, even against those teams with bad defenses, that McGloin was a very limited QB. His greatest strength is probably his confidence. His greatest weakness is probably his confidence. He felt he could do no wrong, it seemed. And that *almost* got him into trouble against really, really bad defenses like Michigan's defense and Northwestern's defense. But against good defenses, he was shown to be really bad.

Hopefully McGloin has improved on his own, because maybe Bolden still isn't ready. I doubt Jay Paterno has been able to improve either QB via coaching (lol... Jay coaching...).

I am a Bolden guy. I say give him the reins and let him learn under fire. His best game of last year was the one in which he got injured. I can only hope that when he is clearly healthy that he really is as good as he seemed in the first half of that Minny game.

[ram29jackson]

in the name of God, please find a kicker

[psusnoop]

Yea, let's hope Fera's suspension isn't long and he can come in and make an impact.

[psusnoop]

A matchup against #2 Bama at 3:30pm is going to be fun.

psuexv and I drank way to much Indiana State :nod:

It was inspiring to see that Bama QB's combined to throw 4 picks. With the experienced secondary PSU has this could be an area of strength for the Lions.

[ram29jackson]

There is no way you can say McGloin can make better reads then Bolden. The only thing McGloin reads better is when to throw to the opposing team.

Bolden dis say he didn't like how he wasn't given a shot once McGloin threw so many picks and felt slighted which was understandable. I'd be pissed too.

I do think Bolden will be named later this but we shall see soon enough.

well, its obvious that was a year ago and you expect them to grow, especially the 3rd and fourth year guys. They were too conservative in this game and should have aired it out more to give QBs confidence...but it looks like platooning the QBs could be what they will do....at least thats the impression I got

[ram29jackson]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=igZzg58CEo0&feature=feedu

[ram29jackson]

LOL, Penn State has a defense...but every other game of other teams I watch QBs look, make progressions and reads find a guy and fire it in there...Penn State's got 2 guys who look like they are throwing a cantaloupe in the general direction of something that looks blue to them LOL and thats only when Penn State decides to finally throw because they run too often LOL

[psusnoop]

It hurts it really hurts

[steelerfan]

It hurts it really hurts

:sf:

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[ram29jackson]

we shall see. At least they arent Notre dame LOL

[ram29jackson]

we shall see. At least they arent Notre dame LOL

Haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

haaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa a

what a joke....on a 3rd down, you dont leave the fullback in and pass to him...let alone all the other bad execution by 2 QBs ....how are they rated an A in NCAA 12 this year ? LOL

this is disgusting

[ram29jackson]

some boys from south Philly almost had a dream come true on Saturday..

[steelerfan]

Did Temple blowing the fuck out of Maryland change your mind about how bad PSU is, ram?

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[ram29jackson]

Did Temple blowing the fuck out of Maryland change your mind about how bad PSU is, ram?

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sure, it made Penn State look a little better ...but so what? The Big 10 is still a stronger conference with better players by and large. As good as Temple did, its still Temple and/but they exposed that Penn St has QBs that dont know how to lead...and..granted, the way Penn State chooses to coach during games may be hurting them...the Defense does their job but the offense has no clue and guys who came in as wide receivers wonder if they made a huge mistake. Penn State has shown no true fire power against weaker teams and dont have the power an Alabama has to just run a ground attack offense...this could very well be a .500 season

[psuexv]

sure, it made Penn State look a little better ...but so what? The Big 10 is still a stronger conference with better players by and large. As good as Temple did, its still Temple and/but they exposed that we have QBs that dont know how to lead...and..granted, the way Penn State chooses to coach during games may be hurting them...the Defense does their job but the offense has no clue and guys who came in as wide receivers wonder if they made a huge mistake. Penn State has shown no true fire power against weaker teams and dont have the power an Alabama has to just run a ground attack offense...this could very well be a .500 season

Well if they would have caught the ball the 1st 3 games the offense would have been quite a bit more successful. I've seen numerous drops this year on easy open catches. So many people complain that our QBs aren't up to snuff or the coaches call bad plays, but when a WR is open and the QB puts it on him that is neither QB play or coaching. The other thing that drops do is take the life completely out of an offense. Say what you want about other negative plays but drops IMO completely deflate an offense.

[ram29jackson]

Well if they would have caught the ball the 1st 3 games the offense would have been quite a bit more successful. I've seen numerous drops this year on easy open catches. So many people complain that our QBs aren't up to snuff or the coaches call bad plays, but when a WR is open and the QB puts it on him that is neither QB play or coaching. The other thing that drops do is take the life completely out of an offense. Say what you want about other negative plays but drops IMO completely deflate an offense.


LOL the whole offense sucks - period

but LIke I said a couple weeks ago..every other team I watch the QBs are making good throws no matter what level of team or baller they are and when I watch a Penn St QB , I see a weak armed guy trying to fling a ball sort of some where LOL , quite frankly, the QBs play scared on pass plays and are more to blame than the WRs...they all need to step up, but can they at all?

[ram29jackson]

hey, at least they won this weekend, they are still in the positive !

[steelerfan]

Honestly, if you told me before the season that McGloin would be splitting time and, through 5 games, he'd have 0 INTs - I'd say, "bullshit". I fear the day when that comes crashing down.

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[psusnoop]

Honestly, if you told me before the season that McGloin would be splitting time and, through 5 games, he'd have 0 INTs - I'd say, "bullshit". I fear the day when that comes crashing down.

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Honestly it's not because McGloin isn't trying to throw INT's. He has been oh so close to atleast 6 or 7 so far.

Really though, this freaking offense HAS to get better. It has to stop being so predictable. We have two QB's and neither one can complete a screen pass. If I'm remembering it correctly through these last three games PSU is 1-8 on screen passes. The one completion was for negative yards. We pass first down, run Iso on second and then our WR's run a 4yd pattern on a 3rd and 6 :fp:

I know that if they start catching the ball things would be better, but so would using some common sense. How about instead of throwing a slant pattern to Devon Smith at 5'6" 160lbs who will never be able to shed defenders away from the ball with that size, we throw to one of our bigger WR's. I can think of Brown, Kersey, Moye for those kind of routes.

Then on a freaking 3rd down (passing down forget the distance) PSU brings out Day at RB. This is our 5th string HB heading into preseason ball and still 4th string after the Green suspension. I'm sure he'll do a great job pass protecting :fp: why isn't if Redd is winded and if Dukes is winded, let Shuey or Zordich in there to protect or run the flare routes. Those are PROVEN to be better choices then a 4th string HB that has a total of about 5 carries ever for PSU.

For me it is the simplest of things that are really bothering the piss out of me. Just like our Coach saying we don't need a special teams coach. Well dammit then whoever the fuck is taking that responsibility needs their head examined. We constantly year in and year out suck in return yards. We always have atleast 1 if not multiple blocked kicks against us. I mean just how freaking bad does it have to get before someone changes their thought process.

Rant over, carry on. Eric I know your going to snap when you read this but I'm tired of this shit period.

[psuexv]

How about instead of throwing a slant pattern to Devon Smith at 5'6" 160lbs who will never be able to shed defenders away from the ball with that size, we throw to one of our bigger WR's. I can think of Brown, Kersey, Moye for those kind of routes.



Yeah the Patriots never throw slant patterns to Wes Welker successfully so it must be a bad idea.

[psusnoop]

Yeah the Patriots never throw slant patterns to Wes Welker successfully so it must be a bad idea.

Wes has proven he can make the tough catches time and time again. Haven't quite seen Devon make a catch in traffic that would lead me to believe he can do it now.

Trust me, I love his speed and I really like him on crossing patterns but slants I just don't see him coming away with the ball.

[ram29jackson]

at least they beat Iowa in a Mexican stand off til the end LOL

[bdoughty]

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7192563/penn-state-nittany-lions-athletic-director-tim-curley-charged-perjury-sex-case

The shit has hit the fan.

[JBHuskers]

I cannot make this up....but Sandusky wrote a book a few years back :fp: :D

http://24.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lu9oy7HdA21qcbx7lo1_400.png

[psusnoop]

Yea I'm pretty disgusted right now.

If anyone wants to read the 23 page Grand Jury report here is the link.

http://media.scout.com/media/doc/99/997328.pdf

[steelerfan]

Read that yesterday, snoop. Pretty fucked up stuff. However, I'm slow to pass judgement (joking is one thing, passing judgement is another).

A lot has to be brought out into the light before I decide what to think about this, outside of Sandusky.

Obviously, assuming Sandusky is guilty, there is no defense for him and he deserves much worse than whatever he gets.

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[JBHuskers]

Read that yesterday, snoop. Pretty fucked up stuff. However, I'm slow to pass judgement (joking is one thing, passing judgement is another).

A lot has to be brought out into the light before I decide what to think about this, outside of Sandusky.

Obviously, assuming Sandusky is guilty, there is no defense for him and he deserves much worse than whatever he gets.

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Yeah, remember the Duke lacrosse team....

[JBHuskers]

Did you see when the reporter came to his home either last night or the other night? He stayed outside, told the reporter he couldn't say anything, didn't try to hide.

[steelerfan]

I'm assuming Sandusky is guilty, though I will allow for due process.

When I say I'm not passing judgement, I specifically mean the public witch hunt that is going on about who knew what, and what their responsibility was to report it (and to whom).

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[JBHuskers]

I'm assuming Sandusky is guilty, though I will allow for due process.

When I say I'm not passing judgement, I specifically mean the public witch hunt that is going on about who knew what, and what their responsibility was to report it (and to whom).

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You know me...I'm going to make jokes :nod:

Media is going to hammer this into the ground, if they haven't done so already.

[psuexv]

I'm assuming Sandusky is guilty, though I will allow for due process.

When I say I'm not passing judgement, I specifically mean the public witch hunt that is going on about who knew what, and what their responsibility was to report it (and to whom).

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Agreed. I do think Sandusky is guilty of some of what he is accused of. Prime example of a witch hunter is Cory Giger from the ESPN affiliate here in town. He's trying to make a name for himself and he did it. Got on Mike and Mike this morning. The Patriot News is also going all out.

[JBHuskers]

Agreed. I do think Sandusky is guilty of some of what he is accused of. Prime example of a witch hunter is Cory Giger from the ESPN affiliate here in town. He's trying to make a name for himself and he did it. Got on Mike and Mike this morning. The Patriot News is also going all out.

Is that the guy that came to his house?

[psuexv]

Is that the guy that came to his house?

Not sure but I wouldn't put it past him

[JBHuskers]

I found the video....

http://abcnews.go.com/US/penn-state-coach-jerry-sandusky-declines-questions-child/story?id=14892666#.TrchdrKVroo

About :35 in.

[psusnoop]

I'll withhold judgement a little bit but if what McQueary reported to the grand jury is truthful how in the world does he not report that to the police. Or Joe once he knows? That is my biggest beef right now and I'm having a hard time wrapping my head around it.

We may never know all of those details to a degree but we surely won't know any of them for a while till this thing goes to trial.

[psusnoop]

Agreed. I do think Sandusky is guilty of some of what he is accused of. Prime example of a witch hunter is Cory Giger from the ESPN affiliate here in town. He's trying to make a name for himself and he did it. Got on Mike and Mike this morning. The Patriot News is also going all out.


Giger is an A-hole.

[Kwizzy]

I will preface this by saying that I have not read this thread & have no idea where everyone stands on this whole deal but...

Bottom line to me in this whole deal is summed up by what the mother of Victim 6 said "McQueary is a grown man, saw another grown man raping a 10 year old boy in the shower & his reaction was to run away & call his daddy!?"

That right there is enough to make me wanna puke. Then they report it & whatnot & the guy is still around all the time & bringing other little boys to practice & they never even follow up with what happened. That is inexcusable, and if it were me who saw something like that, or was the parent of one of those kids this would've never even made it to trial. That sick fuck would've been dead in that shower.

Joe Pa needs to step down. Also, the difference between this and the Duke lacrosse story is that the Duke story wasn't broken by an official grand jury report. Everything about this investigation screams that they we're crossing their i's & dotting their t's to make sure this all sticks in court.

[JBHuskers]

Yeah that's true Kwizzy, these aren't strippers making the accusations.

[psusnoop]

I will preface this by saying that I have not read this thread & have no idea where everyone stands on this whole deal but...

Bottom line to me in this whole deal is summed up by what the mother of Victim 6 said "McQueary is a grown man, saw another grown man raping a 10 year old boy in the shower & his reaction was to run away & call his daddy!?"

That right there is enough to make me wanna puke. Then they report it & whatnot & the guy is still around all the time & bringing other little boys to practice & they never even follow up with what happened. That is inexcusable, and if it were me who saw something like that, or was the parent of one of those kids this would've never even made it to trial. That sick fuck would've been dead in that shower.

Joe Pa needs to step down. Also, the difference between this and the Duke lacrosse story is that the Duke story wasn't broken by an official grand jury report. Everything about this investigation screams that they we're crossing their i's & dotting their t's to make sure this all sticks in court.

Well said and I share the same thoughts right now Kwizzy. I just don't understand how this wasn't reported at all. Disgusting to say the least. :smh:

[JBHuskers]

Paterno press conference cancelled, a lot of the term "cowards" is being tossed about my a lot of sports media on Twitter right now.

[JBHuskers]

@darrenrovell Another PR botch by Penn State. Cancelling presser 40 minutes before shows they're still scrambling.

[psuexv]

I will preface this by saying that I have not read this thread & have no idea where everyone stands on this whole deal but...

Bottom line to me in this whole deal is summed up by what the mother of Victim 6 said "McQueary is a grown man, saw another grown man raping a 10 year old boy in the shower & his reaction was to run away & call his daddy!?"

That right there is enough to make me wanna puke. Then they report it & whatnot & the guy is still around all the time & bringing other little boys to practice & they never even follow up with what happened. That is inexcusable, and if it were me who saw something like that, or was the parent of one of those kids this would've never even made it to trial. That sick fuck would've been dead in that shower.

Joe Pa needs to step down. Also, the difference between this and the Duke lacrosse story is that the Duke story wasn't broken by an official grand jury report. Everything about this investigation screams that they we're crossing their i's & dotting their t's to make sure this all sticks in court.

Personally I'm not sure what to think. I'll wait until the trial and what comes out of it. If I feel they get off on a technicality then I will be disappointed. If they truly are guilty then they should serve their time.

As for the whole McQueary thing, I don't pass any judgement on him. If I were in his situation it is honestly hard to say what I would have done. We can all sit here and say we'd kick the shit out of the dude doing it and all but I personally doubt that we would. Picture yourself walking into the bathroom where you work and your boss is doing something to a boy. Would you really walk up to him and knock the snot out of him. You would probably go to HR and report it. McQueary was 22 years old, he saw something that disturbed him with a very prominent figure and asked his dad what to do. Then went to Paterno and ended up reporting it to the AD. I'm not trying to start a fight, but I don't see many of us acting any differently.

[psuexv]

@darrenrovell Another PR botch by Penn State. Cancelling presser 40 minutes before shows they're still scrambling.

However this was a press conference about this weeks game, which is still going on and there are a lot of other people's interest in it, namely the players. This wasn't a press conference about the so called scandal.

[gschwendt]

However this was a press conference about this weeks game, which is still going on and there are a lot of other people's interest in it, namely the players. This wasn't a press conference about the so called scandal.Regardless, the game isn't until Saturday. This story is going on today. They shouldn't have canceled it at the last minute... that's what makes it look cowardly.

[JBHuskers]

AP: Scott Paterno says father disappointed & prepped to take ?s about scandal & NU gm

...so why did they cancel it if JoePa was prepped to take those questions?

[psuexv]

Regardless, the game isn't until Saturday. This story is going on today. They shouldn't have canceled it at the last minute... that's what makes it look cowardly.

What they should have done was scheduled a separate press conference.

[Kwizzy]

Personally I'm not sure what to think. I'll wait until the trial and what comes out of it. If I feel they get off on a technicality then I will be disappointed. If they truly are guilty then they should serve their time.

As for the whole McQueary thing, I don't pass any judgement on him. If I were in his situation it is honestly hard to say what I would have done. We can all sit here and say we'd kick the shit out of the dude doing it and all but I personally doubt that we would. Picture yourself walking into the bathroom where you work and your boss is doing something to a boy. Would you really walk up to him and knock the snot out of him. You would probably go to HR and report it. McQueary was 22 years old, he saw something that disturbed him with a very prominent figure and asked his dad what to do. Then went to Paterno and ended up reporting it to the AD. I'm not trying to start a fight, but I don't see many of us acting any differently.

I respect that POV, honestly I do. Obviously I have never been in that situation before but I can say that as a grown man, and human being, you have a moral obligation to help those who cannot defend themselves which is largely what everyone involved has failed to do throughout this whole ordeal. If I saw my boss or anyone else doing something like this, it would not even cross my mind to walk away.

[psuexv]

AP: Scott Paterno says father disappointed & prepped to take ?s about scandal & NU gm

...so why did they cancel it if JoePa was prepped to take those questions?

Word is President Spanier cancelled it without even telling Joe first.

[JBHuskers]

Penn State said to be planning football coach Joe Paterno's departure, sources say - @NYTimes http://nyti.ms/sa6FTP

[psuexv]

I respect that POV, honestly I do. Obviously I have never been in that situation before but I can say that as a grown man, and human being, you have a moral obligation to help those who cannot defend themselves which is largely what everyone involved has failed to do throughout this whole ordeal. If I saw my boss or anyone else doing something like this, it would not even cross my mind to walk away.

I completely agree with the moral obligation. However I would feel my moral obligation would be to report it and let the authorities work it out. It is hard to say, as you stated we have never been in that situation, of what we would do. I may say, hey what is going on? and try and get the kid out of there.

[Kwizzy]

I completely agree with the moral obligation. However I would feel my moral obligation would be to report it and let the authorities work it out. It is hard to say, as you stated we have never been in that situation, of what we would do. I may say, hey what is going on? and try and get the kid out of there.

I guess that's my point, forget what I think I would do. How do you walk away and let that man keep doing that to a helpless child in the hopes that someone could do something about it? You were in the room, you could have put a stop to it right then and there! How the hell do you walk away?! Then you see him with another little boy years after the fact & say and do NOTHING! It's a joke.

[JBHuskers]

I guess this has been an ongoing investigation for three years....and Penn State kept sweeping it under the rug thinking this would never see the light of day? And I guess Sandusky was at the facilities as early as last week working out.

[psusnoop]

I guess that's my point, forget what I think I would do. How do you walk away and let that man keep doing that to a helpless child in the hopes that someone could do something about it? You were in the room, you could have put a stop to it right then and there! How the hell do you walk away?! Then you see him with another little boy years after the fact & say and do NOTHING! It's a joke.


That is also where I stand, sure we can all talk tough but bottom line surely it should have been reported to authorities. That is where it all ends for me and makes me even more disappointed in the whole thing. In 2002 this could have stopped and instead was left to go on and to harm other young boys. Not to mention the 1998 thing which could have ended it all then as well, but to stick to McQueary just not sure how this isn't reported to the police first and foremost.

I walk in and see someone fondling a boy/girl naked and stay and call the police immediately. Afterwards I will discuss with my boss and their bosses.

[psusnoop]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d823e9199/article/report-penn-state-planning-coach-paternos-exit?module=HP11_breaking_news

[psusnoop]

They should have cancelled this PC yesterday mid morning at the latest. Doing it 40 minutes before is retarded and completely dropping the ball.

[JBHuskers]

Penn State said to be planning football coach Joe Paterno's departure, sources say - @NYTimes http://nyti.ms/sa6FTP


http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d823e9199/article/report-penn-state-planning-coach-paternos-exit?module=HP11_breaking_news

And people give me shit for posting duplicate things :smh: :P

[psusnoop]

And people give me shit for posting duplicate things :smh: :P

LOL you deserve it though :D:D

http://nbcsports.msnbc.com/id/45186257/ns/sports-college_football/

Another victim comes forward as well.

[Deuce]

A lot of crazy shit. All I'll say is if they're guilty burn'em!!

As far as JoePa...I'm assuming he is at no fault until I hear everything. I just can't believe all the good he's done over the last 40-50 yrs means nothing. There's more to this. There is no telling what JoePa was told by any of these people. It'll break my heart if he took part in sweeping this under the rug.


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[psusnoop]

A lot of crazy shit. All I'll say is if they're guilty burn'em!!

As far as JoePa...I'm assuming he is at no fault until I hear everything. I just can't believe all the good he's done over the last 40-50 yrs means nothing. There's more to this. There is no telling what JoePa was told by any of these people. It'll break my heart if he took part in sweeping this under the rug.


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:+1:

[JBHuskers]

This is getting worse as the day goes on.

[psusnoop]

This is getting worse as the day goes on.

Trying to find it online, had a friend call me and say on Sportscenter they said that Joe will step down at 6pm tonight.

I find this a little hard to believe but the person wouldn't lie to me either :dunno: But not being able to see anything online makes me this it is BS.

[Kwizzy]

Trying to find it online, had a friend call me and say on Sportscenter they said that Joe will step down at 6pm tonight.

I find this a little hard to believe but the person wouldn't lie to me either :dunno: But not being able to see anything online makes me this it is BS.

I wouldn't put it past ESPN to just throw that out there either just so they can say they were the first to say it. Even if it's complete BS.

[psusnoop]

Well that is certainly true Kwizzy, we all know how ESPN works. :smh:

[JBHuskers]

Scott Paterno just said that no one has asked Joe to step down. If this is just spin, I dunno.

[JBHuskers]

Soooooo....we gonna keep the name of that Big Ten Championship Trophy?

[bdoughty]

Paterno press conference cancelled, a lot of the term "cowards" is being tossed about my a lot of sports media on Twitter right now.

Paterno needs to step down. Anyone with integrity would call the police the second they found out about this.

[bdoughty]

A lot of crazy shit. All I'll say is if they're guilty burn'em!!

As far as JoePa...I'm assuming he is at no fault until I hear everything. I just can't believe all the good he's done over the last 40-50 yrs means nothing. There's more to this. There is no telling what JoePa was told by any of these people. It'll break my heart if he took part in sweeping this under the rug.


Did you read the Grand Jury transcripts? Joe Pa knew and went on record saying he knew. The Student athlete and his father told him directly. All Honest Joe did was tell his superiors. This was a ten or so year old kid being raped in the shower and they all just let it continue. Not only was it a ten year old, Sansusky was intentionally preying on kids from poor or bad family backgrounds that were in a group trying to get help.


If you have not read the transcripts, do so. See if you can muster through the whole thing without getting a little sick.

[steelerfan]

Did you read the Grand Jury transcripts? Joe Pa knew and went on record saying he knew. The Student athlete and his father told him directly. All Honest Joe did was tell his superiors. This was a ten or so year old kid being raped in the shower and they all just let it continue. Not only was it a ten year old, Sansusky was intentionally preying on kids from poor or bad family backgrounds that were in a group trying to get help.


If you have not read the transcripts, do so. See if you can muster through the whole thing without getting a little sick.

At this stage, this is still premature. It is the court of public opinion. You don't know what, specifically, he was told (the documents don't state exactly what he was told).

The way it is outlined in the documents, it is conceivable that he was told it was possibly some sort of molestation. He then reported it to his superiors. His superiors, to his knowledge, investigated and came back to him and told him it was "horse play" and nothing to worry about.

I know that scenario is tough to believe, but that is what is in the documents. And, yes, I read all 23 pages.

For me, until someone (credible) says there is no doubt he knew exactly what transpired, and he conspired to cover it, I will give him the benefit of due process. Afterall, this is America.

I'm withholding judgement until everything comes out. Being that I'm not irrational/emotional (not a woman), I am capable of doing so.

I don't believe in hanging someone until there are no questions left unanswered.

If Joe Paterno is guilty of covering this up, he deserves to lose his job. But a knee jerk death sentence is quite hasty. Let the judicial events unfold before casting stones.

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[bdoughty]

It is your school that is on the chopping block, so it is more likely that you would reserve judgement as long as humanly possible. That is the nature of such things. Still really really shocked that your local Pedophile/Sexual Predator Sandusky was on campus last week using the weight room. Are you guys vying to become the NAMBLA headquarters?


That said you kinda lost me on the whole "woman" issue and how men are not emotional. Or maybe you just meant you, the manliest of men?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tCtYxiiqGaE

[Deuce]

The documents have nothing to do with what Paterno knew. If it comes out that he knew and covered it up then fuck him but I wanna wait until I hear something concrete.

He may have been told about something happening in the shower but we don't know what he was told after that. These are people he loved and trusted. If someone I knew was accused of this and then I was told by another friend that it wasn't true and it was all ok I'd probably believe them...but who knows? I sure as hell don't want to find out!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[psusnoop]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4O0EeTDWVPc&sns=em

[psusnoop]

I think Joe wanting to talk today about all this and Spanier canceling on him speaks of something. Joe wants to talk about what transpired and to me this may be telling as to what he knew and how.

Also I'm hearing the BOT is meeting either later tonight or tomorrow afternoon to discuss the resignation of Spanier. *this hasn't been confirmed yet just something I heard.

[gigemaggs99]

"He then heard rythmic, slapping sounds"....

That right there is giving me nightmares.....FUCKING SICKO! :sick:

[jaymo76]

In my line of work I deal with kids everyday. If I was "told" something like this I would legally have to go directly to the authorities. If Paterno was in fact told about this, simply going to the AD isn't enough. When it comes to the protection of children, you go above basic expectations.

[bdoughty]

borrowing this from Neogaf, a breakdown of the Grand Jury testimony and how Paterno failed to act.


Paterno must have known that Sandusky was a pedophile

There was a 1998 investigation into Sandusky for similar charges that Paterno was almost certainly aware of. Sandusky is pushed out of the football program the next year.
Paterno receives an eyewitness account of Sandusky raping a child by a member of his staff.
In case there is any doubt over whether Paterno thinks the witness might be lying/not credible, he goes on to be promote him to WR coach within 2 years of the incident.
Nowhere in the grand jury report or in Paterno's statement is there any indication that Paterno confronted Sandusky about these serious allegations to get his side of the story, despite having known the man for over 30 years.


Paterno had every reason to believe Sandusky was continuing to molest children

Had there been an investigation or charges filed after the 2002 incident, Paterno would have known about it. He observes that nothing has come of the rape incident.
Sandusky continues to bring young boys to Penn State events that Paterno is present at years later, including at least one closed practice. It is reasonable to believe that Paterno observed Sandusky in the company of these boys.


Paterno may have helped to protect Sandusky

When Paterno went to his superiors about the shower incident, one claims that Paterno told them it was harmless horsing around and the other claims that it was vaguely reported as something "inappropriate".
Paterno's public statement says that the graduate student told him that there was inappropriate behavior but it wasn't clear that it was serious.
The graduate assistant's testimony states that he clearly observed rape.
We don't know whether the graduate assistant reported rape to Paterno and Paterno downplayed it or if the graduate student chose not to give Paterno the true story for some reason, but there is room for doubt.



Oh and this might just be the beginning.

"@dan_bernstein FYI: names are being x-checked w/Sandusky's Second Mile, and there are other older adult men with "curious" relationships. Only the start."


he also touched on the pro-Paterno protesting going on

"@dan_bernstein Seeing the latest pro-JoePa student "protests," I demand napalming of Happy Valley. Burn them all."

[steelerfan]

There are alot of "probably, maybe, possibly, conceivably" type statements in your posts, bro. Again, when it all comes out, I'll decide what I think.

And, lmao, who the hell cares what some shock jock says on twitter? What if someone said that those kids sure didn't mind the butt-rape when they were getting free swag and tickets? Should I believe that, or just write it off as someone trying to get their dumbass opinions re-tweeted to get there name out there?

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[JBHuskers]

https://p.twimg.com/Ad0bEUoCMAAVxJz.jpg

Paterno pulled in at home this morning, and then pulled back out.

[psuexv]

He announced to the team yesterday that he is retiring at the end of the season.


STATE COLLEGE, Pa., Nov. 9, 2011 /PRNewswire/ -- I am absolutely devastated by the developments in this case. I grieve for the children and their families, and I pray for their comfort and relief.

I have come to work every day for the last 61 years with one clear goal in mind: To serve the best interests of this university and the young men who have been entrusted to my care. I have the same goal today.

That's why I have decided to announce my retirement effective at the end of this season. At this moment the Board of Trustees should not spend a single minute discussing my status. They have far more important matters to address. I want to make this as easy for them as I possibly can.

This is a tragedy. It is one of the great sorrows of my life. With the benefit of hindsight, I wish I had done more.

My goals now are to keep my commitments to my players and staff and finish the season with dignity and determination. And then I will spend the rest of my life doing everything I can to help this University.

SOURCE Penn State

[JBHuskers]

Twitter found out before his team about the retirement apparantly...

[psusnoop]

What an emotional day.

I remember crying when I was a little at the fear that Joe won't always be the coach at PSU. I was very young maybe 8 or so at the time. I have like Eric been going to PSU games since birth basically. This is all very hard to take in right now and so sad and frustrating.

[JBHuskers]

It's sad to see such a long and storied era end like this.

[psusnoop]

It's sad to see such a long and storied era end like this.

:+1:

[DariusLock]

This just sucks for all involved especially the kids, Sandusky need to be tarred and feathered.

[jaymo76]

This just sucks for all involved especially the kids, Sandusky need to be tarred and feathered.

EVERYONE who knew and didn't go to the authorities too!!!!!!!!!!!

[steelerfan]

After roughly 30 years of rooting for Penn State, I think I am through.

This is a disgusting witch hunt that was driven by the media and the court of public opinion.

To watch this press conference and see this board of trustees avoid answering multiple questions, including why Coach Paterno was fired is unbelievable.

I don't care what anyone else's opinion is, the board said he was fired without any more information than the public has. To me, that is the definition of a witch hunt.

Fuck PSU.

Go Irish! :dunno:

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[HWill]

The Penn State rivals site is pure comedy right now.

[psuexv]

After roughly 30 years of rooting for Penn State, I think I am through.

This is a disgusting witch hunt that was driven by the media and the court of public opinion.

To watch this press conference and see this board of trustees avoid answering multiple questions, including why Coach Paterno was fired is unbelievable.

I don't care what anyone else's opinion is, the board said he was fired without any more information than the public has. To me, that is the definition of a witch hunt.

Fuck PSU.

Go Irish! :dunno:

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But they continue to pay for lawyer fees for the 2 people that it is known did know something and lied about it, but crucify 2 people who they admit they don't know what they knew :smh:

[baseballplyrmvp]

Go Irish! :smh::down:

[steelerfan]

But they continue to pay for lawyer fees for the 2 people that it is known did know something and lied about it, but crucify 2 people who they admit they don't know what they knew :smh:

And they fired a 61-year employee over the goddamned telephone.

I could have lived with them suspending him until they knew more than they do. That, to me, would have been justified.

And Mike McQueary, the man who was most "morally responsible" as he claims to have witnessed the assault, has had "no change" in his status with the program is even more insane.

Obviously, the university is only concerned with "protecting their brand". Well, if this Gestapo technique of dealing punishments without all of the facts or without due process is how this school wants to handle itself, I'm not interested in their motherfucking brand.

Fuck them all.

And, let me be clear, if Paterno is later found to have had full knowledge of what was accused, and he willfully participated in a coverup, I well agree that the firing was (eventually) justified. However, the BOT has stated that they don't particularly know anymore than we do. In my opinion, that is grounds for a suspension (at most) until more details come out.

I'm not going to pretend Coach Paterno is completely, and undeniably, innocent. I don't know. However, at this point, it can't be said that he isn't. That is where my problem is. Firing him without "all the facts" is unacceptable.

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[bdoughty]

Go Irish! :dunno:




Someone please help steelerfan back away from the ledge.

[bdoughty]

http://sports.yahoo.com/top/news?slug=ycn-10404639

An article asking just that, why does Mike McQueary have a job.

I agree with you in regards to Mike McQueary, you fire Paterno, you fire McQueary. He was a big boy when this happened, although that can be questioned as he had to go to daddy to find out what to do. Worried about his job more than the child he witnessed being (insert whatever you want here.)

Had he done what I consider most people in the same situation would have done, call the police, then we would not...

A) been having this issue today
B) a good chance a bunch of young males would not have had to deal with sexual advances from Sandusky

That said this has been a really strange case and years before this could have all been avoided (http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/i-team/penn-da-passed-initial-sex-abuse-charges-penn-state-coach-jerry-sandusky-disappeared-05-article-1.974806). This is some Dateline stuff with the DA who refused to charge Sandusky going missing, presumed dead but still no body.

Unfortunately there were plenty of balls dropped and I really can't call this a witch hunt. People in a position of power refused to accept it, just because is the old ball coach does not recuse him from any responsibility. I think Mike will end up leaving Penn State because the fans will never let him live this down.

[bdoughty]

Now to throw the topic back to Sandusky, as mentioned yesterday, things are only going to get worse in regards to what he did and how second mile is involved.

Mike Madden actually wrote a piece on Sandusky back in April in regards to everything coming out right now. (http://www.timesonline.com/columnists/sports/mark_madden/madden-sandusky-a-state-secret/article_863d3c82-5e6f-11e0-9ae5-001a4bcf6878.html)

He comments today: Don’t believe this can get worse? Give it 72 hrs. People really digging into Second Mile. Even more shocking revelation is ahead.

[gigemaggs99]

I too find it strange that they fired Joe, and their explanation is "they don't know more than we do". I'm wondering if that is some cover-up and they legally can't say more. I'm thinking they would have to have more facts to be able to come to a unanimous verdict. It sounds like they meet at 10pm and with-in a few mins had a 100% verdict. This usually wouldn't happen if they didn't have more information to base their decision.

I also find it strange that they make a big deal out of Coach Paterno yet the guy that could have "really" done something at that time still has a job. Coach reportedly didn't know about the event until the next day. The problem had already occurred.

As far as all the people/fans inside of Penn St wanting Joe back, I can understand their point of view but I think it's lost b/c the crimes reportedly committed are MUCH greater than football.

I attended and graduated Texas A&M University. When I was a Jr., Aggie Bonfire collapsed killing 12 students. When it happened there were students outraged that we weren't going to have Bonfire. They could not wrap their head around the REAL problem that 12 people had been killed. I will admit I was one of them. I thought we should have still had it. The University thought of the bigger picture, which now 13 years removed I can 100% agree with. Bonfire is cool and all but not if it means people get hurt OR die.

Joe Paterno will always be mentioned in terms of a great coach that coached for a LONG time but that isn't the big picture here. The university is trying to get this scandal cleaned up and move on. The stuff that is being reported to happen to these KIDS is SICK. If Joe Paterno could have done something to help prevent them from continuing to happen HE SHOULD HAVE. From the sounds of it he was above the law, like a super icon, therefore he should have done more than the lowly grad student. He should have cared, he should have reported it to authorities, so should have the other people involved.

I have kids, I can't imagine what I would want to do to someone if they did or attempted that stuff to one of my kids. I would be outraged if someone like Joe didn't step in to help it from happening again. Then to hear people are upset b/c he can't coach a game? Think about how it has and will affect these kids for the rest of their life? Joe Paterno's Coaching legacy will not be hindered once the storm blows over.

[psusnoop]

http://www.pennlive.com/midstate/index.ssf/2011/11/penn_state_board_of_trustees_g.html?utm_source=dlv r.it&utm_medium=twitter


"thanks Eric for link"

[Oneback]

There is a ton of circumstantial evidence that hints that this runs way deeper than anyone wants to even think about - that this was known, tolerated, and even abetted for over a decade. Reports that Sandusky admitted his act to a victims' mother but still got off once before; the fact that the witness/potential whistleblower shut up and then got promoted; the fact that Sandusky retired out of the blue despite media belief that he was JoePa's heir apparent at the time; that he had to agree not to bring kids around campus, but was allowed to anyway; the fact that the DA investigating the case disappeared under mysterious circumstances. The longer light is shed on this issue, the more it looks like there is a lot more waiting to come out.

Joe Paterno ran that town. Even last night he had so much support that there were riots in Happy Valley. I truly hope that Occam's razor doesn't apply here and this is just an unfortunate set of coincidences. But it seems like this pedophile's sick practice was known and covered up for a sickeningly long time because JoePa/Penn State thought it could.

[ram29jackson]

its all bull, Admins always take the easy way out and just fire people.

[psuexv]

You guys can stop the whole Penn State got rid of the DA thing. He went missing in 2005, 7 years after he dropped the charges on Sandusky. I know Penn State football is big around here but he did prosecute a lot of other big time criminals including a number of large drug busts and dealers. And yes I've lived in this town long enough to follow his case and my cousin was his long time girlfriend.

[psuexv]

This is a pretty good article. Kind of contradicts a little bit of what everyone is praising Herbsteit for saying last night. He stated that this isn't about Football and isn't the time to celebrate Joe's career. But who made it about football, the media. All stories are about Joe, the media is lined up at his house. Why aren't they camping out at Sandusky's house since he's the one that actually committed the crime.


Quick. Don't think. Who is prime suspect number one in the scandal involving Penn State right now? If you were to read 95% of the stories put out by the national media since Sunday or gone on Twitter or (from stories I've heard) spoken with any of the national talking heads trudging through State College right now, they would tell you that the villain in this horrible, horrible incident is Joe Paterno.


Tell me, when was the last time you heard Jerry Sandusky's name? When was the last time you heard about the charges brought against athletic director Tim Curley and former VP of Business and Finance Gary Schultz? I'm fairly certain that these three men have been the ones charged with crimes in this on-going investigation.


Some of you may know me as the former sports editor at Onward State. I started writing my junior year and became fascinated with journalism. I found it exciting to go fact-finding. To be able to relate a story to the masses was an exhilarating feeling. But over the past five days, my love for the craft has dwindled. I realized a whole lot about the business of journalism after reading the stories of the New York Times, Washington Post and some of the most respected news blogs in the nation. And yes, I said BUSINESS of journalism. Because journalism has now gone past its roots. It is no longer about telling a story. It is making up the story that will sell the most papers, get the most pageviews, accrue the most Twitter followers and make the most money in the end. What will sell a story? Will a story about a no-name like Gary Schultz sell papers? Will a story about Tim Curley get an author noticed? Even a story on Graham Spanier, who has a bit more national prominence, won't bring in readership. Like I said, when was the last big story on the perpetrator, Jerry Sandusky, written?
You know what will sell, though? The downfall of an American icon. A man who has spent 60 years building the reputation of a football program, a university, a whole town doing the "legal minimum" but not his "moral duty" being pummeled both in writing and by cameras and microphones everywhere he goes. I can guarantee you, if Penn State was coached by some no-name, the stories churned out would be about the victims and the men who perpetrated these crimes.


I'm not here to defend what Joe Paterno did or did not do. That has been talked about in many other posts and in many other comment boards. But I hope to convey some of the things the media has lost sight of over the past week by dissecting different allegations they have brought up. Please follow along below.

1. "JOE PATERNO NEVER FOLLOWED UP ON THESE CHARGES" or "JOE PATERNO SENT THIS UP THE CHAIN OF COMMAND AND WASHED HIS HANDS OF THE SITUATION"
This was the first of many "facts" that was made up by the national media. If you've read the Grand Jury testimony, I commend you. Now go read it again. Pick out the part where it says Joe never went back to Tim Curley or Gary Schultz to see what was happening in the process. It never says he did, but it sure as hell doesn't say he didn't either.
2. "JOE PATERNO KNEW ABOUT (OR HAD TO HAVE KNOWN ABOUT) THE '98 ALLEGATIONS AND STILL LET A CHILD RAPIST AROUND HIS TEAM"
Once again, go back to the testimony. Nowhere does it say that Joe knew about any allegations before 2002. In fact, one person I know sat in a class on Tuesday and listened to Patriot-News reporter Sara Garim, who has been the point person for all of the investigative stories dealing with this case, say that Joe testified he did not know about the 1998 allegations, going as far to say: "I think it's fair to say, as far as you could possibly say, that Joe Paterno didn't know about [the 1998 investigation]." If some real investigating had been done by the national media, they'd probably know that too.
3. "JOE PATERNO ENABLED A CHILD RAPIST"
Use your words better. I understand your need for emphasis to sell, but using the word enable makes it seem like Joe hand-picked the boys for Sandusky.
4. "JOE PATERNO IS TIM CURLEY'S/GRAHAM SPANIER'S BOSS" or "JOE PATERNO RUNS PENN STATE UNIVERSITY"
Many columnists have brought this point up in regards to Joe pushing Mike McQueary's information up the chain of command. Since Joe runs everything there, he is to blame. He is the head honcho. Find other columns these men and women have written. Look at their Twitter feeds over the past year. Look at them from the past week! They'll tell you that he doesn't even run his own football team anymore and hasn't for 15 years. For an 84-year old man to not be able to look over 85 players and a coaching staff, but yet control 44,000 students on the University Park campus, plus the administrators, plus the faculty, plus the staff and handle day-to-day operations of a university seems unimaginable to me. But you know, whatever argument works at the time, guys.
When Joe Paterno released his retirement statement Wednesday morning, he said that he would finish out the year coaching. A large majority of the people I follow on Twitter and TV commentators said it wasn't enough and were adamant about it. He needed to resign now or be fired by the Board of Trustees. A huge, HUGE backlash for a man who just wants to coach four or five more football games. Later on in the afternoon, Ben Jones of Black Shoes Diaries and StateCollege.com tweeted that he was told Jerry Sandusky was spotted working out in a gym with his wife this morning. The reaction? "Wow." "Geez." "Welp."
This story has become so twisted that negative emotion about a man coaching a football game exceeds that of an accused chlid molester walking the streets of the town where he committed his crimes by what it seems to be millions of percent. By focusing on the tear-down of the most notable figure involved in the case, people have become numb to the man who did the most damage and those who have been accused to covering up that damage.


Sensationalizing a story led to Joe Paterno being the first man to lose his job in this fiasco. And while I have no qualms about saying Joe had to step down after this mess blew up, when looking back at the facts, is he really the first man who should have gotten the axe?
Now, since the media has completed Objective One: Bring Down JoePa, I hope they do what I always believed journalists did: find the facts, dig through the sources and tell the people the real stories happening in State College.

[JBHuskers]

Really? Rioting? Really?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oq-rSjNCFoo&feature=player_embedded

P.S. that dude that took the street sign really biffed it :D

[steelerfan]

Link, Eric?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk

[Oneback]

Really? Rioting? Really?

P.S. that dude that took the street sign really biffed it :D

Call it what you will, rioting may not be the right term, but the storm troopers were called out to regulate the scene.

[psuexv]

Link, Eric?

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/blackberry/p.html?id=1085201

[JBHuskers]

Call it what you will, rioting may not be the right term, but the storm troopers were called out to regulate the scene.

Shit was set on fire, vehicles were tipped over...that's pretty much rioting.

[steelerfan]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/blackberry/p.html?id=1085201

Thanks.

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[steelerfan]

Really? Rioting? Really?

I'm all for it. Burn the campus. Starting with the administration building.

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[gigemaggs99]

its all bull, Admins always take the easy way out and just fire people.

I'm confused. Maybe we all see things differently.

Children were molested. A 10 year old boy was raped.

All under Joe's watch. All he did was report it to his boss.

How are the admin's taking the easy way out?

I'm watching the news and people are comparing this to a lot of different things (Catholic church, boy scout leaders, etc...) ....my wife is a teacher here in Bryan with the public schools. Bryans ISD. IF she sees what she even remotely thinks could be abuse she is to contact her boss AND CPS, which also involves the police.

IF she fails to do this and then later is fired, how would the admins being taking the easy way out?

Maybe it's a mistake for engaging you in conversation, but I just fail to see your point of view.

If you think they did the easy thing? What sir would be the better course of action?

[Oneback]

This is a pretty good article. Kind of contradicts a little bit of what everyone is praising Herbsteit for saying last night. He stated that this isn't about Football and isn't the time to celebrate Joe's career. But who made it about football, the media. All stories are about Joe, the media is lined up at his house. Why aren't they camping out at Sandusky's house since he's the one that actually committed the crime.

The problem here is that just like with all the NCAA violations, the coach always knows or at the very least heard something. I'm a just a middle manager in my company and word gets back to me when one of my employees takes a piss on another company's floor. This issue is a little larger in scale and I refuse to believe Joe Pa had zero knowledge of any incidents involving one of his trusted coaches. I imagine being pretty deeply ingrained in the culture of Penn State and the face of the program results in everyone going to him when there are any issues. I highly doubt the story waited four years to get to Joe Pa when there was an ongoing investigation in the late 90's. I assure you the first person any investigator went to was Joe Pa, or at the very least school officials which undoubtedly that news would filter to Joe Pa.

I'm not accusing Joe Pa of anything other than having some sort of knowledge after the fact once the incident was brought to the schools attention and being that this incident looks to be the leading cause of Sandusky's "retirement" in 1999 I imagine the school/Joe Pa knew before 2002.

As to why the media is at Joe Pa's doorstep and not Sandusky's, the Jerry Sandusky story has already been written there's not much more to say there, the larger story now is the fact that Penn State covered it up for so long. As they say the consequences of a failed cover-up are always greater than the consequences of the original crime.

[steelerfan]

Read the article psuexv just posted, Gus.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk

[psusnoop]

You guys can stop the whole Penn State got rid of the DA thing. He went missing in 2005, 7 years after he dropped the charges on Sandusky. I know Penn State football is big around here but he did prosecute a lot of other big time criminals including a number of large drug busts and dealers. And yes I've lived in this town long enough to follow his case and my cousin was his long time girlfriend.

Well said psuexv, I have been trying to avoid saying a whole lot as I'm really emotionally tied to this stuff and can sometimes let my feelings overcome my fingers and mind while typing.

Gricar at the time he went missing was investigating a bigger story if I recall correctly. Plus just because he dropped the charges or didn't pursue them against Sandusky doesn't mean one is tied into the other. If people start those rumors they could do that to every single university out there. Let's allow the facts to come out.

[psuexv]

I'm confused. Maybe we all see things differently.

Children were molested. A 10 year old boy was raped.

All under Joe's watch. All he did was report it to his boss.

How are the admin's taking the easy way out?

I'm watching the news and people are comparing this to a lot of different things (Catholic church, boy scout leaders, etc...) ....my wife is a teacher here in Bryan with the public schools. Bryans ISD. IF she sees what she even remotely thinks could be abuse she is to contact her boss AND CPS, which also involves the police.

IF she fails to do this and then later is fired, how would the admins being taking the easy way out?

Maybe it's a mistake for engaging you in conversation, but I just fail to see your point of view.

If you think they did the easy thing? What sir would be the better course of action?

That statement is the issue. From what is stated in the grand jury statement, this was not under Joe's watch. As OB stated, we don't know all of the facts, maybe something happened before 98 maybe something didn't.... We don't know. Most of the reports are after he retired from the university and all of the involvements were with boys from his charity, nothing to do with the Penn State FOOTBALL program. A number of the incidents even allegedly happened in his own house or at high schools that he was involved in. Did some of the events happen on PSU campus in football buildings, yes. But this would be more of a university issue. His access to the football buildings were part of his compensation package, he had no official interaction with the football team and Joe had no control over him from an "employer" relationship.

I don't want to sound like I'm defending what happened or defending these people for doing nothing if in fact they knew what happened. It's the attitude that it was under Joe's "watch"..... yep Jerry would bring kids in and line them up and Joe would pick which one.

[psusnoop]

Still just assumption given the storied career of Joe Paterno that he had any knowledge of the 1998 incident. It has been reported that he didn't know anything, and hasn't come out officially that he has either. Yet everyone is "assuming" based off his name that he did. Lets allow things to come out (if they do) before we bury someone that maybe just maybe isn't the bad guy in all of this.

The Sandusky part of this story certainly hasn't run it's course either. As soon as this broke, every new media jumped in and on Joe and hasn't let up. While I can't understand why more wasn't done I also don't have certain facts about the information either. Until we know for sure what Joe reported to Curley and Shultz and what Mike McQueary reported to Joe I'll wait to pass my judgement on a man that has shown to be of good sound character.

I mean Mike McQueary reproted this immediately to his father John McQueary Chief Operating Officer/Administrative Director Centre Medical and Surgical Associates, P.C. certainly held the same moral obligations as others but I have YET to read one report or anything regarding his job or questioning his morals in this whole story.

[psuexv]

The problem here is that just like with all the NCAA violations, the coach always knows or at the very least heard something. I'm a just a middle manager in my company and word gets back to me when one of my employees takes a piss on another company's floor. This issue is a little larger in scale and I refuse to believe Joe Pa had zero knowledge of any incidents involving one of his trusted coaches. I imagine being pretty deeply ingrained in the culture of Penn State and the face of the program results in everyone going to him when there are any issues. I highly doubt the story waited four years to get to Joe Pa when there was an ongoing investigation in the late 90's. I assure you the first person any investigator went to was Joe Pa, or at the very least school officials which undoubtedly that news would filter to Joe Pa.

All I know from the '98 investigating was that Joe stated to the Grand Jury that he didn't know about it. Did he lie, I have no idea. All I can go by is the facts that are presented to me. The rest is speculation.

[psusnoop]

That statement is the issue. From what is stated in the grand jury statement, this was not under Joe's watch. As OB stated, we don't know all of the facts, maybe something happened before 98 maybe something didn't.... We don't know. Most of the reports are after he retired from the university and all of the involvements were with boys from his charity, nothing to do with the Penn State FOOTBALL program. A number of the incidents even allegedly happened in his own house or at high schools that he was involved in. Did some of the events happen on PSU campus in football buildings, yes. But this would be more of a university issue. His access to the football buildings were part of his compensation package, he had no official interaction with the football team and Joe had no control over him from an "employer" relationship.

I don't want to sound like I'm defending what happened or defending these people for doing nothing if in fact they knew what happened. It's the attitude that it was under Joe's "watch"..... yep Jerry would bring kids in and line them up and Joe would pick which one.

That is what has been so hard about all of this. As we talk about it people quickly assume we are justifying the actions of some when in fact we are most certainly not just the way things are being portrayed or "reported" or decided upon.

[psuexv]

Gricar at the time he went missing was investigating a bigger story if I recall correctly.

He busted that huge drug dealer like 2 years before and word was he wanted revenge. My money is that he's in witness protection.

[steelerfan]

Well said, snoop.

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[psusnoop]

As for the riots, ah so they flipped one vehicle. I don't think it was nearly as bad as I feared last night and I'm glad.

[psusnoop]

He busted that huge drug dealer like 2 years before and word was he wanted revenge. My money is that he's in witness protection.

Could be, I've flipped flopped a little on this and now leaning towards he is dead. If witness protection why the computer in the river? Maybe that is a cover for the witness protection maybe not. Just a thought on that.

But yes that is what I remember about that time frame and certainly fits the mold much better the tied into this horrific acts at PSU.

[psusnoop]

OK now see this is why I have tried to stay clear of this and stayed up shooting people in Battlefield 3. I get so emotional and have just had a pounding headache for days about all of this stuff.

Sure I know many have their favorite teams but I know for a fact that Eric and having grown up here and been so close to this program this hits so close to home it is unreal. We live here, we have only known Joe Paterno as the head coach. We have only known PSU to be held at such a high standard that all of this is mind numbing and hard to take in. It is hard to stay to the facts, the media certainly hasn't. I could give you quote after quote of people "misremembering" what they read in the grand jury report yet they quickly hop on the radio, phone, or TV to chime in on this.

Also to go further on this, I was talking to Matt last night and you said something that struck me. The story of the lady at the bar saying how she couldn't believe that Joe molested all those children. :fp: That is how much Joe's name has been the lead story of this over the true predator and sick fuck that should be all over the news.

[JBHuskers]

Okay so, Ashton Kutcher tweeted in outrage that Joe Pa was fired.

He didn't even know the story of what was going on :fp: :D

[Oneback]

All I know from the '98 investigating was that Joe stated to the Grand Jury that he didn't know about it. Did he lie, I have no idea. All I can go by is the facts that are presented to me. The rest is speculation.

From the alleged facts I have heard/read, there were incidents where Sandusky showered with young boys to which one of the boys told his parents and the mother contacted campus security in 1998. There was an investigation by campus security to which Sandusky admitted to showering with the boy (under what pretense I don't know) and that he wouldn't do it again. Later that following year Joe Pa informed Sandusky that he would no longer be in line to take over as Head Coach, Sandusky then "retired" in 1999 and as part of his retirement he retained the right to utilize the Penn State athletic facilities. Then in 2000 a janitor witnessed Sandusky performing sexual acts on a minor and then later in the year another janitor witnessed Sandusky leaving a shower holding a minors hand. There are reports of other incidents up to 2009 as well.

Now, I fully admit these are alleged facts and that it is pure speculation to say Joe Pa knew of these incidents, however there are red flags all over the place and rational thought tells you these incidents were known by Joe Pa and were probably the leading cause in informing Sandusky he would not be taking over as Head Coach.

What bothers me the most having grown up in a coaching family and having a family member as a big time college coach, is that the men involved in this case preach accountability and moral values on a daily basis but when it came time to practice what you preach they looked the other way. Is this a case where something looked odd and there were thoughts that there may be smoke but no fire and they tried to deal with it by sweeping it under the rug, maybe. However, if the alleged facts turn out to be true, where they thought there was only smoke there was a burning inferno to which the people entrusted with leading young men turned a blind eye and that is why the media is on Joe Pa's doorstep.


That is what has been so hard about all of this. As we talk about it people quickly assume we are justifying the actions of some when in fact we are most certainly not just the way things are being portrayed or "reported" or decided upon.

Having feeling like I know most the guys in this thread either through interacting via this forum or whatnot, I don't think anyone believes you guys are trying to justify anything, but that's just me.

[steelerfan]

"Alleged facts"? :fp:

Just to clarify, the janitor "incidents" are all one incident. The hand-holding followed the shower setting all in the same night.

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[psusnoop]

I know you all know where we stand OB it is hard and a fine line on this subject though. So many victims and such a horrendous act makes this so hard to even think about.

I have had a pounding headache and can't sleep good since this all broke.

OB I can see where everyone is tying this all together as in how didn't he know, but until we see factual information and reports of such I don't think it is fair to assume as much either. (for those just reading that sentence please read everything posted by me and others and don't assume my stance on this matter) OB knows where I'm going with this.

I just have a hard time believing that Joe knew Jerry was raping or raped a young boy and choose to not address the situation. Yes we can go the grand jury report but we don't know all the fine details within it. There are gaps and questions that need addressed to clear up any doubt. Maybe only a few have doubts but I'm not one to judge people without knowing it all.

[gigemaggs99]

I can appreciate the Joe Paterno is an awesome coach, with regards to football. I think the problem is, ya'll are in the bubble. It's totally awesome you are tried and true Penn St fans. You should continue to support the program. You shouldn't say things like fuck penn state, go Irish. Maybe that's just emotions and jokes, but that is NOT what this story is about. Penn St's football program is not going to get the death penalty and from the sounds of no NCAA action will be done, NOR should it be. This has nothing to do with the football program.

It DOES have everything to do with Joe Paterno. Perhaps ya'll are blinded by it since you live in the bubble. Joe Pa wasn't just some football coach that should have told his boss. He is one of the BIGGEST guys in colllege football, he's not just a random coach. He's like Bear Bryant, or Vin Lombardi. I'd say he's even bigger than Bobby Bowden.

From an outsider's perspective, who else in your lifetime has been able to tell their boss NO I don't want to step down from my job? Joe did, he told them to get out of his house. He was in charge.

Who in their right mind has never heard gossip at work? Who has ever worked somewhere for 47 years? They have to talk! To make it sound like Joe didn't know anything about this is just plain SILLY!

Who in the their right mind would approach something like: So you go to the mall, there is old mall employee that has been rumored to have molested kids. You tell someone maybe a store manager and assume they will take it farther up the chain. Then you just IGNORE IT...then a few years pass and you see the SAME guy with kids...yet you don't stop to wonder...HEY what ever happened? Maybe I should follow up? What if years later it was YOUR kid walking with that same freakshow? Would you not ask? Would you not wonder? Would you just sleep sound at night with the "well I know he may have maybe done something sicko with kids 3-4 years ago, but he's a good guy and besides, I told that one guy at the, the store manager....and he would NEVER do something with other kids including MINE."

YEAH RIGHT!

Seriously? Joe Paterano should have done more.

Years after Joe is no longer his "boss" this Freakshow is invited on Penn St bowl games and just happens to have a child as his "guest" who also happens to stay with him in his hotel room? I guess Joe didn't see that either. For real? Joe couldn't have done more?

Do you see, outside of how he's a great football coach how this is morally wrong? Can you seperate the football GAME part of it with REAL LIFE? Why in the world did Joe say, I wish I would have done more? Who says that after the fact?

The dude goes on to molest and hurt kids long after the fact and all you can say is I wish I did more?....MY BAD, so can I coach this weekend? Seriously?

It just keeps soundling like this, to an outsider like me from those of ya'll in the bubble...."so yeah it sucks and all that kids were raped and molested.....can Joe coach more, what about football, football, football?" Seriously? That's the focus?

Personally I find it VERY strange, I'm not a coach, but I figure those guys basically live together. They are with their team and fellow coaches MUCH more than they are with their own families. Are we to believe NONE of them knew about this, none of them talked about it? Nothing was every said? They have all been together MUCH longer than, many years together, bus trips, recruiting trips, all the time spent together and they NEVER talked about it and never thought it was strange that the Dude was still working around/with and inviting kids to sleep over at his house?

...."oh gee that sure does sound strange to me bob...well onto bigger and more important things in life, like what kinda coverage scheme we're going to run this weekend."

I think Penn State is awesome. When I was a kid my Dad earned his Ph.D in Petroleum Eng from Rolla, MO. He interviewed at 2 places, Texas Tech University and Penn State. He chose Texas Tech. I was only in the 9th grade when this happened but I wanted Penn State. I watched football, I thought and STILL think they were awesome. My Dad brought back Penn St sweatshirts for me and my brother. Same from Tech, but I always wore the Penn State one. I'm not saying the football team still isn't bad-ass, I'm just saying that there are more important things in life, protecting children from predators should be job #1.

What if one of these kids dreamed of someday becomming the head coach at Penn St, then this happens to them...their life would be turned upside down. The kids are the important thing here, not that an 84 year old man lost his job. He's lived a very full life, these kids that are mentally dealing with this have a long time before they reach 84.

I'm sure ya'll will continue to tell me to look at stories about how Joe is getting the raw deal here...really? What about those kids? What do they get?

[psusnoop]

I'll say this first as I'm losing my spots here Gus, first off I haven't mentioned or seen anyone post they wanted Joe to keep coaching. Steelerfan mentioned Suspending him till all the facts of the case comes out.

Assuming that the rest of the staff knew about this is absurd and having someone (my neighbor) on the staff I find this statement to be absurd and way off base.

I'll have to read your post again to comment more but these two things jumped out first and I wanted to get it out there.

[gigemaggs99]

I'll say this first as I'm losing my spots here Gus, first off I haven't mentioned or seen anyone post they wanted Joe to keep coaching. Steelerfan mentioned Suspending him till all the facts of the case comes out.

Assuming that the rest of the staff knew about this is absurd and having someone (my neighbor) on the staff I find this statement to be absurd and way off base.

I'll have to read your post again to comment more but these two things jumped out first and I wanted to get it out there.


I think they want them (coaching staff) to stay quiet for legal reasons. This just came, people are going to sue.

When Bonfire fell, NO ONE was going to sue, they all stood behind A&M. Then over time, every single family that lost a child put it to A&M.

Penn St is telling everyone to stay quiet for legal reasons.

The reports asked the interm coach today in his press conference a "sticky" question. It seems obivous but I think lawyers were probably squirming in the background. Someone asked him the obivious, if someone sees something this being done to a student, or hears about it or knows about it, shouldn't they take it to the authorties?

His answer after a few seconds was, yes, without a doubt....

Ok we'll he's been there a for a long time too, last night or a few days ago was the 1st time he's EVER heard of this?

FOR REAL?!


EDIT: Time will tell how "absurd" this is. I'll be amazed if more doesn't come out of the woodworks. I HOPE PRAY more doesn't but it just doesn't seem like the University would jump to such a big idea as firing the President and head football coach on a whim. If they did, then the univeristy has those issues to deal with too.

I would agree, it seems like there is a "little" thing called due process or law...but for that many regents and trustess to get together and decided 100% it seems like they aren't telling us all the facts due to pending lawsuits. They are covering their butts.

[steelerfan]

Gus, you have so many facts mixed up, I don't even care to address it all right now.

And, for clarity's sake, I don't "live in the bubble". I live in Northwest Houston. I've never lived in PA and I didn't go to school at PSU. I've just been a fan for about 30 years. I'm the one who said what you quoted, not the guys who live there.

My problem is that he was fired when he should have (at most) been suspended. If he participated in a coverup, fine. But we don't know that, and the BOT says they don't know that either.

What we know is that McQueary told him that he may have witnessed some sort of molestation. Paterno, in turn, turned out over to his bosses. One of his bosses (Schultz) had the campus police under his areas of responsibility. The other boss (Curly) later told Joe that it was looked into and found to be "horse play"and that they told Sandusky not to bring anymore kids to the campus. At this point, that is all that is known, and that is all that is in the Grand Jury Report.

Anything else is an ASSumption.

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[psusnoop]

From an outsider's perspective, who else in your lifetime has been able to tell their boss NO I don't want to step down from my job? Joe did, he told them to get out of his house. He was in charge.

This is rumor and nothing factual has ever come out. When asked last night the BOT denied it.


Do you see, outside of how he's a great football coach how this is morally wrong? Can you seperate the football GAME part of it with REAL LIFE? Why in the world did Joe say, I wish I would have done more? Who says that after the fact?

Well actually lots of people say that after the fact. I wish I wouldn't have tried driving 100+ down a curvy highway when I was younger and seriously injuring me and my friend.



It just keeps soundling like this, to an outsider like me from those of ya'll in the bubble...."so yeah it sucks and all that kids were raped and molested.....can Joe coach more, what about football, football, football?" Seriously? That's the focus?

Once again not once have I stated that Joe should be coaching Saturday or thereafter.


Personally I find it VERY strange, I'm not a coach, but I figure those guys basically live together. They are with their team and fellow coaches MUCH more than they are with their own families. Are we to believe NONE of them knew about this, none of them talked about it? Nothing was every said? They have all been together MUCH longer than, many years together, bus trips, recruiting trips, all the time spent together and they NEVER talked about it and never thought it was strange that the Dude was still working around/with and inviting kids to sleep over at his house?

...."oh gee that sure does sound strange to me bob...well onto bigger and more important things in life, like what kinda coverage scheme we're going to run this weekend."

This statement is silly Gus, like I said earlier knowing some of these coaches and throwing such a blanket over them all is not fair and something that many of them are having a tough time dealing with right now. This is not right, not fair and not something that I like from society when we think like this.



I'm sure ya'll will continue to tell me to look at stories about how Joe is getting the raw deal here...really? What about those kids? What do they get?

Anyone that thinks anyone is getting anything of a positive from this all is really sick and perverse. There are tons of people and victims that are dealing with things that many of us can only imagine. No one here is trying to do anything other then ask that justice be served and the facts come out.

Thoughts and prayers go out to the victims and many people that this has affected.

[gigemaggs99]

3. "JOE PATERNO ENABLED A CHILD RAPIST"

Use your words better. I understand your need for emphasis to sell, but using the word enable makes it seem like Joe hand-picked the boys for Sandusky.

This rationale is just not sound.

Let's say my wife is an alcoholic, WHICH SHE IS NOT. I know she drinks and then gets violent. I don't get her help and I don't keep her from buy more booze. I am ENABLING her behavior. Am I buying her the drinks NO, am I throwing the AA cards away? NO....I am STILL enabling, all it simply means he Joe allowed it to continue. It never says ANYTHING about Joe hand-picking kids. That simple statement makes this report sound like it's written by a child.

Who in the right mind would THINK Joe was picking kids out for this guy? REALLY?

[psusnoop]

I think they want them (coaching staff) to stay quiet for legal reasons. This just came, people are going to sue.


EDIT: Time will tell how "absurd" this is. I'll be amazed if more doesn't come out of the woodworks. I HOPE PRAY more doesn't but it just doesn't seem like the University would jump to such a big idea as firing the President and head football coach on a whim. If they did, then the univeristy has those issues to deal with too.

I would agree, it seems like there is a "little" thing called due process or law...but for that many regents and trustess to get together and decided 100% it seems like they aren't telling us all the facts due to pending lawsuits. They are covering their butts.

You said there is almost no way the staff as a whole couldn't have any idea of this happening. That comment right there is sickening to me and one that is without merit.

Sure there may be more to come out from this, I sure hope not but there may but to throw such a broad blanket over the whole staff without knowing any more factual information is "absurd" as I put it.

[steelerfan]

Also, I stick by what I said, I'm done with PSU.

Congratulations to the Worldwide Leader in Hype (ESPN). You got your way, your story, and your man. You have destroyed a man and his legacy by creating a stir of speculation, assumptions, and half-truths. Journalism at it's finest. And the bovine-human herd that is the American Public, has fallen for every bit of your bullshit.

It's so good to live in America where everyone is assumed guilty until proven innocent. And by time they ate proven innocent, the damage is done. Fucking bullshit.

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[gigemaggs99]

psusnoop, I have no clue what your real name is. Yes mine is Gus, just seems like you want to single me out. I'm not going to argue or pick things apart with you.

I understand 100% your mentality now. I felt the exact same way when I was "inside the A&M bubble" in 1998. In time, and unfortuneately these things never seem to get better as more information comes out, I think there will be more facts that come out and it will be shown why the university made the descions they made.

There are still "lost people" here that think Bonfire should return, they say things like, oh just have them sign a waiver...serioulsy? to have people/humans working on such a fragile stack of LUMBER is crazy! It's really amazing nothing like the '98 incident didn't happen soon and more frequently.

To have this ex-coach still be with kids, working with them, bringing them on campus, to his home, to bowl games that involved the university and to just turn a blind eye? That too is crazy!

Let's be honest, football is a BIG deal. Joe Paterno and his staff should have said something. They should have done more. Just like student atheletes they are a representative of the school. He was fired as was the president b/c by keeping them on the payroll would say, "we don't know all the facts but we'll just take the risk and let the cookie crumble as it will." That isn't taking a stand.

[psuexv]

Another decent read. Something I completely missed but is pointed out here. People saying Joe didn't go to the authorities, Shultz was the head of the Penn State Police department, which Joe knew to be involved in the interview with McQueary and handling the case.

Could he have followed up more, not sure I agree 100% with this lawyers reasoning why he shouldn't have but it's a point of view.

http://thatlawyerdude.blogspot.com/2011/11/strong-defense-of-joe-paterno-why.html



A Strong Defense of Joe Paterno: Why Paterno Was Morally & Ethically Right Not To Go Further in The Sandusky Sex Abuse Case

In the comments section of an article in an SI online blog post by Joe Posnanski, Columbia Univ. Adjunct Professor Scott Semer assails Joe Paterno for not taking greater actions in the Jerry Sandusky case (Link is to the actual Grand Jury Report. It is not for the squeamish.)

Semer rests his opinions as a lawyer and an Adjunct Professor of Transactional Law at Columbia Univ. in NYC. He takes what I believe is the majority opinion as to Coach Paterno's decisions which is that he did the least he could do to cover himself but owed a moral duty to do more.

I too am an attorney, a criminal defense lawyer, a former special prosecutor, and an adjunct professor of Trial Advocacy, and as to his judgment of Paterno I completely disagree with Professor Semer. I think Paterno did what was both morally and legally correct.

After contacting his chain of command superiors, he let them do their jobs. He knew there was a campus police force that investigates ( and prosecutes ) crimes on campus. He took whatever information he had to the head of his department. He took it to the person who is, for all intents and purposes, the police commissioner of a 256 person police force which according to the Campus website says: "(The University Police are) governed by a state statute that gives our officers the same authority as municipal police officers."

Paterno didn't just give his information to a superior, he turned it over to the highest ranking official in that police department. That man, PSU's VP of Business called in the ACTUAL WITNESS and spoke to him. In other words Paterno could see an investigation.

Suggesting Paterno should have then done more is both ridiculous and dangerous. Paterno should not have approached Sandusky,for fear he tip him off to the investigation; he should not have called University police after nothing happened because 1. A police department has a right to set its policing priorities. The Courts have consistently held that: it is a "fundamental principle of American law that a government and its agents are under no general duty to provide public services, such as police protection, to any individual citizen." Warren v. District of Columbia, 444 A.2d 1 (D.C. Ct. of Ap., 1981).
2. Once he reported the incident (and not having any information as to the progress of any investigation or the results thereof) Paterno had no other action he could reasonably take. If he pressed further or went public he risked opening himself and the University up to a law suit from Sandusky for libel , and that is assuming Paterno thought the grad assistant was both reliable and accurate. By that person's own admission he was distraught. He would be accused of trying to eliminate a potential competitor for his job. He would also call into question the safety of the campus and without any proof of his own on the allegations of another. Pattern is not a witness and arguably isn't even an "outcry witness." ( an outcry witness is one who verifies that another witness was so distraught that what they are saying must be true. To be an outcry witness the original witness must make his statement to you first and within a few minutes top hours after witnessing the incident. More than a couple of hours usually spoils the outcry's reliability. It gives the maker too much time to make up the testimony)
3. Assuming Paterno did go to the Chief of Police for the Penn State police department, the person under Gary Schultz, would that not be an act of insubordination? What if he were wrong? He would lose a long time friend and PSU family member. He would hurt alums, recruits and his teams. His fellow coaches could not trust him, all of this without being an actual witness to anything. Taking one man's word against anothers.

Noone wants to see kids hurt, and I believe Coach Paterno heads that list. People suggesting he needed to do more either don't understand the law of criminal investigation, or have a different ax to grind ( like the head of the PA State Police who is grand standing in saying people have a greater responsibility than to report crime to the local Authority. He would be the first guy to defend a civil rights suit against his agency, (brought by a crime victim claiming that the failure to arrest caused her injuries) by invoking the Warren case.)

Paterno handled this exactly as he should have and to suggest otherwise is to use 20/20 hindsight to judge what was a fluid real time situation. I guess the path is always clear for the Monday Morning Quarterback.

[psuexv]

Let's be honest, football is a BIG deal. Joe Paterno and his staff should have said something. They should have done more. Just like student atheletes they are a representative of the school. He was fired as was the president b/c by keeping them on the payroll would say, "we don't know all the facts but we'll just take the risk and let the cookie crumble as it will." That isn't taking a stand.

By potentially firing a man without knowing all the facts of his involvement, that's taking a stand. If they didn't know all of the facts they should have suspended him until they did know all of the facts or had a better handle on the facts.

[Oneback]

I will say that it's quite possible that most of the coaching staff knew nothing of the incidents, they may have heard something, but I can fully support the notion the didn't know. However, I cannot fathom Joe Pa not finding out via school authorities or law enforcement when the first investigations started.

Let's take a look at Texas' own closet and the case of Cleve Bryant, once the red flags were raised Mack Brown was alerted and within 6 months Cleve was fired and the person that raised the sexual harassment case was paid $400,000 by the University of Texas. It took 6 months in this case from start to finish once the allegations were raised.

In the case of Sandusky, there we're multiple documented incidents from 1998 (possibly earlier) until 2009 and to think Joe Pa knew nothing for 4 years after the first reported incident is absurd. I know news travels faster now, but let's not confuse communication in 1998 with Phillippides running from Marathon to Sparta to ask for help against the Persian Army.

PSU guys, I am pretty torn about this as well...I've learned a lot from Sandusky via video and books and have always held him in high regard as a great coach and this pretty much throws that thought out the window. As much as I hate to agree with an Aggie (:P), this isn't about football and while I can certainly understand how it feels all in the same to those that bleed PSU blue in the end it sounds like to this outsider that a group of men got together and decided to protect the brand more-so than to protect the individuals that have really been hurt by the indiscretions of a troubled person.

In all honesty, I know why they did it as there are examples of others doing the same in order to protect their brand/business. However, what really makes me sick is that those individuals unlike those in the business world don't stand up in front of 100 young men and preach about discipline, accountability and moral values and while it wouldn't make it any better I'm sure all of this would blow over a lot quicker if they just came out and said that they we're trying to protect the brand and thought they had handled the situation so that then the light can then shine directly in the face of Sandusky who in this case I would fully support the Islamic tradition of an eye for an eye.

[gigemaggs99]

I also find it strange that there was a local high school teacher here in Bryan a couple of years back that it was "suggested" that he had sex with a minor. He was hunted down and put behind bars. If he came up innocent oh well that's how it works.

How in the WORLD is this Sandusky guy able to walk around be at his house wearing PENN St clothing? Am I on drugs, maybe I am, but ESPN is saying he's still not in jail. How is that possible?

Please someone tell me he's behind bars.

By the way, the Bryan ISD teacher was found guilty and is in prison. He was a baseball coach.

[psuexv]

I agree OB. It isn't about football, but that is all anyone is talking about in the media and trickling down to the masses. Not just sports shows, all major outlets are keyed in on Paterno. The frenzy made it about football and the BOT was forced to act to "protect their image". They felt forced to act due to PR and show that they needed to make a stand. So they fired Joe Paterno since he is all anyone is talking about. Isn't this how this whole mess started, by protecting an image, aren't they making the safe mistakes. How about "We are truly sorry for these allegations and events that took place, some potentially on our campus. We are going to deploy all resources that are necessary to assist with the legal matters to bring light to these terrible allegations and that any responsible parties be held accountable. At this time we are suspending Joe Paterno, Mike McQuery, Tim Curley and Graham Spanier until further developments are brought to our attention. We have set up a hotline and are providing resources to any victims."

Where's the Second Mile in all of these reports and media stories? Yes some of it happened on campus at PSU, but these were kids that the Second Mile allowed him to be in contact with. And after, according to the Grand Jury they were alerted to the incident in 2002. You say you can't believe that Joe wasn't told in '98, yet I see nobody calling BS that the Second Mile wasn't alerted in '98 either.

I want everyone to burn that was involved, including Joe if it comes to that. But it is hard to sit back and see that SO many other people could have been involved and the focus is on Joe.

[psuexv]

I also find it strange that there was a local high school teacher here in Bryan a couple of years back that it was "suggested" that he had sex with a minor. He was hunted down and put behind bars. If he came up innocent oh well that's how it works.

How in the WORLD is this Sandusky guy able to walk around be at his house wearing PENN St clothing? Am I on drugs, maybe I am, but ESPN is saying he's still not in jail. How is that possible?

Please someone tell me he's behind bars.

By the way, the Bryan ISD teacher was found guilty and is in prison. He was a baseball coach.

Gig, this is what we are saying and frustrates us. Nobody seems to care about Sandusky and he is criminal number one. Everyone is focusing on Joe, even though he was removed from it so to speak and his only possible crime is he didn't follow up to see if anything was done.

[ram29jackson]

I'm confused. Maybe we all see things differently.

Children were molested. A 10 year old boy was raped.

All under Joe's watch. All he did was report it to his boss.

How are the admin's taking the easy way out?

I'm watching the news and people are comparing this to a lot of different things (Catholic church, boy scout leaders, etc...) ....my wife is a teacher here in Bryan with the public schools. Bryans ISD. IF she sees what she even remotely thinks could be abuse she is to contact her boss AND CPS, which also involves the police.

IF she fails to do this and then later is fired, how would the admins being taking the easy way out?

Maybe it's a mistake for engaging you in conversation, but I just fail to see your point of view.

If you think they did the easy thing? What sir would be the better course of action?


its all conjecture and hearsay as far as Paterno is concerned..the board said they knew nothing as far as facts and still had to look at it..yet still, they just wash their hands of it and fire Paterno with nothing trully pinpointing him in anything...people below and above Paterno may have orchestrated something,but axing Joe, proved and solved nothing

[steelerfan]

Gig, this is what we are saying and frustrates us. Nobody seems to care about Sandusky and he is criminal number one. Everyone is focusing on Joe, even though he was removed from it so to speak and his only possible crime is he didn't follow up to see if anything was done.

Yep. While the world is hunting/harrassing/ruining Coach Paterno, Sandusky may well be raping more boys. Yet, all we care about is the victims. :fp:

So who at ESPN gets fired if out comes out that Sandusky raped someone last night?

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[Oneback]

I agree OB. It isn't about football, but that is all anyone is talking about in the media and trickling down to the masses. Not just sports shows, all major outlets are keyed in on Paterno. The frenzy made it about football and the BOT was forced to act to "protect their image". They felt forced to act due to PR and show that they needed to make a stand. So they fired Joe Paterno since he is all anyone is talking about. Isn't this how this whole mess started, by protecting an image, aren't they making the safe mistakes. How about "We are truly sorry for these allegations and events that took place, some potentially on our campus. We are going to deploy all resources that are necessary to assist with the legal matters to bring light to these terrible allegations and that any responsible parties be held accountable. At this time we are suspending Joe Paterno, Mike McQuery, Tim Curley and Graham Spanier until further developments are brought to our attention. We have set up a hotline and are providing resources to any victims."

That's all well and good to smooth over what is happening in the here and now, which in reality is all they have control over, however the question would then be raised as to why these steps weren't taken back in 1998. Let's be honest, if they would have suspended Sandusky pending a further investigation back in 1998 all of this would be old news and probably wouldn't have been as big of a story as it is now. It's blown up to the proportions we see now because it's 13 years after-the-fact.


Where's the Second Mile in all of these reports and media stories? Yes some of it happened on campus at PSU, but these were kids that the Second Mile allowed him to be in contact with. And after, according to the Grand Jury they were alerted to the incident in 2002. You say you can't believe that Joe wasn't told in '98, yet I see nobody calling BS that the Second Mile wasn't alerted in '98 either.

I've heard allegations about Second Mile as well:


“I hear a rumor that there will be a shocking development from the Second Miles Foundation … That Jerry Sandusky and Second Mile were pimping out young boys to rich donors.” - Mark Madden

It's also been thrown out that Second Mile was a safe haven for Sandusky and other like minded individuals, while not everyone affiliated wih Second Mile is being thrown under the bus there are rumors it was a front for pedophiles.


I want everyone to burn that was involved, including Joe if it comes to that. But it is hard to sit back and see that SO many other people could have been involved and the focus is on Joe.

I agree, however the focus is on Joe because some of the incidents happened on campus and Joe is the face of Penn State to most outsiders and is being used as a stand-in for the University. It also doesn't help that he and Sandusky were close, not to implicate Joe in any wrong doing but the media/public latches on to that sort-of-thing.

[psusnoop]

Gus my name is Jeremy sorry thought u knew.

I'm singling out your comment that there was and is no way that the staff didnt know about these crimes via hear say simple because they worked together.

That is the comment that I'm talking about, and find crazy to make such an assumption.

[psusnoop]

Gig, this is what we are saying and frustrates us. Nobody seems to care about Sandusky and he is criminal number one. Everyone is focusing on Joe, even though he was removed from it so to speak and his only possible crime is he didn't follow up to see if anything was done.

God forbid they focus on Sandusky or both McQuearys but I guess those names don't drive ratings like a Paterno.

[ram29jackson]

if this puts penn State football in the dumper.. I'll be paying a little more attention to Michigan games next year LOL


alright, enough screwing around- its time to send a team of investigators to Duke and uncover the Real Mike Krzyzewski !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! after all, he was a friend of Bobby Knights..........and thats another thing, last night watching that stuff on the news, it was like a weird-er version of the whole Bobby Knight thing...and of course, Knight was an angry, abusive, control freak who needed to be axed IMO......but for the most part, college kids dont riot because they believe in anything..they just riot because " hey, we're in college, lets go riot !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[gigemaggs99]

The board said they knew nothing. I take that with a grain of salt. Pres Clinton said he didn't have sexual relations, people say shit all the time to the media. They all have lawyers that advise them what to and not to say.

I will say it's nice to hear the interm guy say, "I was advised NOT to comment on this." That doesn't mean he knows or doesn't know anything, it means legally they want him quiet.

Again Penn St is doing disaster recovery, if the interm goes on live t.v. the day after Joe PA is fired and outright says, "Hell yeah I knew" that would make this thing blow up like a nuclear bomb. Saying he has no comment just keeps everyone asking more, but also keeps some sort of "order."

If Joe was able to coach this weekend, there is NO WAY the questions would stop. What would they talk about after the Neb game, in the post game? The pass rush? HELL NO.

It's just hard to stomach, it's sucks! Joe Paterno seems like a good honest guy. It sucks that over a long time he's been built up as a "family guy" "Penn St-family guy", yet this can happen and it seems like on one hand you have this awesome stand out guy that only does the BEST in all aspects of life and then when something horrible happens and he learns about it, he does tell a superior/campus cop and then later says he wishes he would have done more.

This feels a lot like the Tiger Woods scandal.

I agree with a reporter that came on the Jim Rome radio show, if Tiger Woods would have come out and talked for hours in a press conference and said, "Ok look, I'm going to sit here ALL DAMN day and answer every question in the book, then when it's over IT'S OVER." But instead, he says things like this is a private matter, I'm working with my wife, please leave her out of it...blah blah blah....

Well Penn State could have done the same on Tuesday, but they cancelled the press conference. The problem in the comparision is, Joe Paterno isn't "PENN STATE" even though he's pretty damn close. There is an institution, not just a football coach. Tiger Woods did this with adults, the Penn State's issue it with minors.

I hear these people/protestors go on the t.v. and say, Joe Pa was randomly fired, look at all the money he gave to the university. I guess people are emotional and they are said their coach is gone, but giving 1 penny or 10 million for a library doesn't excuse the fact that a coach of 30+ plus years on his staff, and I would assume after that long would be considered a friend, did this and he just looks the otherway.

There has to be some sort of ramification for Joe. He picks his staff, they represent the university. The university went after Joe b/c he put those people in place to work with and represent the university. So did the President, he backed Joe. The trustess are saying, LOOK if ya'll back this, then you're fired. Makes sense to me. Is it fair, NO Is life fair? NO
Does it seem like Joe is getting the shaft, sort of. But He should have know what was going on, he should have done more. He's the head coach, he's their boss. They report to him.

I understand why he was fired. Just sucks, it would have been cool to see him continue to break records from the football side of it. But this is way WAY beyond football right now.

[ram29jackson]

this just in----

John Wooden was addicted to Maple bar donuts, sometimes eating 2 at a time.......the LA police force knew this and said nothing....its true......

[gigemaggs99]

I agree with a lot said here. It felt like ESPN was some new york house wives or MTV reality show last night. It felt like they just kept going on and on about the same stuff. I thought at some point....aren't they supposed to report sports?

I actually turned off NCAA 12 to see the end of the football game, then found it all blowing up and oh by the way the football game was moved to ESPNU tune in there to watch sports.

Then for them to keep going to the reporters in the riot, asking them, what do you see what do you see....it's a bunch of drunk kids or people standing around holding cell phones...what does this have to do with SPORTS?

comparing this Bobby Knight is a stretch. Like I said with the comparision to Tiger Woods, he did this with adults. When the Penn St story first broke I was asking my wife, why in the HELL can't a full grown man-football player keep some old coach off his ass in the showers????? Then the more I learned that it was not a player, not an adult, but a 10 year old boy! He had no chance.

He wasn't a player on Bobby Knights team that could quit playing, he wasn't an adult. Taking advantage of children and abusing your power is....I have no adjective. In the report where he promises kids they can be walk-ons at Penn State? That right there tells you of the abuse of power.

I don't know, this is just some sicko shit. I'm going to try and turn NCAA 12 back on and have "fun". This story is all over the news and it's all they are talking about on sports radio. It will be nice when justice is served and we can move on.

I'm not trying to pick fights with anyone here. I respect everyone's opinions and thoughts. I appreciate ya'll (Staff) here at TGT for giving us a forum to talk this stuff out. Sometimes people like me, we have to talk and talk and talk to help with the healing process. It's all just so strange to me.

Again, thanks to all for listening and keeping it civil. psusnoop, psuexv, ramjackson, steelerfan, and all those I failed to mention. Thanks for you perspectives and thoughts.

Oneback: FU....just kidding! I liked your "Aggie" :up: jab. I appreciate you taking my ideas with a grain of salt. I'm not saying I'm right, I'm not saying I'm wrong. I just need to talk to someone about this craziness. Lord knows I can't talk to my 3-year or 4-month old about it. Thank you sir, and Gig 'Em.

Hopefully the truth will come out soon and we can all move on to better things like good college football games.

I for one will be cheering for Penn St this weekend vs Neb.

[gigemaggs99]

ok, one last thing so I don't have to puke. I agree the news media makes things much worse than they need to. They just replayed the clip at Joe Pa's house last night, and the reporter asks, "What's this day been like for you?"

LOLLOLOLOLOLOOL

The next time someone witnesses a nuclear explosion or some sort of HUGE melt down, they should ask, "so did you see anything out of the oridinary?"

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOOL :sick:

[steelerfan]

Even the "fact" that it was a 10-year-old boy in the shower is speculation. He's never come forward and we don't know who it was. It is 99% likely that it was a child, sure, but what if someone comes forward and says, "it was me, I was 18, and I liked it"?

The point is, we don't know. Just like many of the other "facts", we don't know.

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[psuexv]

I agree, however the focus is on Joe because some of the incidents happened on campus and Joe is the face of Penn State to most outsiders and is being used as a stand-in for the University. It also doesn't help that he and Sandusky were close, not to implicate Joe in any wrong doing but the media/public latches on to that sort-of-thing.

Yes Joe is the face of the university and I agree as to why the media is all over him. But the university had a chance to step up and show everyone that Joe is not the face of the university, that this school is more than a football coach and they would rightfully get to the bottom of everything that happened. Instead they bought into it and tried to save face in the media eyes by removing Joe.

[JBHuskers]

Even the "fact" that it was a 10-year-old boy in the shower is speculation. He's never come forward and we don't know who it was. It is 99% likely that it was a child, sure, but what if someone comes forward and says, "it was me, I was 18, and I liked it"?

The point is, we don't know. Just like many of the other "facts", we don't know.

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And didn't they say the victim can't even speak now or something like that?

[bdoughty]

Okay so, Ashton Kutcher tweeted in outrage that Joe Pa was fired.

He didn't even know the story of what was going on :fp: :D

http://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1674104/joe-paterno-ashton-kutcher.jhtml

I swear someone should stick him in a room with Sandusky. Another Hollywood hypocrite.

[steelerfan]

And didn't they say the victim can't even speak now or something like that?

No. They don't know who that victim is at all.

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[bdoughty]

To quote Joe Paterno

In Hindsight, Maybe I Could Have Done More...

[steelerfan]

To quote Joe Paterno

In Hindsight, Maybe I Could Have Done More...

Doesn't make him responsible. It makes him remorseful.

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[psuexv]

It also doesn't help that he and Sandusky were close

Don't quote me on this but I've heard before that Joe and Sandusky did not get along.

[steelerfan]

Don't quote me on this but I've heard before that Joe and Sandusky did not get along.

Yep.

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[bdoughty]

They might not have been friends (??? Once again speculation, see how it works both ways) but it is mentioned often that Sandusky was the top guy in line to replace Paterno when he was to retire.

[bdoughty]

Doesn't make him responsible. It makes him remorseful.



To use your line, that is an ASSumption on your end. I doubt you have a direct line tied into Paterno's brainwaves. I simply made the quote with nothing attached to it.

[psuexv]

They might not have been friends (??? Once again speculation, see how it works both ways) but it is mentioned often that Sandusky was the top guy in line to replace Paterno when he was to retire.

I am speculating... like I said it is something that I've heard, hence the "don't quote me on this" (see how it works both ways :) )

[Oneback]

Yes Joe is the face of the university and I agree as to why the media is all over him. But the university had a chance to step up and show everyone that Joe is not the face of the university, that this school is more than a football coach and they would rightfully get to the bottom of everything that happened. Instead they bought into it and tried to save face in the media eyes by removing Joe.

If there is one thing I have learned in my soon to be 32 years, it's that most people make decisions to save face rather than make the right decision and therein lies the problem with this entire issue with regards to the Penn State involvement.

I really hope Joe Pa is able to get past this and continue on for many years, my biggest fear with a Joe Pa retirement has always been football is his life, he knows no other and much like Bear Bryant, I feared Joe would pass on shortly after his retirement. This isn't helping to ease any of those fears. Hopefully the game on Saturday will start the healing process and the media will move away from Joe's doorstep.

In the end Joe is suffering from those around him and the decisions they made, maybe even decisions he directed - I really hope he had very little involvement in the cover-up.

[Oneback]

Don't quote me on this but I've heard before that Joe and Sandusky did not get along.

That may have been the case in the end, but I doubt any head coach keeps anyone on a staff that they don't get a long with for 30 years. Think about it this way, that would be like being in a bad marriage for 30 years and not separating, however in the football world there aren't any ramifications of child support/alimony, etc.

[psuexv]

If there is one thing I have learned in my soon to be 32 years, it's that most people make decisions to save face rather than make the right decision and therein lies the problem with this entire issue with regards to the Penn State involvement.

I really hope Joe Pa is able to get past this and continue on for many years, my biggest fear with a Joe Pa retirement has always been football is his life, he knows no other and much like Bear Bryant, I feared Joe would pass on shortly after his retirement. This isn't helping to ease any of those fears. Hopefully the game on Saturday will start the healing process and the media will move away from Joe's doorstep.

In the end Joe is suffering from those around him and the decisions they made, maybe even decisions he directed - I really hope he had very little involvement in the cover-up.

:+1:

[psuexv]

That may have been the case in the end, but I doubt any head coach keeps anyone on a staff that they don't get a long with for 30 years. Think about it this way, that would be like being in a bad marriage for 30 years and not separating, however in the football world there aren't any ramifications of child support/alimony, etc.

Yeah like I said it was something that I heard, a couple of times. Never any details on when Joe and him started to not get along. Maybe it was after the alleged incidents and that was ultimately his cause for retirement. Maybe it was something that grew over the years. Maybe Joe knew he wouldn't retire for another 15 years and hated the fact that Jerry was licking his chops at his job. Who knows.

Unfortunately there are a number of people who stick out bad marriages.

[psuexv]

So I just got this email from the alumni list I'm on from the Interim President. The 2nd paragraph is such a contradiction to how they just acted.


A message from Interim Penn State President Rodney Erickson

This is one of the saddest weeks in the history of Penn State. It has been
difficult to comprehend the horrific nature of the allegations that were
revealed in the Attorney General's presentment last week. As a member of the
Penn State community for 34 years, as a parent, and as a grandfather, I find
the charges as they have been described to be devastating, and my heart goes
out to those who have been victimized and their families. This is a terrible
tragedy for everyone involved, and it will take some time to bring a measure
of understanding and resolution to the community.

In addition to the legal process under way, Penn State's Board of Trustees has
authorized a full investigation "...to determine what failures occurred, who
is responsible, and what measures are necessary to insure that this never
happens at our University again and that those responsible are held fully
accountable." As those involved pursue their cases, I also urge you, as Penn
Staters, to be patient, to avoid speculation, and to refrain from passing
judgment until the facts are known.

As you are now aware, the Board of Trustees has asked me to serve as the
interim president of Penn State effective immediately. I undertake these
duties with a firm sense of resolve, and I ask for your support as we move
forward. And move forward, we must and we will.

Penn State has a long and storied tradition that has endured for more than 150
years. Our roots are deep, our constitution is resilient, and the importance
of our work is as vital today as it was last week - perhaps even more so in
the face of such adversity. We are 96,000 students, 46,000 employees, and
more than a half a million alumni. We are 24 campuses across the Commonwealth
and a World Campus. We are a university that is committed to its core values
of honesty, integrity, and community. We are a university that will rebuild
the trust and confidence that so many people have had in us for so many
years.

Through your conduct every day, you can play a role in restoring the
integrity, honor, and pride that have always characterized Penn State. I share
your anger and sadness in this time, but always remember that your actions
reflect on the entire Penn State community. Please set an example that will
make us all proud. Moving forward is the only responsible course to take in
the coming months. I ask for the full support of our faculty, students, staff,
and alumni, and in return I will do my best to lead this institution through
the challenges ahead.

Thank you for being a part of Penn State.

[ram29jackson]

......I always liked Michigans helmets second to Penn States........

[bdoughty]

RUMOR WARNING - We will apparently find out of this is true in a day or two.

http://www.nesn.com/2011/11/jerry-sandusky-rumored-to-have-been-pimping-out-young-boys-to-rich-donors-says-mark-madden.html

I will use the only language I can -- that Jerry Sandusky and Second Mile were pimping out young boys to rich donors. That was being investigated by two prominent columnists even as I speak."

The other thing I think that may eventually become uncovered, and I talked about this in my original article back in April, is that I think they'll find out that Jerry Sandusky was told that he had to retire in exchange for a cover-up," Madden said. "If you look at the timeline, that makes perfect sense, doesn't it?

Again, this is the same guy who was far ahead of the curve writing a story on this in April.

[steelerfan]

Wow, Eric, that is deplorable. :fp:

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[JBHuskers]

Sandusky is going to turn into a verb in 2012.

[psusnoop]

That second paragraph is terrible.

[steelerfan]

To use your line, that is an ASSumption on your end. I doubt you have a direct line tied into Paterno's brainwaves. I simply made the quote with nothing attached to it.

Actually, it is a junior level mastery of the King's Language that brings me to that understanding. But, whatever. I'm glad you're enjoying the witch hunt, sir.

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[bdoughty]

Actually, it is a junior level mastery of the King's Language that brings me to that understanding. But, whatever. I'm glad you're enjoying the witch hunt, sir.


You go from Junior level mastery to sitting in the bench for referring to the King's English as the King's Language. No pudding for you.

[steelerfan]

You go from Junior level mastery to sitting in the bench for referring to the King's English as the King's Language. No pudding for you.

Apparently, you haven't reached a junior level understanding sarcasm. Keep your pudding.

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[gigemaggs99]

Yes, this is what Jim Rome was referring to today, He said it's rumored to get MUCH worse before it gets better....this is just so damn STRANGE.

[steelerfan]

Yes, this is what Jim Rome was referring to today, He said it's rumored to get MUCH worse before it gets better....this is just so damn STRANGE.

OMG! REALLY??

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[psusnoop]

http://abcnews.go.com/m/story?id=14925158

[ram29jackson]

Hail, Hail to Michigan ))))))))))):D

[steelerfan]

http://abcnews.go.com/m/story?id=14925158

Thanks for the link, snoop.

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[psusnoop]

Anytime just gathering information trying to sort through the BS.

I mean the story that Colin Cowherd reported today about Dan Conner who knew the back story of Sandusky and that is why he prank called him while at college here is so laughable. First Dan prank called Joe Sarra not Jerry Sandusky and he wasn't charged either Like Colin said. That is the crappy reporting being done by ESPN and many other networks which is brain washing the people not close to program to know the difference.

[Oneback]

Anytime just gathering information trying to sort through the BS.

I mean the story that Colin Cowherd reported today about Dan Conner who knew the back story of Sandusky and that is why he prank called him while at college here is so laughable. First Dan prank called Joe Sarra not Jerry Sandusky and he wasn't charged either Like Colin said. That is the crappy reporting being done by ESPN and many other networks which is brain washing the people not close to program to know the difference.

That's reporting now-a-days, it's not so much reporting as it is story making and running with the first lead you can find irregardless if its true or not. ESPN seems to be one of the best at this.

I honestly think the Paterno firing is a result of the school/athletic department jumping on a chance to move Joe out of office, which they've been trying to do for years. I still think he knew about the incidents prior to when he's letting on but those that he reported the incidents to should rot right next to Sandusky.

[Kwizzy]

I think joe pa & mcquery (sp?) will be lucky if they dont make then accessories to anything that happened after '02.

I agree with the media being overzealous and all that but if you filter out the irresponsible ones you still get to the same conclusion: joe pa & everyone else that had any idea need to be gone immediately.

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[steelerfan]

I honestly think the Paterno firing is a result of the school/athletic department jumping on a chance to move Joe out of office, which they've been trying to do for years.

Agreed.

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[cdj]

Some of the media has been terrible in covering this story.

Early in the week some were basically leading the charge in calling for heads to roll and TSN's Matt Hayes re-tweeted a message with the phone number for the PSU President's office. :fp:

Even if their point may be valid, the media has no business dictating actions or stories. Just cover it and report the facts.

[steelerfan]

Some of the media has been terrible in covering this story.

Early in the week some were basically leading the charge in calling for heads to roll and TSN's Matt Hayes re-tweeted a message with the phone number for the PSU President's office. :fp:

Even if their point may be valid, the media has no business dictating actions or stories. Just cover it and report the facts.

The media makes the news, they don't report it. That's exactly the problem. :(

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[Deuce]

The media makes the news, they don't report it. That's exactly the problem. :(

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:+1:


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[bdoughty]

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7215871/nebraska-cornhuskers-tom-osborne-asks-fans-not-wear-read-game-vs-penn-state-nittany-lions

Nebraska athletic director Tom Osborne feels certain his school's football traveling party and fans will be safe at Saturday's game at Penn State. Still, he thinks folks might want to keep their red Cornhuskers gear at home, or at least wear a different colored coat over it. "I just don't know if it's a good idea in this circumstance to stand out," Osborne said Thursday night.


Really, you are worried about that? I would leave the ten year old boys at home instead. Sandusky is free on bail last I checked.

[cdj]

I was at the 2002 NU-PSU game and that was the only bad experience I've ever had with a visiting fan base. Given how off the reservation some of the student body went after the firing of Paterno, I think extra security and then-some might be needed on Saturday. The one benefit is that the game is at 11 AM and students may not be too wound up yet. The interesting part is if they will take out frustrations on each other, anyone in the line of sight or if they will be reserved.

I should say that I don't think the majority of PSU fans are bad apples as all of the fans here are just fine. Though, it only takes a few to ruin it for everybody.

[psuexv]

I was at the 2002 NU-PSU game and that was the only bad experience I've ever had with a visiting fan base. Given how off the reservation some of the student body went after the firing of Paterno, I think extra security and then-some might be needed on Saturday. The one benefit is that the game is at 11 AM and students may not be too wound up yet. The interesting part is if they will take out frustrations on each other, anyone in the line of sight or if they will be reserved.

I should say that I don't think the majority of PSU fans are bad apples as all of the fans here are just fine. Though, it only takes a few to ruin it for everybody.

That's kind of crazy CDJ. Typically we here very good things about visiting fan's experiences. Obviously not every single fan up here is respectable and when you have drinking involved it can bring out the worst in people, sorry to hear they ruined your experience.

My only bad experience with visiting fans was in Columbus. I've given them the benefit of the doubt and did return and it was just as bad. 2 trips and will never go back. Every other school I've been to in the Big Ten has been awesome.

[psusnoop]

That is interesting CDJ, you need to tailgate with us. We will change your stance I hope on PSU and the fans.

[cdj]

That's kind of crazy CDJ. Typically we here very good things about visiting fan's experiences. Obviously not every single fan up here is respectable and when you have drinking involved it can bring out the worst in people, sorry to hear they ruined your experience.

I think drinking had a lot to do with it. I'm not sure of campus rules now, but that night the fence surrounding the stadium was just littered with beer cases, bottles, trash, etc. The theme for that game was some sort of retribution for 1994 (but they forgot that was payback for 1982 ;)) so the entire crowd was pretty wound up.

[psuexv]

I think drinking had a lot to do with it. I'm not sure of campus rules now, but that night the fence surrounding the stadium was just littered with beer cases, bottles, trash, etc. The theme for that game was some sort of retribution for 1994 (but they forgot that was payback for 1982 ;)) so the entire crowd was pretty wound up.

That was definitely a long day. Considering Snoop passed out in the doorway of the RV for about 4 hours and we just had to step over him, we had a good time :).

[JBHuskers]

That was definitely a long day. Considering Snoop passed out in the doorway of the RV for about 4 hours and we just had to step over him, we had a good time :).

You two are hopping in the RV next year right? We'll have to get 3 maybe 4 tickets together for that game.

[psuexv]

You two are hopping in the RV next year right? We'll have to get 3 maybe 4 tickets together for that game.

That's the plan as of right now. We took 8 to Alabama, I could see possibly 10 coming out to Nebraska. I mapped it awhile ago and it's 21 hour drive in the RV :smh:

[JBHuskers]

That's the plan as of right now. We took 8 to Alabama, I could see possibly 10 coming out to Nebraska. I mapped it awhile ago and it's 21 hour drive in the RV :smh:

Whoever is getting the tickets, I'll definitely get them back when you guys get here. I'll make sure I'm not DJ'ing that night, but we may have to make an appearance :nod:

[psusnoop]

Oh 21hrs is long time to get your ass handed to you in NCAA.

[psusnoop]

Man that was a really long day that day. I feel sorry for whoever cleaned up that RV bathroom, I swear someone was driving everytime I had to piss or puke. :D:D:D

[JBHuskers]

Oh 21hrs is long time to get your ass handed to you in NCAA.

You guys have a PS3 in the RV?

[psuexv]

You guys have a PS3 in the RV?

Hell yeah. It's a long drive. One dude has Slingbox so we watched NFL on the way home from Alabama.

[psuexv]

Whoever is getting the tickets, I'll definitely get them back when you guys get here. I'll make sure I'm not DJ'ing that night, but we may have to make an appearance :nod:

Ummmm, you're the Nebraska alum. I was really hoping you could hook us up with tickets.

[JBHuskers]

Ummmm, you're the Nebraska alum. I was really hoping you could hook us up with tickets.

:D yeah right, I haven't given them a dime since I graduated

[psuexv]

:D yeah right, I haven't given them a dime since I graduated

Work your connections.

[psuexv]

I told myself I wasn't going to read anything about the situation on Sandusky and wasn't going to comment but this article in my mind is complete and other crap. Stewart Mandel basically placing the blame for the whole thing squarely on Joe.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/stewart_mandel/11/11/penn-state-joe-paterno-culture/?xid=cnnbin


In 2000, the late Myles Brand made the controversial decision to oust revered Indiana basketball coach Bob Knight. Brand, then Indiana University's president, drew the scorn of students and alumni but the admiration of his peers, who named him NCAA president two years later.

If college athletics held its proper place in the greater landscape of higher education, there would have been no reason to congratulate or criticize Brand. In other walks of life, it's not considered courageous when the head of a business dismisses one of his subordinates for inappropriate behavior. The Brand-Knight incident was only jarring because for the previous 30 years, the power dynamic between Indiana's president and basketball coach had been reversed.

Nothing about college coaches' skewed importance has changed since then. If anything, it's gotten worse. Head football and basketball coaches now make as much as five times more than they did just a decade ago, and the media coverage surrounding them has amplified accordingly.

But if there were ever a time for fans, media members and college administrators alike to get a collective wake-up call, it's following Joe Paterno's dismissal. No football coach has ever lorded over an entire university the way Paterno did during his 45 years in State College. And no university has suffered a more gruesome football-related episode than the ongoing Jerry Sandusky child molestation scandal.

The mess at Penn State has illustrated the danger of putting successful coaches on pedestals. Four wins or 400, coaches are still people, and people aren't perfect. That's why our government employs a system of checks and balances, and why businesses nationwide mimic that distribution of power.

At Penn State, Paterno had all the power. President Graham Spanier and athletic director Tim Curley were technically his bosses, but they held as much sway over him as the guys selling hot dogs at Beaver Stadium on Saturdays. We know this most vividly because in 2004, Spanier and Curley tried to push out the struggling 77-year-old coach, and Paterno told them ... no.

That distorted dynamic is why Sandusky was allowed free rein of the Penn State football complex years after the first account of sexual molestation surfaced. Who was going to stop him if not Paterno?

Many think Mike McQueary should have. According to his grand jury testimony, McQueary, then a 28-year-old graduate assistant, witnessed Sandusky raping a boy estimated to be 10 years old in the locker room showers. How, people ask, could a grown man like McQueary fail to step in and stop this atrocity when he saw it? Why did he not call the authorities?

In McQueary's world, Paterno was The Authority. McQueary, a State College native, former Penn State quarterback and son of a huge Nittany Lions fan, has spent nearly his entire life in a warped world few of us understand. What some view as cowardice probably seemed courageous to McQueary at the time: He went to The Authority's house and relayed bad things about the coach's long-time trusted confidant. He didn't know The Authority would merely pass the information along to his two in-name-only superiors, who then failed to take substantive action.

What's far more puzzling is how McQueary went to work for the next nine years and accepted seeing Sandusky at practice or in the weight room. But the Penn State football complex wasn't a normal workplace; the lone Authority was out to lunch in his last years on the job, but he held such clout that few dared to question his actions. That's not an excuse for McQueary's decisions, but it's reality -- a sick reality in which inaction was the norm.

Paterno and his so-called bosses deserve all the blame we can muster for allowing this atrocity to occur, but the rest of us deserve blame for lionizing coaches like Paterno in the first place. We turn these mortal men into irreproachable icons. We do it with articles portraying them as something more mystical than people who happen to be good at their jobs. We do it by camping out for tickets in tent villages named in their honor. We do it by building statues of them while they're still on the job.

Few actually rise to the realm of idolatry, but any major college football or basketball coach who has sustained success enjoys unprecedented power. The truly revered have presidents and athletic directors who theoretically sit above them but in reality work for them. They enjoy blindly adoring fan bases that would raise arms at the mere suggestion of wrongdoing.

Sports are our escape, so it's not surprising that we treat our favorite figures like movie stars. But as we were reminded so painfully this week, this is real life. And unlike professional coaches, who work for businesses tasked solely with winning athletic contests, college coaches are theoretically part of a greater community, where education is supposed to trump entertainment and leadership is supposed to be more than a Big Ten Network infomercial.

There's nothing wrong with going to a game, painting your face or cheering on your favorite team's coach for hours. There's nothing wrong with me writing an article praising a coach for his inspired gameplan. There's nothing wrong with a school president giving a championship coach a raise.

But there's something inherently wrong with a community in which one person holds an inordinate amount of power. Teachers answer to their principal. CEOs answer to their shareholders. Mike McQueary answered to Joe Paterno.

Paterno didn't answer to anybody. No coach has ever experienced a more painful downfall, in part because no coach had ever been elevated to such heights.

Hopefully, no coach ever will be again.

[JBHuskers]

Work your connections.

Ummm, I really don't have any :D

[JBHuskers]

Just heard that someone threw a rock through Sandusky's window.

[psuexv]

Cider block actually, well pieces of it.

[steelerfan]

Just heard that someone threw a rock through Sandusky's window.

Too bad he wasn't home. He was off raping a little boy while the Lynch Mob, oops - media, stood outside Paterno's house.

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[JBHuskers]

Oops, double post :D

[steelerfan]

Oops, double post :D

Whore.

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[steelerfan]

Oops, double post :D

Oops.

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[steelerfan]

Oops, double post :D

Oops, triple post. :D

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[JBHuskers]

Whore.

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:nod:

I went back to this page and it looked like my last post wasn't posted....so yeah.

[steelerfan]

:nod:

I went back to this page and it looked like my last post wasn't posted....so yeah.

14000 posts and you expect us to believe you struggle with the interface? Yeah, right. :fp:

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[JBHuskers]

14000 posts and you expect us to believe you struggle with the interface? Yeah, right. :fp:

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Honest mistake :nod:

[steelerfan]

Honest mistake :nod:

:smh:

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[bdoughty]

Just heard that someone threw a rock through Sandusky's window.

Good for them, unfortunately it appears that some former Penn State players have their minds in an opposite direction.

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7220097/penn-state-nittany-lions-rally-program

Sending money to Sandusky for his defense.

[bdoughty]

http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/7221182/penn-state-nittany-lions-mike-mcqueary-placed-administrative-leave-interim-president-says

Mike McQueary on administrative leave

[DariusLock]

bdoughty is lovin this thread haha.

[psuexv]

Good for them, unfortunately it appears that some former Penn State players have their minds in an opposite direction.


Sending money to Sandusky for his defense.

Not saying I would send him money or think hes innocent. but they are right, everyone deserves their day in court. Innocent until proven guilty

[bdoughty]

Not saying I would send him money or think hes innocent. but they are right, everyone deserves their day in court. Innocent until proven guilty

Sure, everyone deserves their day in court. I just think there are few billion better things you can do with your money, then spend it on his defense fund. Maybe save that money, wait to hear the guilty verdict a couple dozen times and send the money to the victims.

[bdoughty]

bdoughty is lovin this thread haha.

Not as much as Sandusky



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rz346ZF0YLM

Edit: yes it is in poor taste but a creepy flashback.

[psuexv]

Sure, everyone deserves their day in court. I just think there are few billion better things you can do with your money, then spend it on his defense fund. Maybe save that money, wait to hear the guilty verdict a couple dozen times and send the money to the victims.

I don't disagree

[DariusLock]

That video is messed up. :fp:

[Deuce]

Quote from Franco Harris

"If I had to choose today between the moral integrity and character of Joe Paterno and the politicians and commentators criticizing him, I would pick Joe Paterno, hands-down, no contest every time."

Amen.


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[steelerfan]

Quote from Franco Harris

"If I had to choose today between the moral integrity and character of Joe Paterno and the politicians and commentators criticizing him, I would pick Joe Paterno, hands-down, no contest every time."

Amen.


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:+1:

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[jaymo76]

Heard on ESPN there was a bomb threat before the game...

[cdj]

Heard on ESPN there was a bomb threat before the game...

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/s720x720/380826_253235681392999_122977774418791_649519_8273 41894_n.jpg


I'm sorry, but I can't stand ESPN's coverage of this 'scandal.' It's like they are trying to be too somber and don't know how to address the firing of Paterno in addition. I understand it's something no one knows how to handle, but I just can't stand to watch ESPN outside of actual game action today.

[steelerfan]

http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/s720x720/380826_253235681392999_122977774418791_649519_8273 41894_n.jpg


I'm sorry, but I can't stand ESPN's coverage of this 'scandal.' It's like they are trying to be too somber and don't know how to address the firing of Paterno in addition. I understand it's something no one knows how to handle, but I just can't stand to watch ESPN outside of actual game action today.

Worldwide Leader in Hype.

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[cdj]

The 'updates' on movement and visitors at Paterno's house is too much as well.

[gigemaggs99]

I thought it was getting old how they kept comparing his house to a schrine. I understand he's a great football coach and all but putting him up there like he's some sun god or above HUMAN is a little much for me.

He is and was a very good coach. They made it sound like people were coming to his house to worship....kinda over board.

[bdoughty]

Back to Sanduscky, The Second Mile and an image that will make you sad.

http://deadspin.com/5859075/judge-who-set-unsecured-bail-for-jerry-sandusky-is-a-second-mile-volunteer

District Judge Leslie Dutchcot, however, ordered that Sandusky be freed on $100,000.00 unsecured bail. She ordered that Sandusky be freed and pay nothing unless he failed to show up for a court hearing.


Arial footage of Sanduskys house and how close it is located to the kiddies.

http://news.statecollege.com/images/930818_6922.jpg

[SmoothPancakes]

Good lord. I can't even watch the halftime show of the BGSU-Georgia basketball game without them talking about the whole Penn State/JoePa/people visiting JoePa's house to leave notes, flowers, and other shit" story. :fp:

[jaymo76]

Back to Sanduscky, The Second Mile and an image that will make you sad.

http://deadspin.com/5859075/judge-who-set-unsecured-bail-for-jerry-sandusky-is-a-second-mile-volunteer

District Judge Leslie Dutchcot, however, ordered that Sandusky be freed on $100,000.00 unsecured bail. She ordered that Sandusky be freed and pay nothing unless he failed to show up for a court hearing.


Arial footage of Sanduskys house and how close it is located to the kiddies.

http://news.statecollege.com/images/930818_6922.jpg

If that picture is real, it will give me nightmares and probably anyone else who has young children.

[bdoughty]

Oh it is all too real.

http://www.statecollege.com/news/local-news/sandusky-home-borders-elementaryschool-grounds-administrative-action-taken-930818/

You think that was a calculated move on Sanduskys end?

[psuexv]

What's crazy is it took the media a week to pick up on all of this because they were too busy with PSU and Joe.

The dude is definitely disturbed and is probably going away for a long time.

[steelerfan]

What's crazy is it took the media a week to pick up on all of this because they were too busy with PSU and Joe.

The dude is definitely disturbed and is probably going away for a long time.

:+1:

You should all type your addresses into your state's sex offender registry, if you never have. There are sick fuckers all around. :(

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[JBHuskers]

Good lord. I can't even watch the halftime show of the BGSU-Georgia basketball game without them talking about the whole Penn State/JoePa/people visiting JoePa's house to leave notes, flowers, and other shit" story. :fp:

Imagine the pre-game and halftime of PSU/Nebraska :fp:

I woke up a few minutes before the game to see Corso put on a tree or duck again or wherever they were. Instead we get this whole dramatic report like it was the day after 9/11.

[gigemaggs99]

Imagine the pre-game and halftime of PSU/Nebraska :fp:

I woke up a few minutes before the game to see Corso put on a tree or duck again or wherever they were. Instead we get this whole dramatic report like it was the day after 9/11.

Glad to know I wasn't the only one. We had just returned home from the Lowe's building project for kids. I flipped on the T.V. to see the end of gameday to see who Corso picked and they were showing that stuff...I was like DAMN I missed it!

[JBHuskers]

From MSNBC's Darren Rovell

The Second Mile, the Sandusky charity, had $1.22 million in contributions & grants in 2010, but filed LOSSES of $250K!