Gamespot's "On The Spot" with NCAA Football 12 - Video & Recap

[gschwendt]

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2522/5711042786_f6a10d5581_z.jpg

As part of the May 12 edition of GameSpot's "On The Spot" web program, the show featured a taped interview with NCAA Football 12 producer Ben Haumiller discussing the game and featuring some gameplay footage. To watch the video archive of the show, head over to GameSpot.com (http://www.gamespot.com/shows/on-the-spot/?event=on_the_spot20110512&tag=topslot;thumb;3) and continue on to read our show recap. After watching, share your thoughts with the community.



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LjXfiYA4gl4

Show recap:

- Ben Haumiller with host
- Wanted to add unique team elements, such as entrances in pre-game and also aspects during the game
- Oklahoma's Sooner Schooner entrance shown
- Enhanced Collision System discussed
- Oklahoma State (Alex Howell) at Oklahoma (CPU)
- GameTrack discussed. Can be very detailed or simple in telling game story
- 3D Grass and Crowd discussed
- HDR Lighting discussed
- Game in stores July 12 for 360 and PS3

[souljahbill]

They're talking about SMB3 now. Have they shown the NCAA footage yet?

[gschwendt]

They're talking about SMB3 now. Have they shown the NCAA footage yet?
Nope... they've made mention that it will be on the show but haven't actually shown anything.

[xMrHitStickx904]

started.

[xMrHitStickx904]

tackles look great. from how he's playing, he's making good reads, thus finding the holes.

[cdj]

Show recap:

- Ben Haumiller with host
- Wanted to add unique team elements, such as entrances in pre-game and also aspects during the game
- Oklahoma's Sooner Schooner entrance shown
- Enhanced Collision System discussed
- Oklahoma State (Alex Howell) at Oklahoma (CPU)
- GameTrack discussed. Can be very detailed or simple in telling game story
- 3D Grass and Crowd discussed
- HDR Lighting discussed
- Game in stores July 12 for 360 and PS3

[souljahbill]

It just ended. Not bad. :up:

[WolverineJay]

I tuned in just in time to see the touch pass over the LB on the 4 verts play that went for a TD. I'm 90% sure that LB would have broke that up or picked it off in NCAA 11.

[WolverineJay]

Also heard Ben say that even though they improved zone defense this year it isn't overpowered at all. Then he elaborated that there will be holes in the zone to allow an offense to still move the ball against zone D, which is all were asking for in the sim community.

[Jayrah]

Also heard Ben say that even though they improved zone defense this year it isn't overpowered at all. Then he elaborated that there will be holes in the zone to allow an offense to still move the ball against zone D, which is all were asking for in the sim community.

Not to be rude.... But Ben talking about the stuff means squat! Lol. Of course he'll talk it up! That being said, it looks like it will play the way they're describing. If it does and they don't tweak it to death after release for anything that's "too hard" I think this is the version I've been searching for since this gen released!

[WolverineJay]

Not to be rude.... But Ben talking about the stuff means squat! Lol. Of course he'll talk it up! That being said, it looks like it will play the way they're describing. If it does and they don't tweak it to death after release for anything that's "too hard" I think this is the version I've been searching for since this gen released!
LOL. You can be rude to Ben he said it not me, lol. I just reported what he said for those that didn't watch the show.

[Rudy]

Also heard Ben say that even though they improved zone defense this year it isn't overpowered at all. Then he elaborated that there will be holes in the zone to allow an offense to still move the ball against zone D, which is all were asking for in the sim community.

The OS preview on Madden felt the zone defence was a little too over powered. Still a little worried about it.

[WolverineJay]

The OS preview on Madden felt the zone defence was a little too over powered. Still a little worried about it.

I understand what everyone is saying and will withhold my personal judgement until I get my hands on the demo next month, but in the video the guy completed a 4 verts play for a TD versus a cover 2 zone. He hit the post route wr over the deep middle, which is a realistic hole in that zone defense so that was promising to see.

[xMrHitStickx904]

http://www.threadbombing.com/data/media/2/smack.gif


^ OS previews have let me down lately.

[JeffHCross]

The OS preview on Madden felt the zone defence was a little too over powered. Still a little worried about it.Trust me, we'll keep our eyes on it for you ;)

[Jaredlib]

Guys....uh hopefully someone can held me calm about this stuff but after watching that video I am VERY concerned.

The OSU guy hits the same post route twice in a row right before Ben specifically says something about the post route being stopped this year. Right after that you see the verticals play that looks exactly like it does against zone in NCAA 11 with the MLB getting no depth. Also the OSU QB scrambles twice and the defenders don't react all until he crosses the line of scrimmage.

On defense you see him call man coverage, control the LB who is manned up with the RB (who runs to the flats) and just abandons his coverage and blitzes, forcing an incomplete pass even though the RB is WIDE open.

The positive from the video is, just like the IGN vids, you see the computer running backs run the ball with authority, pulling off a nice spin in this one. Looked good.

I was really happy with what I saw in the IGN videos but this vid brought me way down. It looked like some cheese tactics will work just as well in 12 to, just being honest. I am gonna watch it again

[rhombic21]

Yeah, the video didn't look so great with respect to zone coverage against the skinny post or with respect to DL pass rush (which is developing as a trend). Again, the DL doesn't do a good job collapsing the pocket or maintaining rush lanes, and the second level defenders do a poor job reacting to the QB scramble.

One thing that also sticks out to me is that the computer does a HORRIBLE job with alignment issues. Virtually every play in the video they align with the strong side of the defense to the wrong side. For instance, they are often times in a Nickel package, but play it with the CB on the weak side with no slot receiver or tight end to cover. This leaves the LB on the other side with multiple receivers to cover, and is just poor in terms of football fundamentals. There's no point in playing nickel if you aren't going to put your 3rd CB over a receiver.

These are the AI things that EA needs to get right if offline play is ever going to be realistic. The computer just doesn't make intelligent decisions, whether you're talking about playcalling, utilizing substitution packages, or pre-snap adjustments.

[Jaredlib]

Can the community guys please look into this at the next event? I am begging you guys to look the devs in the eyes and tell them this stuff isn't right

[Jayrah]

Can the community guys please look into this at the next event? I am begging you guys to look the devs in the eyes and tell them this stuff isn't right

:D

You gotta think that was on Varsity Default settings. That was some crappy defense by the #1 squad in the land. Community guys have already said it's not that easy. I don't think there's anything to take out of the video.

[Rudy]

One thing that also sticks out to me is that the computer does a HORRIBLE job with alignment issues. Virtually every play in the video they align with the strong side of the defense to the wrong side. For instance, they are often times in a Nickel package, but play it with the CB on the weak side with no slot receiver or tight end to cover. This leaves the LB on the other side with multiple receivers to cover, and is just poor in terms of football fundamentals. There's no point in playing nickel if you aren't going to put your 3rd CB over a receiver.


This has always been a minor beef for me as a user as well. When I call nickel zone against a 3 WR set, I expect my nickel CB to line up against the slot WR. I shouldn't have to flip the formation every time to make this happen and it completely gives up the fact I'm playing zone. The same logic should apply to the cpu.

[Rudy]

If people want the Cover 2 zone to automatically be able to stop the skinny post and verticals, what type of offensive plays do you expect to actually be successful? You want the defense to flood the short zones and take away everything short and then still be able to stop all the deep stuff with only two safeties? I'll never gain a yard passing if the Cover 2 could do all that. My biggest problem with the Cover 2 was not being able to hit a quick go route about 20 yards downfield. If you throw it right you should be able to squeeze a pass in between the CB and Safety down the sideline but the super jump/swat always prevented that.

I think what most people would like to see is more variety in the defensive outcomes. We need some random blown coverages and some good and bad defensive plays with the same play calls. The skinny post should be available some times and not others just because a player may make a smart play once and a not so smart play the next time depending on his abilities.

[rhombic21]

If people want the Cover 2 zone to automatically be able to stop the skinny post and verticals, what type of offensive plays do you expect to actually be successful? You want the defense to flood the short zones and take away everything short and then still be able to stop all the deep stuff with only two safeties? I'll never gain a yard passing if the Cover 2 could do all that. My biggest problem with the Cover 2 was not being able to hit a quick go route about 20 yards downfield. If you throw it right you should be able to squeeze a pass in between the CB and Safety down the sideline but the super jump/swat always prevented that.

I think what most people would like to see is more variety in the defensive outcomes. We need some random blown coverages and some good and bad defensive plays with the same play calls. The skinny post should be available some times and not others just because a player may make a smart play once and a not so smart play the next time depending on his abilities.

Cover 2 is actually weak against short passes to the middle, but should not be weak to deeper passes. The Mike linebacker has responsibility to get depth against those routes, and the slot defenders (OLBs, nicklebacks) have responsibilities to wall off any skinny post and force it to bubble to the outside and deep.

There is some variety in cover 2 defenses, but it's safe to say that no zone defense is designed to leave a player wide open over the middle in the 15-25 yard area. That's one of the easiest throws for the QB to make and he will complete it for a big gain every time.

[Jaredlib]

Rudy,

I am not arguing your first point about right play, right time, I get that man. I know zone isn't supposed to shut down everything, but WATCH THAT DRIVE dude, it is seriously swiss cheese defense

I think think its strange that right off the bat we see 7 play drive that includes:

Shotgun run stuffed
Scramble up the middle
Two straight post routes
Vertical for TD
Scramble again for two point

Just being honest man....I LOVE THIS GAME, I can't wait for 12, but doesn't what I just describe sound like a familiar song?

It sounds like for zone to truly be effective they need to UP the pass rush in this game.

[Jaredlib]

:D

You gotta think that was on Varsity Default settings. That was some crappy defense by the #1 squad in the land. Community guys have already said it's not that easy. I don't think there's anything to take out of the video.

I didn't think about that, but you MUST be right....the all-american D in the IGN vids looked WAY better than the defense in the GS vid.....

[Koach Vonner]

I can't wait for this to take off. I wonder what was the thinking behind not adding short dreadlocks? I also really want them to get into some video where they show us the custom playbook and how to set it up. Not just the pics they have posted.

[Jayrah]

You can't just add short dreads. Gotta do short dreads, long tied dreads, long straight AJ Hawk hair, strait hair pony tails, Polynesian pony tails. I hear there was an issue with just getting dreads in the game without screwing up the player model. Maybe it took too long. Maybe they wanted to leave something in that area for next year. Either way, I'm satisfied for now. It gives at least some character to players outside of equipment.

[Solidice]

You can't just add short dreads. Gotta do short dreads, long tied dreads, long straight AJ Hawk hair, strait hair pony tails, Polynesian pony tails. I hear there was an issue with just getting dreads in the game without screwing up the player model. Maybe it took too long. Maybe they wanted to leave something in that area for next year. Either way, I'm satisfied for now. It gives at least some character to players outside of equipment.

from what I can tell, the dreads are not even part of the player model, they are just "attached" on, similar to the hand towel.

I still don't think the player models even have an actual head(just a helmet with a face in it), which is why you never see the players with their helmets off and why there is no option for any kind of hair.

[xGRIDIRONxGURUx]

best thing from this video for me...

174

i have been teaching stick concept this way for a while now... and it may be actually useful to have it in the game with the upgrades to zone... up until now i have just ran flood from a 3x set and hot route the deep out to a stop, and possibly smart route it if needed... this will be dandy to have in the game... glad they are finally catching on to some upgrades of these concepts...

"E"

[JeffHCross]

One thing that also sticks out to me is that the computer does a HORRIBLE job with alignment issues. Virtually every play in the video they align with the strong side of the defense to the wrong side.

This has always been a minor beef for me as a user as well. When I call nickel zone against a 3 WR set, I expect my nickel CB to line up against the slot WR. I shouldn't have to flip the formation every time to make this happen and it completely gives up the fact I'm playing zone.
Thinking out loud ... what's the solution to this? Have the game automatically flip your play for you? That's not always going to be what you want either. I agree with both of you that it's problematic that it gives away zone coverage, but I'm also not sure of an answer. When I call man coverage, I expect my defense to line up a certain way, and I expect the nickelback to move as appropriate. Because zone coverage (and alignment in general) is dependent on a strength call that is dynamic with the offensive formation, I'm not sure I want the game automatically deciding strength for me -- whether it's for Nickel, Under, Over, or any other adjustments along those lines.

I could see it being setup so that it's an option -- like Auto Pass and the others in the Profile -- but nothing more than that. Thoughts?

[xGRIDIRONxGURUx]

i would like to see a selection to turn it on or off for user, but would like to see it auto for CPU

"E"

[Rudy]

Thinking out loud ... what's the solution to this? Have the game automatically flip your play for you?

I could see it being setup so that it's an option -- like Auto Pass and the others in the Profile -- but nothing more than that. Thoughts?

Barring an option to turn it on or off I would like it to automatically flip for us. I do it 95% of the time. It's not a big deal playing against the cpu for me as I just flip it without any penalty. But it just doesn't seem right. I think most people would want the nickel CB on the side of the field that has the two WRs so this would be a good thing for most people. You know me though, I love options and sliders! And if you could send me a PM to let me know they added in game saves I will go freaking bananas!!

[Pokes404]

EA may be coming along with their passing game (tweaked trajectories, new zone AI, etc.), but they've got a long way to go with their OL/DL play. All day to throw, no push up front, static blocking, huge scrambling lanes up the middle, etc. Hopefully, a low difficulty setting (which this had to be played on) was the main problem. But in any case, the interactions still don't look very dynamic.

[Jayrah]

Thinking out loud ... what's the solution to this? Have the game automatically flip your play for you? That's not always going to be what you want either. I agree with both of you that it's problematic that it gives away zone coverage, but I'm also not sure of an answer. When I call man coverage, I expect my defense to line up a certain way, and I expect the nickelback to move as appropriate. Because zone coverage (and alignment in general) is dependent on a strength call that is dynamic with the offensive formation, I'm not sure I want the game automatically deciding strength for me -- whether it's for Nickel, Under, Over, or any other adjustments along those lines.

I could see it being setup so that it's an option -- like Auto Pass and the others in the Profile -- but nothing more than that. Thoughts?

I would think adding a strongside/weakside Nickel formation. Auto flip for whichever side the slot goes. The weakside gives you the option of putting that 3rd cb on the TE or RB.

[xMrHitStickx904]

the solution would be the man lock feature imo.

[rhombic21]

In real life teams align their defense based on the strength of the formation. If I were EA, I'd be starting there and thinking of ways to replicate the decision keys that real players use when determining where they should line up.

[ram29jackson]

ok, I know we are all talking zones here but I have to comment on the show itself haha.
From all their live streams or going on other shows...the other shows have that laid back slacker approach to them haha.

but this looked more like some conservative religious/ 8th grade private school type approach haha. Buttoned down, shirt collar, subdued conversation...minus the one beer comment haha

[Jayrah]

In real life teams align their defense based on the strength of the formation. If I were EA, I'd be starting there and thinking of ways to replicate the decision keys that real players use when determining where they should line up.

This is why I think the weakside/strongside approach would work. You don't even have to make a formation for it, just make it an option in the package menu so that your 3rd cb lines up where you want him on any specific play.

[JeffHCross]

In real life teams align their defense based on the strength of the formation. If I were EA, I'd be starting there and thinking of ways to replicate the decision keys that real players use when determining where they should line up.Yes, but that strength doesn't always mean the two target side, or the slot receiver side. Some teams (and coaches) call strength to the wide side of the field, for example. Other teams declare formations "balanced" in different ways.

Anyway, my primary point is that there's no 100% right answer. There are times you would want it to automatically flip. There are others you wouldn't. Hence my question.


the solution would be the man lock feature imo.Man Lock is automatically on, but it only applies to zone. I assume you're meaning that it should automatically apply to zone and autoflip, then?


This is why I think the weakside/strongside approach would work. You don't even have to make a formation for it, just make it an option in the package menu so that your 3rd cb lines up where you want him on any specific play.This might work. Or have it be on the "Gameplan" screen.

[xMrHitStickx904]

Yes, but that strength doesn't always mean the two target side, or the slot receiver side. Some teams (and coaches) call strength to the wide side of the field, for example. Other teams declare formations "balanced" in different ways.

Anyway, my primary point is that there's no 100% right answer. There are times you would want it to automatically flip. There are others you wouldn't. Hence my question.

Man Lock is automatically on, but it only applies to zone. I assume you're meaning that it should automatically apply to zone and autoflip, then?

This might work. Or have it be on the "Gameplan" screen.


What I mean is that having the option to turn it off. On PS2 Madden (hate to keep referencing that) , the Man Lock feature could be turned on and off, so alignment in the nickle would be perfect when turned off, this also meant that nobody on defense moved when players were motioned, and flipping the defensive play would not be noticed. It took away all quick passes, and made offense v defense a chess match cause you couldn't tell if your opponent played man or not.

[gschwendt]

What I mean is that having the option to turn it off. On PS2 Madden (hate to keep referencing that) , the Man Lock feature could be turned on and off, so alignment in the nickle would be perfect when turned off, this also meant that nobody on defense moved when players were motioned, and flipping the defensive play would not be noticed. It took away all quick passes, and made offense v defense a chess match cause you couldn't tell if your opponent played man or not.
On a per play basis... you can actually turn it on/off. There's not a global setting to apply every time but as your team comes out of the huddle, you hit Triangle and then right stick right (I think) and it will turn it off. Not certain how it works when you're in Nickel and they're in a Slot or Y-Trips as to whether they come across the formation, etc.

[JeffHCross]

What I mean is that having the option to turn it off.Gotcha. That would at least make it consistent between man and zone. Certainly an option.

[Cipher 8]

Also heard Ben say that even though they improved zone defense this year it isn't overpowered at all. Then he elaborated that there will be holes in the zone to allow an offense to still move the ball against zone D, which is all were asking for in the sim community.Not to be rude.... But Ben talking about the stuff means squat! Lol. Of course he'll talk it up! That being said, it looks like it will play the way they're describing. If it does and they don't tweak it to death after release for anything that's "too hard" I think this is the version I've been searching for since this gen released!

I agree. Of course the video's and trailers they've shown showcase the great zone coverage but in the live gameplay footage I've seen I think WolverineJay has a point. There were holes in the coverage and the offense moved down the field just fine.

I think it's just going to make them play their zones better, actually pick up and pass on players who enter it, but if you put some touch on your passes, lead them to open areas, and find the holes in the coverage you'll be able to pass on the zone just fine. It'll just take more work or effort on your part which is all I ever really wanted in the game as far as zone coverage. Not overpowered or unstoppable.

[Rudy]

The one thing I have going for me is that while I'm not a great passer, I never took advantage of the flats. My game probably won't change much lol.

[JeffHCross]

It's worth saying that an open man is still an open man. And there will still be routes that get open against Coverage A, and there will still be routes that get open versus Coverage B. That's how real life is, and the game is getting closer to that. The primary difference, in terms of pass defense, between NCAA 11 and NCAA 12, is you will no longer be resigning yourself to certain types and yards of gains with zone defense. There will be no more "Oh, he called zone, this will be easy" types of attitudes.

I'm not saying holes won't still exist and the guys who are much better than I on the sticks won't be able to find plays that are "money" against certain coverages or even zone coverage in general -- I'm sure that will still be the case. But the pass defense on the whole will be improved. In the end, I think that counts for a hell of a lot.

[jaymo76]

The one thing I have going for me is that while I'm not a great passer, I never took advantage of the flats. My game probably won't change much lol.

I'm just thinking about the hours of time you, me, and a dozen or so other people on this stie will be putting in tp cpu defense sliders...:fp: Oh well I still looking forward to it nonetheless.

[jaymo76]

Just watched that clip again... everyone has talked about how many more stat overlays will be provided in game. Based on all the gameplay so far I think we have seen less that NCAA 11. Are the developers saving examples of these for another blog???

Plus, the interviewer said "demo" in his closing statements. Was that a slip-up acknowlegement that this will be one of the two demo matchups???

[JeffHCross]

Plus, the interviewer said "demo" in his closing statements. Was that a slip-up acknowlegement that this will be one of the two demo matchups???He meant "demonstration". Which is what demo is short for ;) No connection to the demo that will be released for the game.

[WolverineJay]

After re-watching the video today something Ben said about the new tackle button has me a little concerned. Ben stated that we can hit the new tackle button even if we aren't that close to the player and the defender will still attempt to bring the ball carrier down. My question to the CD guys is this over done when it comes to diving tackles from behind? In other words does the new tackle button automatically generate a diving tackle animation even when the ball carrier has a 3 yard lead on a defender? Will it be absolutely necessary for the offensive guy to do a high step to avoid being tackled every single time or will the defender just continue to do a face plant dive like in NCAA 11?

[cdj]

Jay, I prefer to use the Hit Stick and that's a tough habit to break, but I did try and incorporate the Tackle button more. I felt that if I did it too far away the defender would fall on his face. When in close proximity, I felt it was effective but not 100% lockdown. Based on playing at previous events, I don't feel like it can be readily abused in any fashion.

[Paakaa10]

After re-watching the video today something Ben said about the new tackle button has me a little concerned. Ben stated that we can hit the new tackle button even if we aren't that close to the player and the defender will still attempt to bring the ball carrier down. My question to the CD guys is this over done when it comes to diving tackles from behind? In other words does the new tackle button automatically generate a diving tackle animation even when the ball carrier has a 3 yard lead on a defender? Will it be absolutely necessary for the offensive guy to do a high step to avoid being tackled every single time or will the defender just continue to do a face plant dive like in NCAA 11?

Jay, I prefer to use the Hit Stick and that's a tough habit to break, but I did try and incorporate the Tackle button more. I felt that if I did it too far away the defender would fall on his face. When in close proximity, I felt it was effective but not 100% lockdown. Based on playing at previous events, I don't feel like it can be readily abused in any fashion.

I'll echo what cdj said here about the tackle button not easily being abused as we've seen it at the Community Events so far.

In NCAA Football 11, it was very easy for me to rely solely on using the "Hit Stick" on defense because of how much warping could occur on a tackle; it didn't matter if I was a little bit out of position because the tackle animation would often cover that distance for me.

In what we've seen of NCAA Football 12 so far, those types of "gimme tackles" are pretty well gone. Using the "Hit Stick" as your only tackle attempt on defense is going to end up hurting you a lot more this year than it did last year. That said, the "wrap" tackle isn't a 100%-effective option; it all depends on the circumstances. Lining up the ball carrier and making a "wrap" tackle definitely has a higher chance of success and a lower risk than blindly "Hit Stick"-ing, for sure.

With regards to Ben's statement that the defender will still attempt to bring the ball carrier down, regardless of distance, this is true; but what he means is that the defensive player you control will go into the "wrap" animation when you push that button. If the ball carrier is nowhere near, then your defender isn't going to warp over to him; your defender is just going to look off-balanced and ridiculous tackling the air on the replay.

As for when you try to do a "wrap" tackle once a ball carrier gets past you; it depends on how fast your defender is compared to the offensive player. If you have a slow defender and you've been burned, you can try the "wrap" tackle all you want but you will likely just flail behind the runner.

[WolverineJay]

Thanks cdj and Paakaa10 thats what I needed to here. I just had images of NFL Blitz and Tecmo Bowl dives bringing down ball carriers 5 yards ahead of them, lol.

[JeffHCross]

I had one play during the Community Day events where I felt it was a little Blitz-like. I was chasing a scrambling QB and caught him near the sidelines. It wasn't from behind, rather he was running parallel to the Line of Scrimmage and I was coming from the DL. My opponent and I looked at it a couple times, and we concluded that the only reason it looked bad is because he went from a full run to a full stop because he got near the sideline. So the rate of closure was just high.

I certainly don't feel like the tackle button is anything like Blitz or Tecmo, in general.